6 New Electric Volvos by 2025 - here they are!

rfkuehn · Mar 3, 2021

Mjoelnir said:
View attachment 119596

I looked at it once again and mostly agree. However, I'm really convinced it is an S90 and not an S60 since it has the same length as the XC90 in the first row. Added some reference lines now.

The car I thought it would be a V40 is probably really the new XC60. Makes much more sense as it appears to be a bit larger than the XC40. And it is the best-selling Volvo, so it makes sense to electrify it as fast as possible. It came out in March 2017, so it should be due for a replacement no later than 2024.

What's missing is the V90. But since Volvo also has the V60, XC90 and V100 (or XC100), it can also be phased out. New V60 and S60 could be presented after 2025 since they only came out in February/June 2018.

Nice work! But I've got another thought about the S60/S90 item - now I think its V90, or maybe V60. Seven years would make V90 due MY24, then V60 for MY25. So on the original image, I now think I see:

Row 1: XC40, XC90 (SPA2)
Row 2: C40, XC20, V90 (SPA2)
Row 3: XC60 (SPA2), XC100 (SPA2)

Re: Volvo said it will "radically reduce" the complexity of its model line-up, I think this means while SPA2 will need support MHEV, PHEV, and EV, later 'SPA3' (or whatever its to be called) will be EV only. Since those EVs won't be compromised by shared architecture, figure that's when capability & range will become most competitive (along with much more robust charging networks).

So I'm thinking SPA2 PHEV for family hauler in a couple years, then 'SPA3' EV in early 2030s as retirement present to myself.

Mjoelnir · Mar 3, 2021

I think it really looks like a sedan, especially when you look at the shadow image. It has a three-box shape with a trunk. Even if a direct successor of the V90 or V60 had a sloped roofline, its shadow image would look different (compare it to the C40).

Maybe there is one more hint in the original image from Volvo: The cars look clustered quite randomly, but for me, there seems to be an order: You start on the left with the car that is already on sale: the XC40 Recharge. Next comes the C40 which was presented yesterday. And next to that is the XC90 which will be presented later this year. The cars seem to be displayed in the order in which they will arrive by 2025:

2020: XC40
2021: C40
2021: XC90
2022: XC20
2023: XC60
2024: S90
2025: XC100 (V100)

After that, the replacement of the XC40 is due, and we are going to see where the S60 and V60 will end up. Maybe just a C60 (SUV Coupé of the XC60)? At least, Volvo registered both C40 and C60 nameplates in November 2015:
"Volvo Trademarks C40 And C60 Names" Volvo Trademarks C40 And C60 Names

rfkuehn · Mar 3, 2021

Yep, I think we're thinking the same sequence of EVs: XC40, C40, XC90 (SPA2), XC20, XC60 (SPA2), S60/90 (SPA2), XC100 (SPA2). But why over three rows vs. two? Wonder if there's another clue in there somewhere...

And now that you mention it, I wonder if what we're debating as S90 vs. S60 could actually be C60? Thinking that might make more sense than a sedan. So how about XC40, C40, XC90 (SPA2), XC20, XC60 (SPA2), C60 (SPA2), XC100 (SPA2)?

Mjoelnir · Mar 3, 2021

Nice conversation with you! We're slowly getting at it...

I think you nailed it that it could also be a "C" car instead of an "S" car. I remember the following article:
New Volvo coupe-SUV set to lead next-generation of brand's EVs | Auto Express
"Speaking exclusively to Auto Express, Volvo's Senior Vice President of Design, Robin Page, told us that in combination with the firm's focus on electrification, Volvo's future model line-up will be very different to what we see today."
A "very different line-up" could mean that there won't be any Volvo sedans in the future after all. No S90, no S60 (Polestar however is a different story...)

To me, that one particular car in question does really look as large as an XC90. A C60 would be much smaller. But, while talking Volvo SUV Coupes and a mysterious car in the 90 range, something else comes to my mind:
2024 Volvo XC100 Recharge: A Swedishly Stylish Electric Flagship (motortrend.com)
"Volvo to join the swoopy SUV "coupe" craze with the all-electric XC100 Recharge."
This article seemed really strange to me, because I imagined the XC100 to be a competitor of the BMW X7 and Mercedes GLS, in other words a longer XC90. Why should the XC100 suddenly be an SUV Coupe? To me, it seemed that the journalist made wrong assumptions. So far... What if that car we are talking about IS the XC100 aka C90?

