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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
It's late and I can't sleep so my mind is all over the place. There have been a number of posts recently involving statements about 91 vs. 93 vs. 94 vs. 100 octane gasoline. As I was filling up our oaf of a 'ute the other day, it occured to me that the owner's manual suggests that we use 87 octane in our car. Great. It's cheaper at the pump and my wife couldn't care less about 0-60 times.<p>Then I started thinking about all of the articles in magazines, etc. which say that there's no need to fill up with any level octane higher than that which the manufacturer recommends because there isn't a performance, detergent or other benefit. Basically, the thought is that the car is engineered to run on "x" octane fuel, therefore, it won't ping if you use at least that level of fuel. But, since the computer is programmed to maximize efficiency based upon use of that gas, it wouldn't know how to make better use of a higher octane gas. Even the FTC touts this theory....<A HREF="http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/autos/octane.htm" TARGET="_blank">http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline...e.htm</A>.<p>Sooooooo, while many of us use 93 vs. 91 octane (because it's what's available as Premium) and others use 91 because 93 is either scarce or simply not offered, I wonder about the benefits of 100 octane gas in a car that doesn't have an ECU tune that would recognize the benefits of the additional 7 (or 9) octane....or is the Volvo ECU smart enough to make the best of it?<p>Consider, for example, APR sells VAG and Porsche chip programs for both 91 and 93 octane. The 93 octane programming dynos marginally higher numbers than the 91 octane program because it was engineered to do so...supposedly. Hypothetically, would the 91 program running 93 octane really yield significantly different numbers than the 93 program running 93? Okay, maybe that's too tough to answer without more information on the APR programs.<p>But, back to Volvo...are there really benefits (other than placebo) to using 100 octane gas in an engine with an ECU engineered to run best on 93 octane?<p>Thoughts?<p>-Eric
 

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on my car, 100 octane fuel is like steroids! although I've played with mixing and have mixed it down to what is supposedly 93ish. Not sure I can tell the difference...maybe a bit in the upper rpms..... for 90% of driving, I can honestly tella difference between 91 and 93. i have to really be on the gas hard to even *think* I can tell the difference beetween 93 adn 100.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Re: (23109VC)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>23109VC</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I can honestly tella difference between 91 and 93. i have to really be on the gas hard to even *think* I can tell the difference beetween 93 adn 100.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>And that would make sense, since I believe (someone correct me if I'm wrong) the R was engineered to benefit from 93 octane but can run safely on 91.<p>-Eric
 

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Re: Your thoughts on 100 Octane Gasoline... (Sue Esponte)

I have run 100 oct only for the last 3 months, there is a local station and its only 5.50 a gallon. I will never go back, the car runs incredible as well as far more efficiently as 22.5mpg even while enjoying the power increase.<br>
 

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Re: Your thoughts on 100 Octane Gasoline... (Sue Esponte)

In my car, it was a 20HP / 20Nm increase going from 91 piss to higher octane (94+), proven on a dyno.
 

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Re: Your thoughts on 100 Octane Gasoline... (ForceReconTrojan)

I think we benifit more from the increase, due the crappy gas we have here. I did once fill up with 17 gallons and it was amazing. If it wasn't so expensive and/or I didn't drive up to 700 miles per week, I would be all over it. And doing the whole mix thing is a pain in the A**.<p>I just get some 100 when I have the time and I need some R therapy.
 

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Re: Your thoughts on 100 Octane Gasoline... (LA-s60r)

you know Johann, I'm too cheap to experiment with 93 or 100 because I could be the only ghetto R here. so I'll chime in my 2 cents.<p>87 to 89 = no difference.<br>89 to 91 = slight difference, but only temperate environment. (means around 65c)<p>I have used total of 2 weeks of 87, 4 weeks of 89, and 91 the rest of the way....<p>honestly, if my manual doesn't recommend 91 I'd seriously consider 89 or even lower...... but that's just me.<p>in a few days I'll try that 100 octane in Pasadena 76 and i'll let you folks know.....<br>
 

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Re: Your thoughts on 100 Octane Gasoline... (LA-s60r)

For the heck of it, I blended 6 gallons of 100 octane with the rest 91 craptane to get a 93-94 Octane blend. The car seemed to pull more in the midrange rpms especially at rolling speeds. Off the line was still a slug.
 

