It sounds like a good deal and a good car tbh. Do you have the link to it? If reliability is the most important thing to her or you guys then a Volvo is definitely the right choice. When properly maintained they can literally run forever. The dependability is unmatched imo. Offer them 16,500$ and see what they say. I think it would be a great car. 2017 is a pretty good year.

There is not really anything bad I can say about these. Just make sure the timing belt has been done and a few other things and it should be good to go. It's a beautiful, safe and reliable car that just makes common sense. Volvo is the car you buy if you don't want a lot of problems in your life. It's one of the default dependable cars. They are fun to drive. It's a car that does just about everything and it does all of it really well. The safety features are awesome. I have had all kinds of animals run in front of my car and when you get on the brakes they are right there all of that stuff. The safety features just work incredibly well on these cars. It's a great car in all honesty. I really can't recommend them enough.

 

A '17 S60 would be a great student car, just realize that it will cost more to keep on the road than a Toyota or Honda, but still a very nice car. My kids learned to drive on a much older Volvo that I didn't feel too bad about if got a scratch or a ding, usually from other kids in the high school parking lot.

As for pricing, check out the valuation tools on kbb, edmunds, etc. $18k for that car comes in right at the fair price range per kbb but I tend to shoot for trade in value when I'm buying a used car. That said, the market has changed a lot since I was buying used cars.

 

If you know your daughter and believe she is ready to have the keys to a turbocharged executive sport sedan that requires the additional care of a feature rich "soft" car, then I would say this is a great year to buy for that driveline (basically the oldest you can go without ring problems, which is desirable from a state registration cost perspective most places) and with such low mileage she could probably drive it for the next 10+ years through college and beyond with minimal trouble.

That said...

As a young adult, likely to move several times in the next few years, and likely to be helping friends move around, and needing to buy furniture or other items for a college dorm or first apartment, a mid-size sedan is not a practical utility oriented car. Most young adults and/or pre-adults would be better served in their early years by a vehicle that sits up higher (easier to see around in traffic), has less engine power (less likely to get out of control), and has more of a SUV/Wagon shape for utility purposes. The sport sedan is the 2nd car you buy for commuting later in life when you already have a utility vehicle and want something fun/fast/economy.

I would be looking at 4 cylinder naturally aspirated RAV4, CRV, Santa Fe, Tucson, Forester, Outback, older Ford Escape..

 

If you know your daughter and believe she is ready to have the keys to a turbocharged executive sport sedan that requires the additional care of a feature rich "soft" car, then I would say this is a great year to buy for that driveline (basically the oldest you can go without ring problems, which is desirable from a state registration cost perspective most places) and with such low mileage she could probably drive it for the next 10+ years through college and beyond with minimal trouble.

That said...

As a young adult, likely to move several times in the next few years, and likely to be helping friends move around, and needing to buy furniture or other items for a college dorm or first apartment, a mid-size sedan is not a practical utility oriented car. Most young adults and/or pre-adults would be better served in their early years by a vehicle that sits up higher (easier to see around in traffic), has less engine power (less likely to get out of control), and has more of a SUV/Wagon shape for utility purposes. The sport sedan is the 2nd car you buy for commuting later in life when you already have a utility vehicle and want something fun/fast/economy.

I would be looking at 4 cylinder naturally aspirated RAV4, CRV, Santa Fe, Tucson, Forester, Outback, older Ford Escape..

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Unfortunately you've recommended to viciously unreliable, underpowered vehicles. I know somebody who has had both an Escape and a Tucson and both have been nightmares.

There is definitely something to be said for a Volvo as a first car. A Volvo's sturdiness, responsive handling, and reserve power can make a huge difference for any driver. If you want something bigger and more practical, an XC60 3.2 or T6 is the way to go. The XC70 T6 is also a great choice, but highly-sought-after and thus more expensive. Don't overlook the S80 T6 either. They're thinner on the ground, but older models with low mileage can be had for a good deal.

 

I agree wagons can come in handy. I would look at some of those too but you have to be careful on the years and the engines if you are looking before 2017.

If she isn't that big into cars really and just wants something where she doesn't have to worry about where she parks etc. I agree with @AllanM. However I would stick to the Hondas and Toyotas if that's what she wants. You have to be careful with some of the Fords they can get pretty expensive if you aren't careful and some of the Hyundais can have issues too.

Honestly some people just want a Toyota RAV4 or Camry, nothing more and nothing less. They just want the bare basic model sometimes and I can respect that opinion too. Everyone has a different group of vehicles that works for them. For me it's a lot of fully depreciated MB's and Volvo but that's because I can often find the parts for a good deal and I find MB to be the easiest car I have ever worked on. I like cars too yes but those ones also just fit into my life. That's what she needs to find out. Only really she can answer that question. Everyone has different opinions and has different needs. So that side can be harder to answer.

