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2015 XC70 T6 Still Burning Oil After Piston and Ring Replacement

13K views 20 replies 10 participants last post by  pal440fcv  
#1 · (Edited)
*Update* 2015 XC70 T6 Still Burning Oil After Piston and Ring Replacement

First Low Oil warning message at 27,000 miles. New dipstick, software update and decal to indicate increase in oil volume with instructions to return every 5,000 miles to monitor usage. Problem persists and Volvo eventually authorizes piston and ring replacement as per TJ-30021 at 85,000 miles ($300 cost to us). Regular oil and filter change at 95,000 miles. Low Oil warning message occurs again at 98,000 miles. Dealer adds 2 qts and instructs us to return at 100,000 miles to check level. Down 1.5 qts at 100,000 miles. Dealer wants to do another internal inspection of engine to determine root cause and possibly open another case with Volvo for new engine, with some part of the cost borne by us.

Has anyone who has had piston and ring replacement continued to have oil burning issues?
Has anyone ever gotten Volvo to authorize a new engine?
 
#2 · (Edited)
The 2015 XC70 T6 came with a manual dipstick. There is no electronic oil pan level sensor.

The console message is for Low Oil PRESSURE. Since the oil uptake tube hangs pretty low in the oil pan, the oil level has to be very depleted (i.e., suctioning air) to trigger Low Oil Pressure. There are other causes for Low Oil Pressure, but those don't involve steady loss of oil volume.

At the 100,000 mile mark, it was consuming 0.75 qt. / 1000 miles. High enough to warrant monthly vigilance.

Did the possibility of an oil leak in the turbo ever come up? If not, the Volvo dealer doing your work might have overlooked the root cause. It's also possible that oil is leaking down from a cam/valveStem bearing into the cylinder.

I'd take out all 6 spark plugs and inspect them for oil sludge on the electrode. If none appear seriously fouled with oil sludge, and if the piston ring job was done correctly, the oil is most likely leaking into the pressurized combustion airstream in the turbo. That would be consistent with the rate of burning oil. If you wait until dark, and shoot a laser beam across tailpipe opening(s), you'll see the the oil smoke.

If it's a turbo leak, it can be verified by removing and inspecting the hose that brings compressed air from the turbo to the intercooler -- it would be coated with unburned oil. Alternatively, the air hose where it connects to the throttle body could be removed and the throttle body inspected for oily film.
 
#3 ·
The 2015 XC70 T6 came with a manual dipstick. There is no electronic oil pan level sensor.
I have to respectfully disagree with this. My 2009 XC70 T6 has a manual dipstick AND a warning message that comes on the dash when the oil level gets about 1 quart low. The message reads "low oil LEVEL" not low oil pressure...
 
#4 ·
Yes, the manual does indicate the oil can icon refers to 'Low Oil Pressure' but it is accompanied by a message on the dash indicating 'Low Oil Level'. My 2015 has a manual dipstick - at 27,000 miles the original one with a yellow handle was replaced with one with a red handle that has an expanded hash mark area along with a sticker affixed just below the oil fill cap that reads 'Oil Volume 7.9 litres / 8.4 qts'. A software update was also done to accommodate the increased oil volume. Evidently Volvo thought that increasing the oil volume would allow you to get to the recommended oil change interval without encountering a Low Oil condition. Dealer has checked for leaks at all services - none found. The car is burning oil - tail pipe tips are always covered in heavy black soot. My real question is do I allow the dealer to do another investigation, contact the regional Volvo rep and hope for some sort of resolution? What are the chances they would authorize the install of a new engine? We've owned Volvos since 1986 but this may be the last one.
 
#5 · (Edited)
For comparison, I have the same 2015 XC70 T6 (35,000 mi.), and the oil consumption is about 1 qt. in 8000 miles. You have the same engine, and it's burning 6 qts. in 8000 miles. You didn't answer -- did the dealer investigate and rule out a turbo oil leak (an internal engine leak into the compressed airstream)? Did the dealer investigate an oil dribble into a cylinder tricking down a valve stem?

If these haven't been specifically ruled out with a candid discussion of the evidence, yes, I think it is worth going back demanding the rework to ID the root cause of the oil leak.

Neither of these two problems, if confirmed as the root cause, would require a new engine. The Turbo unit can be replaced. Or the head can be replaced.

I would appeal to the reputation of the dealer in being able to expertly determine a root cause and make the needed repair. The piston & ring job?....it didn't solve the problem. By taking on that ring job, the dealer has conceded that the oil leak is excessive enough to require remediation.

They likely will balk at a new engine, as it might be overkill to fix the problem.

My tailpipes are blackened....that's normal.....focus on the rate of oil consumption.
 
#6 ·
For comparison, I have the same 2015 XC70 T6 (35,000 mi.), and the oil consumption is about 1 qt. in 8000 miles. You have the same engine, and it's burning 6 qts. in 8000 miles. You didn't answer -- did the dealer investigate and rule out a turbo oil leak (an internal engine leak into the compressed airstream)? Did the dealer investigate an oil dribble into a cylinder tricking down a valve stem?

