Has the angle gear been out because these seals tend to get lipped when putting back together

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Has the angle gear been out because these seals tend to get lipped when putting back together

Yes, it has. Which seal(s) cause the issue in your experience?

It is very unlikely that they could have damaged those two seals unless they tried to remove the collar. I had this happen to my v50 about 3 months ago. No issues, and then bam all the fluid puked out the bottom, just like your picture. I thought my collar would be okay too, but once I got in there the splines were beginning to strip. I had to use a slide hammer and vice grips to get the old collar off the transmission (it's a crazy tight fit).

When you say "those two seals", do you mean #21 and #23 from the transmission diagram? I'm inclined to agree with you. They wouldn't have done anything unnecessary - they just removed it to get access to try to weld on a nut to a snapped exhaust stud (long story). It seems like fluid is also getting pushed out closer to the top of the AG - I'd guess fluid is getting on the collar sleeve and is being flung outward.

This is our only vehicle, so I want to have everything necessary to do the job all at once. I'm sure at 210,000km there sleeve could be functional but well worn, and if it has to be removed to get to some key seals then I'm not totally averse to replacing it prematurely.

 

It is very unlikely that they could have damaged those two seals unless they tried to remove the collar. I had this happen to my v50 about 3 months ago. No issues, and then bam all the fluid puked out the bottom, just like your picture. I thought my collar would be okay too, but once I got in there the splines were beginning to strip. I had to use a slide hammer and vice grips to get the old collar off the transmission (it's a crazy tight fit).

 

It's usually the seal on the trans side.

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It's usually the seal on the trans side.

Thanks - would that be #22 in the transmission diagram?

 

I can confirm the angle gear collar is still epoxied to the transmission output shaft even in P1s. I stripped my collar recently, and removal was a pain in the butt.

The epoxy used starts to break down around 300 degrees Fahrenheit, so since I was replacing the transmission seal anyway, I hit my old angle gear collar with a torch until the whole collar was over that temperature.

After that, it came right off.

Press in new seals, and installation is the reverse of removal.

Volvo kit 31437983 comes with a new collar, angle gear bolts, and seals. Here you can see the big seal around the collar (red) and the small seal on the inside of the trans output shaft (blue).

 

They EPOXIED THAT THING?!!?!??!!

 

Thanks for the input. Based on your experience, do you think the seals you pointed to with red and blue arrows could be replaced without removing the collar sleeve? I think those are the black seals in the kit, and the green o-ring seals at the end of the collar sleeve, right? I'm betting the issue is on the angle gear side, but if it's not too difficult I coul try doing those while I'm at it.


They sure did. I think it's to ensure it doesn't come out with the angle gear when it's removed.

 

Here's a photo I've shamelessly stolen from a Google search of new seals (including the green seal) pressed in to their appropriate positions on the transmission side. I unfortunately don't see a way the inner seal can be pressed flush with the output shaft with the angle gear collar in situ.

 

Thanks for the tips, guys. I have a feeling it's seal #24 on the angle gear that was lipped/pinched, so I'll start with the angle gear side and remove/replace the collar sleeve and transmission-side seals if it comes to it.

Funilly, I don't see #24 listed in any parts lists - I'll check VIDA to see if I can find the part number.

 

VIDA has grayed out some parts in the diagram including #24 - not sure if #24 in the AG diagram is the same as #22 in the transmission diagram. Either way, looksl like I can only replace #2 on the AG side.

 

I dunno, if I were you I'd just do the whole enchilada (angle gear collar and transmission-side seals), while you have the axle and angle gear out of the way anyway. MTF is so hard to distinguish from regular gear oil, and you'll be kicking yourself if you replace just the angle gear seals and are still dripping fluid. Just go in with a torch, grinder, and beefy 3-jaw puller. The job is unpleasant, but doesn't take very long if you come prepared.

 

You're probably right - bite the $200 bullet and just get it all done at once.

How hard is the collar sleeve's metal? Could I drill through it with titanium-coated drill bits? I don' thave an angle grinder to create holds for the puller.

 

Definitely not THAT hard, which is probably a factor in their basically being a wear item I'm sure you could drill 3 holes for a puller.

 

I hate to say this in case you didn't know @taloras there's an upgraded collar you can buy. It's pricey but it's made from better steel and is more precise than the oem unit. Sadly, it is $800 by itself however.

I plan on swapping out my old angle gear with a new one (low mileage, rebuilt, etc), crack it open and put a drain plug in it before install, so I can be sure it's rock solid and won't go bad.

 

I'm aware of the upgraded collar with the OE collar running for ~$120, I'm not sure I'm going to break six collars in my entire ownership of the car to make it worth it...especially now that I've done one replacement (the FIRST replacement at 180k miles) and the collar is no longer epoxied in place, making future replacements about an hour's work of pulling the axle, bearing carrier, propshaft bolts, and angle gear bolts.

 

Replacement collars are supposed to have a grease applied to them - it's listed in the catalog with the collar - 1161748

Personally I've never seen a collar with any epoxy, which is not to say they will not come off with out a puller or air chisel

no practical way to replace those seals with the collar in place.

when you get the collar off, you need to make sure the splines on the diff are still 'square' - if they are pointed, your diff is also ****ed

I would also stick with the Volvo coupler - I used the aftermarket $$$ one on my old Volvo, but that was 500AWHP / M66 - once it's hammered on it's NEVER coming off again

I always put Posi's in my M66's - so I just do all this crap while it's out & be done with it

 

Personally I've never seen a collar with any epoxy, which is not to say they will not come off with out a puller or air chisel

I am pretty darned sure they're epoxied from the factory.

The gunk in the grooves isn't grease or rust: it's hard, shiny, and brittle.

 

False alarm! I kept looking further and further up, and finally had a chance to take out the battery tray. It looks like it is an oil leak either coming from the cam cover or the exhaust cam plug. There are enough wires and brackets in the way that I can't pinpoint it exactly until I have more time. At least I have the peace of mind knowing my angle gear or transmission won't run dry. The amount leaking is minute relative to the oil capacity. In my last 10,000km (6,200 mile) oil change interval the oil loss didn't even register on the dipstick.

Thanks for all the tips, though, folks! That may come in handy in the future, although I certainly hope it won't!

 

I think (hope) this is the source of the oil leak. There was a burr on the cam cover that must have cut into the cam plug. I did my best to very carefuly file it away, but unfortunately the replacement seems like it may have done the same thing (looks like the plug/seal iss slightly lipped from what I can see). It appears to be holding up after an aggressive drive around the block, but time will tell. Note the photo of the plug in-situ is before replacing, but it looks somewhat similar now, but not quite as bad.