Thinking this even further and very out of the box, this could even be an explanation why the cars are displayed in 3 instead of 2 rows: First row: SUVs (XC40, XC90). Second row: SUV Coupes (C40, C60, C90 because who said it's the new XC60?). Third row: V (V40, V90). That small XC20/V40 car is sitting on the new SEA platform, and if you look at the Lynk&Co Zero, which sits on the SEA platform but isn't an SUV, it's possible that the tiny Volvo will also be a hatchback (V40) and not an SUV (XC20).

rfkuehn · Mar 3, 2021

OK here's my current laydown vs. original image:

Row 1: XC40, XC90
Row 2: C40, XC20, C60*
Row 3: XC60, XC100

*But re: XC100, I've seen alternating opinions on whether its to be XC90 coupe-ish (minus 3rd row), or enlarged XC90. Perhaps they're actually doing both? XC100 is lower-right corner, but mid-right entry is some mashup C60-70-80-90 thing that has a larger, 2 row footprint (RX or e-tron-ish).

cometguy · Mar 4, 2021

I'll be surprised if Volvo doesn't bring wagons into their BEV line-up, because Volvo is known in the world as a wagon maker more than an SUV maker (even with many fewer wagon sales than SUV sales in the US) and because wagon sales in Europe are still high.

Wagons forecast to struggle but still survive on strong German, Swedish, Czech demand

European sales of station wagons will shrink to 1.5 million by 2025 from almost 2 million in 2016, analyst firm LMC Automotive predicts, as automakers abandon the segment in favor of vehicles with more global appeal such as SUVs and crossovers.

europe.autonews.com

Mjoelnir · Mar 4, 2021

Håkan Samuelsson says: "Definitely don't count out the wagon."

"Volvo to downsize saloon and estate offering in SUV-led EV push | Autocar" Volvo to downsize saloon and estate offering in SUV-led EV push | Autocar

I really believe that Volvo is now focussing on releasing those six BEV cars as well as the Polestar 3 and Precept (and beyond). I believe that they will let the current SPA cars soldier on for more than seven years and eventually phase out their non-PHEV versions.

02s80 · Mar 4, 2021

Mjoelnir said:
I don't like it either. At all. It's just an XC40 with a curved roofline and ugly spoilers. The interior seems to be all the same.

What surprises me is that there hasn't been any new Volvo design since May 2016 when the 40.1 and 40.2 concepts were presented. All Volvo car designs (including Polestar 2) do either go back to the Concept Coupe and Concept Estate or to the 40.1/40.2.

Yes. And there's no concept car to give a clue to what the next Volvo will look like. The current design has aged well but it is now time to update the cars, especially the interiors. The Polestar 2, however, has a more modern interior and is different than the Volvo interiors, especially the dash and console area.

I hope Volvo shows the 2022 xc90 soon. The interior is what I look forward to as I read the exterior will be evolutionary but the interior will have significant changes. But I don't get why Volvo would have a 2022 model with the same xc40 interior.

Mjoelnir · Mar 4, 2021

I fully agree. I wonder what went wrong that the XC40 has a rather basic looking interior while the Polestar 2 has a classy looking interior. Both are in the same price range and were developed at the same time. Honestly, I don't expect the 2022 XC90 to look very different to the current one. Only inside, I expect a huge step forward.

02s80 · Mar 4, 2021

I hope Volvo does not abandon sedans. There's still a market for them and things may change in the future. They could make one between the size of an s60 and s90 or offer it in various wheelbase sizes. I don't get why Volvo's sedans aren't selling because they look great, perform well, and boring looking sedans like the Audi A4 and Mercedes C still have decent sales. I'm a sedan guy. I don't like coupe SUVs. I find them to look like bloated cars with forced so-called coupe C pillars. Volvo could try making sedans that have a high appearance as they already have with the Polestar 2 (Concept 40.2). So, I hope speculations that what looks like a sedan being a coupe SUV are not accurate.

rfkuehn · Mar 4, 2021

02s80 said:
I hope Volvo shows the 2022 xc90 soon. The interior is what I look forward to as I read the exterior will be evolutionary but the interior will have significant changes.

I'd just like to see next-gen XC90 interior catch up to the 2014 concept cars. For example, I figured we were seeing mostly the canx P3 XC90 dash, which the concepts advanced further and we've seen in cars released after XC90. Was a bit surprised it didn't catch up to S90/V90 for 2020 midcycle refresh, assuming three more production years and next-gen landing for MY23.

Trying to read tea leaves re: timing, but thinking how MY22 XC60 just popped, I wonder if we'll see it late this year, on sale early/mid-2022 as MY23?

cometguy · Mar 4, 2021

02s80 said:
I hope Volvo does not abandon sedans. There's still a market for them and things may change in the future. They could make one between the size of an s60 and s90 or offer it in various wheelbase sizes. I don't get why Volvo's sedans aren't selling because they look great, perform well, and boring looking sedans like the Audi A4 and Mercedes C still have decent sales. I'm a sedan guy. I don't like coupe SUVs. I find them to look like bloated cars with forced so-called coupe C pillars. Volvo could try making sedans that have a high appearance as they already have with the Polestar 2 (Concept 40.2). So, I hope speculations that what looks like a sedan being a coupe SUV are not accurate.

I prefer wagons the way that you prefer sedans, and I dislike SUVs (except for their higher seating that affords better visibility and occasionally for their extra cargo space -- both of which make the Cross Country wagons perfect for me). I'm not quite sure about the problem with Volvo sedans, because here in New England, sedans made by BMW and Audi and Mercedes and Cadillac (just to mention some of the luxury brands) are very very common (and even here, Volvo sedans prior to the S90 series are quite common also). For some reason, the S90 has not sold well (and I presume that the S60 hasn't sold that well, either), and I don't know the reasons for that. And here in New England, it's quite common to see older Volvo wagons of the V70 series going back two decades on the streets here, but the newer V90 and V60 wagons just aren't that common.