If these haven't been specifically ruled out with a candid discussion of the evidence, yes, I think it is worth going back demanding the rework to ID the root cause of the oil leak.

Neither of these two problems, if confirmed as the root cause, would require a new engine. The Turbo unit can be replaced. Or the head can be replaced.

I would appeal to the reputation of the dealer in being able to expertly determine a root cause and make the needed repair. The piston & ring job?....it didn't solve the problem. By taking on that ring job, the dealer has conceded that the oil leak is excessive enough to require remediation.

They likely will balk at a new engine, as it might be overkill to fix the problem.

My tailpipes are blackened....that's normal.....focus on the rate of oil consumption.
Pbierre - I don't know exactly what the dealer checked to determine that the piston/ring job was required other than determining that there were no oil leaks anywhere and pulling the plugs to be able to inspect the cylinders. I would assume they have a procedure to rule out lesser causes before initiating a piston/ring job, but who knows? They have suggested another inspection - I will ask if it would include the items you specifically mention above.
 
#8 · (Edited)
Here is a great article on the oil lubrication system:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oil_pump_(internal_combustion_engine)

After reading it, it occurs that there is a much faster way to prove the existence of an oil circulation leak -- through seeing its impact in lowering the system oil pressure. You would want to let the engine come up to temp. before reading out the oil pressure, and then read it at a few different RPMs...650, 1500, 3000.

I think this will strengthen your case with the dealer. If your oil pressure is running low, then that condition is wearing out your engine parts faster than they should.
Cumulative damage to the engine may already be done. I.e., if a repair cannot boost the oil pressure back up to the nominal level, then that points to systemic wear (bearing tolerances have expanded unacceptably), meaning the engine will have a shortened lifespan before it seizes up.

Having first presented the problem during warranty coverage (27K miles), I think you have some protection if it needs a new engine.
 
#9 ·
Correction: After a little more poking around, oil pressure is NOT sensed with an analog pressure sensor, so forget about using OBD-II readout. Rather, all the engine has is a simple pressure switch that triggers the Low Oil Pressure. To assess the running oil pressure, it requires mounting an oil pressure gauge on the engine to take the readings.

If someone has access to Volvo Tech Info, could you look up the oil pressure specs for this 2015.5 Volvo-Ford B6304 engine?
 
#10 ·
**Update** Volvo has determined no additional testing is called for, engine needs to be replaced. Offer is Volvo North America and dealership will split the cost of a 'factory remanufactured' long block with a supposed cost of > $10,000. We would be responsible for the labor charge to remove old and install new with an approximate cost to us of $2700. We're being told 'new' engine will carry a lifetime warranty for as long as we own the car. Does anyone have any experience with a Volvo 'factory remanufactured' long block?
 
#11 ·
That sounds like a pretty reasonable solution to me - $2,700 to get a factory rebuilt motor with a lifetime warranty. I don't have any direct experience with this but I have not read of anyone having issues with rebuilt motors from Volvo.
 
#12 · (Edited)
I owned and operated a custom engine building business for many years and before that I worked for a high-volume assembly-line engine builder as their Service Manager, responsible for all issues after the sale.
I can tell you that figuring out Why an engine is burning oil is not rocket science; but it is science and the truth is that the folks who build engines for a living know this and have no trouble diagnosing problems---BUT---
dealers and repair garages rarely rebuild engines so they just are not equipped with the tools to properly and correctly diagnose an engine problem. Hence you get the situation you have encountered where the dealer just
does not know because they just do not have the experience and knowledge to figure out the problem. Without using proper science and skill to determine the problem with your engine it is still easy to make a Logic conclusion
based on what you have told us, to wit: Volvo replaced pistons and rings at 85,000 and agreed to replace the entire engine at 100,000. Now I have built so many engines in my life with ZERO failures that when I hear that an
engine AFTER a piston and ring replacement is still burning oil I can conclude quickly that the bottom end is not and was not ever the problem, UNLESS a complete Duffus did the piston and ring job!!!
SO I have to agree with pbierre that something else is causing the oil consumption problem. And with pbierre, one has to manually test oil pressure on ANY engine to know if that is the problem. That is something that all engine
builders automatically do to assure that they did not make a mistake building the engine.
If I were in your shoes, I would laugh all the way to the bank to get a factory rebuilt lifetime guaranteed engine from Volvo for only $2700. Do let us know what happens as at this point it is very possible that the new engine will
use the same amount of oil because the problem is not in the long-block and then the dealer\factory may have to give you a new car! Ha! (joke) It is truly sad that both the dealer and the factory rep have been poking around
blindly without having proper experience, technique or knowledge about what they are dealing with.
 