That Volvo imo or a wagon is one of the best cars to buy and the most reliable but that doesn't mean anything if it's not for her or doesn't fit into her life. That's why there are so many different cars to choose from.

 

Not sure how I missed this post last night. I would say, go for it. 2017 is a good year. Three or four girls in my grade had S60s as first cars (in varying conditions), and they were all happy with them, as far as I know. I ended up buying my S60 from one of them!

 

There is also the E Class wagon that I would see if she is interested in. These have also come down in price, some around 10-13k even. I like it in the fact that it's going to be a little bit easier to work on than the Volvo. It's a very nice, quiet and comfortable car. It's also very safe like the Volvo too. The XC70 is another good option too like @BenjaminD said.

An Acura TSX wagon could be a good one too possibly. My roommate swears by Honda and I like some of their cars too. I also like Saabs like the 9-5 but you have to be careful with those because many have been neglected but in the right hands those can also be good cars. The iron block engine is a very tough engine. Transmissions can be more delicate on those though.

There is a lot of good cars. I would take her to go look at some. Who knows it might not be into any of these. She might want a camper vehicle like a Mercedes-Benz Sprinter van or something. Those can be sweet too. Almost like a hotel but with wheels on it! It might be more expensive but if she can save on housing costs, shoot why not? There is a lot to consider. I hope you are giving yourselves enough time. Don't rush.

 

One thing, and this isn't just because I'm in sales, but if they don't even consider your offer serious don't be offended. I'm sure some places mark their cars up and then work down, but lots of places still are stuck with increased costs of used cars and pricing to market and not moving on price. We're selling just about every used car for what it's listed out with a few exceptions for a referral or something like that. The market is still tight. Never hurts to ask for a discount, just don't expect one. I can't speak to the value without more info. KBB isn't the end all be all.. but a no option FWD T5 Inscription with no options shows fair price of $18,300 to me.... If I had a car listed for $18k and got a $16,500 offer online, I'd sent a short "no thank you" email and nothing more, and have a decent chance the car sold before you had a chance to call in. No harm in asking for a discount, just I wouldn't make it a sticking point if you like the car.

Sedans are where the value is though. Everyone thinks you need a SUV.

 

They shouldn't be that bad for reliability but I am not sure if I would put them in the same category of reliability or say that they are more reliable than Volvo or Toyota or Honda or MB, despite some of the issues some of those brands have had. Volvo is a solid car. The difference with the Volvo is often times the longevity (which I consider to be reliability too). They are built to go for very high miles if maintained right and they are built like tanks. They are some of the most reliable cars you can buy in all honesty imo. However that is what I feel comfortable with owning. There is no 'one size fits all.'

If she is not going to drive it long enough to really take advantage of that and the Escape can be had for a really good price (it's all about the price) then that could work too. 2.5 is reliable as far as I know. I believe it was similar to the Mazda engine right? 12k? idk that might be pushing it for that car.

Idk if it were me and I didn't like or possibly knowing anything about cars at all let's say or didn't want anything premium really at all and I just wanted something to get me form point A to B with decent safety and good reliability. Then if I were her in her shoes I would probably just get a base Camry or the Accord if I maybe wanted something a bit nicer.

There is a population of people out there in this world were that is all they want. They don't care about cars, they don't want to have to worry about where they park and they don't want anything premium at all. Yes it's hard for some of us to understand but that's the case a lot of times.

Sometimes what we want to buy isn't the same car as other people want to buy. There are some people if you can believe it or not who hate cars in general and just see them as a necessary evil. They purposely buy more basic cars.

To add further more I have known guys in high school who have owned Range Rovers, BMW's, Saabs and some of them didn't even want them. They wanted a Toyota Corolla or something but their parents would sometimes insist that's what they got because it was a hand me down or something. They said to them to that they didn't really want those cars because they didn't know how to work on them, they were often times not too familiar with them and tbh I thought it was kind of rude because it was almost like some of these parents were forcing their beliefs on their own kids. It is often times not even the kids who want some of these cars. It would be like if someone tried to insistently talk me into buying an old Civic and I had money and everything. I have seen parents do that sometimes before often times for a status they are trying to convey (I am not saying OP is trying to do this at all) but they over talk everyone and I frankly have just found it to be totally obnoxious and rude.

And it sucks too because since they are not familiar with the car and said 'no, I want something simpler.' The car will often fall out of repair and cost them time from school and all kinds of stuff, all because it wasn't a car they wanted or were even familiar with. And it became a point of friction sometimes. It didn't make any sense. So I also see it from that side too.

 

People come from different walks of life and economic backgrounds. My personal opinion is that a 2017 S60 is a lot of car for a brand new driver. It's also a pretty quick car for a new driver -- which can get them into trouble depending on their level of skill and responsibility.