I test-drove an XC40 "Recharge P8" BEV this morning. The torque was just amazing. Getting back into an ICE Volvo after that test drive is downright disappointing.

baydreamer · Mar 4, 2021

I'm just happy that Volvo has confirmed that there will still be wagons in the future. Less of them, but they'll still be available. A BEV V60 or 90 is exactly what I want.

FusionRedXC60 · Mar 4, 2021

cometguy said:
I test-drove an XC40 "Recharge P8" BEV this morning. The torque was just amazing. Getting back into an ICE Volvo after that test drive is downright disappointing.

Pretty much everyone tried BEV first time is like this. :lol:
From my T8 I don't feel any desire to try BEV at all.

baydreamer · Mar 4, 2021

FusionRedXC60 said:
Pretty much everyone tried BEV first time is like this. :lol:
From my T8 I don't feel any desire to try BEV at all.

I read a little while ago that only 1% of people who buy a BEV plan on going back to an ICE.

FusionRedXC60 · Mar 4, 2021

baydreamer said:
I read a little while ago that only 1% of people who buy a BEV plan on going back to an ICE.

This means it is addictive, doesn't mean it is better.

VolvoGoteborg · Mar 7, 2021

Mjoelnir said:
I don't like it either. At all. It's just an XC40 with a curved roofline and ugly spoilers. The interior seems to be all the same.

What surprises me is that there hasn't been any new Volvo design since May 2016 when the 40.1 and 40.2 concepts were presented. All Volvo car designs (including Polestar 2) do either go back to the Concept Coupe and Concept Estate or to the 40.1/40.2.

40.1 became the XC40
40.2 was to be the S40 but became the Polestar 2 and EV only
The C90 project became the Polestar 1 (confirmed in an interview with Thomas Ingelath)
Polestar 3 (SUV) is its own unique design
Polestar Precept goes into the production at the end of 2021

6 new Volvo EVs

XC40 (already lanched)
C40 (just launched)
S60
V60
XC60
S90
V90
XC90 (SPA2 MY23)

So just EV versions of the current lineup meets the tally

There's also the XC20 (based on the Geely-Volvo SEA platform) confirmed and the XC100

So allowing for the refresh rate of 7 years since launch some of the original list will get EV versions later than 2025

No new models planned as far as i'm aware

Whilst I'd love to see a coupe, lots of people tell me coupes don't sell in sufficient volume

With strong SUVs sales Id like to see Volvo dabble again with a lower volume coupe model

Hakan Samuelson also said last week (few magazine interviews) that Volvo has "too many" sedans and estates.

They have 2 of each!!! (I don't count the XC versions and a completely separate product. To me they are merely a version)

So it seems Volvo is considering dropping one of each and having just once sedan (I think that will be the S90 which lets you have the S90L / S100 product as well like just now) and then just one estate (maybe 2 I think).

As for other new products to add with XC20, XC40, XC60, XC90 and XC100 do they really need any more SUVs?

baydreamer · Mar 7, 2021

I believe that I read that estates/wagons sell fairly well in Europe. I'm thankful that Volvo isn't giving up on them (they're fringe models at best in the US). I really want an electric V model down the road. I'm assuming that when they come out in the next few years, charging times will have improved, as will range.

ChrisJB84 · Mar 7, 2021

@VolvoGoteborg, the Polestar 3 (SUV) is interesting in a sense that its an unknown in what design direction the brand will take. Will it still stick with that grit like front bumper design until the production Precept arrives or something else. Will wait and see. There's another thread here that speculates that it might be the P*3 based on the small shot of the interior resembling the design from the Precept, if that is the case, then its a bit ornate.

I'm really excited to see if Precept translates closely to production. There's something special about the overall design of the car inside and out.

baydreamer · Mar 7, 2021

ChrisJB84 said:
@VolvoGoteborg, the Polestar 3 (SUV) is interesting in a sense that its an unknown in what design direction the brand will take. Will it still stick with that grit like front bumper design until the production Precept arrives or something else. Will wait and see. There's another thread here that speculates that it might be the P*3 based on the small shot of the interior resembling the design from the Precept, if that is the case, then its a bit ornate.

I remember reading that the Precept was to show the design direction that Polestar is going to take starting the the 3. The Precept was never meant for production, but people were so blown away with it (including me) that they decided to produce it.

6 New Electric Volvos by 2025 - here they are!

rfkuehn

Mjoelnir

rfkuehn

Mjoelnir

rfkuehn

cometguy

Wagons forecast to struggle but still survive on strong German, Swedish, Czech demand

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02s80

Mjoelnir

02s80

rfkuehn

cometguy

baydreamer

FusionRedXC60

baydreamer

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VolvoGoteborg

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ChrisJB84

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