#13 ·
*Update* Volvo Remanufactured Long Block Installed

So $2900 later we have a Volvo remanufactured long block installed. Invoice lists the part as 36050646-3: Engine, Exch. Hopefully this will resolve the problem. Dealer has been good to work with - this is our fourth new Volvo purchased from them - but what ticked me off was the Volvo Regional Reps comment that we 'didn't have a strong enough case' to warrant a free replacement. Really? The problem started at just over 27,000 miles and continued even after all their attempted intermediate fixes - increased oil volume, reduced oil change intervals, oil usage monitoring, piston and ring replacement, etc. Looks like this will be our last Volvo.
 
#14 ·
So $2900 later we have a Volvo remanufactured long block installed. Invoice lists the part as 36050646-3: Engine, Exch. Hopefully this will resolve the problem. Dealer has been good to work with - this is our fourth new Volvo purchased from them - but what ticked me off was the Volvo Regional Reps comment that we 'didn't have a strong enough case' to warrant a free replacement. Really? The problem started at just over 27,000 miles and continued even after all their attempted intermediate fixes - increased oil volume, reduced oil change intervals, oil usage monitoring, piston and ring replacement, etc. Looks like this will be our last Volvo.
In fairness, you now have a car with a lifetime engine warranty. This could be both your last Volvo and your last car you need to buy. lol
 
#15 ·
I really appreciate everyone who has taken time to post on this thread. I have had second occurrence of "LOW OIL" light on a certified preowned early model year 2015 XC70. First happened at just under 50K and the engine took 1 quart. Two hundred miles later, at the 50K service interval, the dealership did the dipstick replacement and sticker "routine" per Volvo. About 5,000 miles later, "LOW OIL" again, and this time it took 2 quarts to refill. I took the car back to the dealer and politely insisted on a thorough engine inspection, after having read this forum thread. The dealer's service department has determine that this is indeed "an internal engine issue", and Volvo technical has authorized a piston replacement. We'll see how this goes; the car has been in the shop for 9 business days so far, but this is on Volvo under the extended CPO warranty to 7 years or 100K.

Thanks everyone for making me aware of this known, but largely undisclosed, engine issue!
 
#17 ·
I really appreciate everyone who has taken time to post on this thread. I have had second occurrence of "LOW OIL" light on a certified preowned early model year 2015 XC70. First happened at just under 50K and the engine took 1 quart. Two hundred miles later, at the 50K service interval, the dealership did the dipstick replacement and sticker "routine" per Volvo. About 5,000 miles later, "LOW OIL" again, and this time it took 2 quarts to refill. I took the car back to the dealer and politely insisted on a thorough engine inspection, after having read this forum thread. The dealer's service department has determine that this is indeed "an internal engine issue", and Volvo technical has authorized a piston replacement. We'll see how this goes; the car has been in the shop for 9 business days so far, but this is on Volvo under the extended CPO warranty to 7 years or 100K.

Thanks everyone for making me aware of this known, but largely undisclosed, engine issue!
Is your engine also a T6? I'm thinking of picking up a 2016 CPO XC70 T5 (5 cylinder engine) and was curious. Thanks.
 
#19 · (Edited)
Curious, given all these issues of oil consumption, are there those who have 100K and no discernable excess oil consumption. I am considering replacing a 189K engine with a newer 2013 3.2 motor because of burnt valve or piston ring, don't know yet, just know cyl. 5 is down to 40 lb, so found a 37K motor to replace my 2011 motor. My old engine didn't use oil between change interval of 6K to 7K religious changes. I got engine for same price as heads were going for from salvage yards, so in case it is not just burnt valve, figured I would go for engine swap instead. I heard 2013 motors had improved piston and rings over my 2011 motor, is this true? Given this thread is about 2015 XC70 motor, is this different than non turbo motor I have when it comes to oil consumption issue?

Thanks
 
#20 ·
Mine has 105k and no discernable oil use as of yet but I've only owned the car for five months and haven't exactly been driving much, lol.

I think the oil burning issue affects both turbo and na cars. That said, with a used motor I think you just have to take your chances, most will be fine and maybe there's a warranty.

Given the choice, for the same money I'd probably go with the engine swap than rebuilding a motor with 189k on it already. YMMV.
 
#21 ·
UPDATE: As I posted on June 18, my early model year 2015 XC70 T6 was diagnosed with an 'internal engine issue" and Volvo authorized a piston and ring replacement under the Certified Pre-Owned warranty. The job is finally done, 31 days after the car went into the shop. Thank goodness I had asked for a loaner! I spoke directly with the mechanic who did the work, and he confirmed there was no cylinder scoring and all should be "good to go". As an additional matter they replaced the "oil trap" in the PCV system after finding a high pressure reading indicating a blockage. So, now I've got new pistons, new rings, new plugs, a repaired PCV system and an oil change all under my Certified Pre-Owned Warranty, but I'll be watching closely as I near the end of the CPO warranty at the end of June 2021!