Maybe it's because I grew up driving ancient Volvo 140s and 240s, and have always driven cars that were at least 9-10 years old, but if it were me I would consider putting her in something older, but still safe, to learn on.

But then again, I had reservations about putting my daughter in a cherry 2006 S60 2.5T that only had 67,000 miles on it and not a speck of rust. But she's been amazingly good with it now for almost 3 years. And I'm glad she has it. It's old, but it looks almost new, has decent performance, still very safe, and is reliable with Dad taking care of it. It's nicer than most of the newer cars her friends drive.

 

People overhype the power thing for highways and on ramps. Power is totally not a need to safely merge. Everyone drives around in 10 second 0-60 MPH Subarus (including me in my old '05 Outback tank and slow Forester Wilderness) around here on I-95 and short on-ramps in Philly metro area and they're doing just fine.

Just don't be an asshat and no one dies.

My personal opinion is that a 2017 S60 is a lot of car for a brand new driver. It's also a pretty quick car for a new driver -- which can get them into trouble depending on their level of skill and responsibility.

Agreed.

 

Ya idk OP. I would ask your daughter first and see where she is on all this. I know you probably want to do a surprise or something but buying a car is a really personal/big purchase and Idk if it's the best thing to spring someone with. I know you are trying to be nice but in my experience you have to be really careful with stuff like that. She would probably love the car but what if she doesn't? What if she already has a plan made? Then what? She will then probably never say anything. That can make for a pretty awkward dinner conversation.. It's probably not something that I would personally do (on any car) but to each their own. The car in itself is a good vehicle though so don't get me wrong.

 

I'm just going to assume you know your own daughter's preferences, driving ability, personal responsibility and gratitude level better than me or anyone else on this forum.

If safety* and reliability** are your primary concern, then yes a 2017 S60 would be a good choice. Mid 2016 and later had the piston ring (oil burning) issue resolved from the factory. The only other potentially expensive quirk of the Drive E Volvos that I am aware of is the possibility of a faulty thermostat frying the ECM, necessitating replacement. I am not sure how common this is, but it seems highly probable that IF the electronic thermostat fails and is not replaced quickly, it WILL take out the ECM eventually.

* A note on safety. Mass matters. Crash tests are usually done by slamming a car into a stationary "immovable" object and assessing accelerations (g-loads) experienced by a crash test dummy. This type of test inherently assumes any type of collision with another vehicle will be with a vehicle of equal size and mass traveling at roughly the same speed but opposite direction. In the real world if you have two cars with similar safety ratings get into a head on collision, and one vehicle weighs 1000 lbs. more than the other, the heavier vehicle will fare better. So there is something to be said about a larger SUV feeling safer. Not to mention bumper and seat height compared to, say, the height of a tractor trailer... On the flip side (pun intended) when it comes to accident avoidance a lighter, lower, more nimble vehicle will be a whole lot easier to swerve around a deer, vehicle, pedestrian, without the risk of putting asphalt scratches on the roof.

** With all cars, but especially euro cars, reliability is dependent upon proper maintenance. Cost of maintenance can potentially be higher on a Volvo than more common (higher volume) manufacturers. Something you are likely aware of, being a current Volvo owner.

 

As to an S60 T5 being too powerful, OP knows his kid better than any of us do.

My kids are probably better and safer drivers than I was at their age, at least I know was in more accidents when I was young. Now young adults, they've never put so much as a scratch in any of their cars. I think I did more damage to my P2R than my son did while he was commuting to high school in it for two years. It all depends on the driver.

 

Depending on where you live power is a huge safety feature. I live where interstate driving is a must, and the on ramps are too short and traffic is too heavy for a new timid driver with a 240... you'd get run over. Granted, you'd be okay as the vehicle that hit you crumples on impact, but it's even better to not be in the accident in the first place. 250hp with a 6 speed slush box is not gonna encourage too many races.

 

Thanks DFrantz, you articulated perfectly what I was trying to say. The T5 isn't some sort of lightning rod. It has power in reserve, and if you PUSH it, it can be a very quick car ... but unless you're in Sport mode or flooring it everywhere, the powertrain rewards relaxed driving. The people at my high school who drove T5s and even T6s certainly weren't slamming them into walls or having panic attacks at every turn. I would say that modern Volvos are actually quite relaxing cars to drive -- they don't fatigue the driver like others do. Ample power is definitely a safety feature in our modern America where a 65mph highway speed limit is seen (justifiably) as draconian. On my local stretch of I-95, you're a sitting duck unless you're near or above 80mph.

I will also add -- any big-block V6 in a Camry, Accord, Highlander, Malibu, etc etc is probably as fast or faster than your average T5 or 3.2 Volvo. I drove a friend's poorly-maintained 2008 Highlander V6 through Boston the other day, and it felt like the 2GR-FE could smoke my S60.

 

@BenjaminD is right. Some of the 2GR V6 Toyotas are really quick. That's an awesome powertrain to get if they are merging etc. or are fine with a little more fuel consumption. Some of my friends parents had the RAV4 with the V6 and those cars were deceptive. It was hilarious. The smaller engines are going to consume less fuel obviously though. In the end she will probably be the one paying for the fuel, insurance upkeep or whatever so she might not want to go for the V6 idk. That's a really good engine though.

The one part I don't like too much about the Toyotas though is I find them difficult to get parts warranties on sometimes, and the cars can also be really expensive, almost outrageous depending on what you are looking at especially something like a 4Runner or Tacoma. However there are some people that I know where those are the only cars that they will buy because of the fact that they can be kind of vanilla and they can be kind of plain and boring excluding those 2. So I can understand the appeal on that side too and they will often pay more for that sometimes. Or they buy the cheaper ones because they don't want to have to worry about someone denting their car. It is also important to bring up though that Toyota has had some recalls as of lately and other stuff can pop up too. So even though Toyota I think is still a very reliable car like the Volvo, I think people can sometimes over exaggerate Toyota's reliability too. In terms of reliability overall though, I would put Toyota, Mercedes-Benz, Honda and Volvo in a very similar reliability category. Volvo I think is a leader in reliability.

 

You'll get on the highway eventually, but with more power you can merge when you choose and power in reserve for a miscalculation. I notice the difference immensely when going between my old P2 2.5T and my P3 T6 P*

 

Funny. I've never thought of the 2.5T as underpowered for any normal driving situation short of a stoplight drag race. But I grew out of that a long time ago.

 

Oh it's not underpowered.. I just mean there is a noticeable difference in the type of driving I can safely do.

Some folks get a bit bent outta shape over what safe driving is (I have a book about it... "sportsman like driving" does not cover topics the way I was hoping when I snagged it at a yard sale). You can drive safe very differently in a performance car than a semi truck with two 40k trailers right? So if you accept that there is a difference at the extremes, there is also a difference in the middle. And all that's before you factor in experience, skill, reaction time, and intelligence. Power can get you in trouble, but it can also get you out of trouble. I'd much rather have the ability to get into and out of trouble than to be stuck without the option.

 

I did my early driving in the UK in a manual Fiat Panda with a 750cc engine producing less than 40hp and didn't die merging onto any motorways. It taught me a lot about 'reading the road' and defensive driving skills which are invaluable later in life. Sure its nice to have power under your right foot to get a merge done quicker but isn't it better to teach people to drive better with more awareness of their surroundings so they can avoid dangerous situations in the first place?

 

I don't see any problem with a little bit of speed really unless it's like a Lamborghini or something, that might be a little bit irresponsible. Or like an F12 or something, that would be really dangerous in all honesty. I think though even a W211 E55 AMG could be a good choice because it's reliable and easy to work on. That would a great car for an easy going first time driver. The downside with a faster vehicle is ya it's awesome don't get me wrong, but some of those especially when you start getting to the muscle cars and AMG's, is that they can go through some fuel! So that's the downside. T5 is a good middle ground I think. It's pretty fuel efficient and has some power, the P* I think is nice too but it just depends on what the fuel budget is.

Some people don't care about performance at all so they will buy something like a Corolla because they badly want the fuel economy. There was a girl I used to work with and she had a Toyota Prius. She absolutely loved it. When we talked about it she just flat out told me that she doesn't care about cars, it gets great fuel economy, it's economical. That's all she wanted. Tbh I couldn't fault her reasoning either. It's all about picking the right car that fits into your life. Tbh too unless she is with other enthusiasts or something no one cares about what kind of car you drive either. Not in the least! As long as the owner of the vehicle likes it that's really all that matters..

 

Some people don't care about performance at all so they will buy something like a Corolla because they badly want the fuel economy. There was a girl I used to work with and she had a Toyota Prius. She absolutely loved it. When we talked about it she just flat out told me that she doesn't care about cars, it gets great fuel economy, it's economical. That's all she wanted. Tbh I couldn't fault her reasoning either. It's all about picking the right car that fits into your life. Tbh too unless she is with other enthusiasts or something no one cares about what kind of car you drive either. Not in the least! As long as the owner of the vehicle likes it that's really all that matters..

Reminds me of my HS English teacher, who told me she loved her Chrysler Pacifica van because it "went fast" ... she just traded it in (with 180k miles no less) for a loaded Kia Carnival.

In her 20s she nearly had her license revoked in -- of all cars -- her 140hp Mazda 3. Some people are just born for speed!!

I can only imagine what my grandmother was like in her prime. She's 82 now, and the supercharger on her XC60 T6 comes alive with some frequency.

 

Lamborghini's aside, it's 90% driver, 10% car. I know some kids who I wouldn't trust with 100hp!

 

V60 CC. Period.