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Re: Your thoughts on 100 Octane Gasoline... (stevectsai)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>stevectsai</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br>honestly, if my manual doesn't recommend 91 I'd seriously consider 89 or even lower...... but that's just me.<br></TD></TR></TABLE><p>Baaaaaaaaad idea.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
So far all we've proven is that there's a verifiable difference between the performance of 91 and 93, which makes sense if the ECU is programmed to run at its best using 93.<p>My question is, will the car benefit from using anything better than 93 octane if the oem software doesn't know how to take advantage of it (or does it)? CA seems to be a bad test bed for the question since most of you seem to be blending 91 and 100 to get something around 93ish octane. And, while seat of the pants info is interesting, it could be as much placebo effect or simply the difference between 91 and 100 (to those in CA) as a true increase. I think dyno numbers comparing (true) 93 to 100 would be much more valuable in settling the question.<p>-Eric
 

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Re: Your thoughts on 100 Octane Gasoline... (Sue Esponte)

Two words for you:<p>LIQUID CRACK<p>100 octane makes a HUGE difference on the a$$ dyno. Especially in my lil old GT.<p>-Ben
 

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Re: Your thoughts on 100 Octane Gasoline... (Sue Esponte)

When Volvo was trying to figure out why my car had lost power (which turned out to be a small hole in air hose to turbo combined with a bad mass air flow sensor) I was told that the R was designed to run on 92 or higher octane. Here in Northern Nevada and also California we have 91. I was told that even though 91 was not 92, it was within tolerance for the engine. They first suspected that the 91, plus oxygenated for winter, plus elevation was causing my problem. <p>With that said, I know my car really runs great when I increase the octane from the 91 to 93 or 94. I do this by taking my car with an empty tank to the 100 octane guy, putting in 5 or 6 gallons of 100, and then driving around the corner to a chevron station and fill with 91. this "blends" the fuel better than just topping off with 100. When you read here that people are using 100, I am assuming they are blending the fuel, not running straight 100. I think this would be a waste of money as an un modified car should not care whether the fuel is 94 or 96 or 100, as long as it is over 92. If the car is modified, then higher would probably be better. oclv
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Re: (Token)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Token</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">98 Octane is recommended by Volvo for the UK market. You can run it on 95 for normal driving. I guess 100 octane would be very nice.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>I believe 98 RON (not octane) is recommended in the UK. They are not the same. As I understand it 95 RON is about 91 Octane and 98 RON is about 93 Octane. Someone correct me if I'm wrong but the result would be the same as in the US.<p>-Eric
 

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Re: (Token)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Token</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">98 Octane is recommended by Volvo for the UK market. You can run it on 95 for normal driving. I guess 100 octane would be very nice.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Just make sure we're all comparing apples to apples here.<br>I believe that in the UK the number you see is RON. In North America (NA) the number we see at the pumps and in the onwer's manual is (R + M) / 2<p>I think this means UK 98 (RON) would be equivalent to NA 94 (R + M) / 2.<p>There is a nice explanation here:<br><A HREF="http://www.petro-canada.ca/eng/prodserv/fuels/6823.htm" TARGET="_blank">http://www.petro-canada.ca/eng...3.htm</A>(scroll down to point # 19)<br>See also this link:<br><A HREF="http://www.petro-canada.ca/eng/prodserv/fuels/6825.htm" TARGET="_blank">http://www.petro-canada.ca/eng...5.htm</A><p>LTA<br>
 

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Re: Your thoughts on 100 Octane Gasoline... (mike_c70)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>mike_c70</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">In my car, it was a 20HP / 20Nm increase going from 91 piss to higher octane (94+), proven on a dyno.</TD></TR></TABLE><br>Well dyno proven is dyno proven <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/biggrin.gif" BORDER="0"> I have filled up with 100, did not notice anything big at all. Should one reset the ECU when filling with higher octane??? Perhaps the ecu took a while to realize there was more octane and took it's time advancing timing?
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Re: Your thoughts on 100 Octane Gasoline... (nikhsub11)

He never said he proved the difference between 93 and 100 on a dyno. The difference he referred to was 91 and 93 which, as I've said, the R was engineered to use.<p>Everything I've read on the R recommends 93 octane (98 RON) but says that it's okay to use 91 octane (95 RON) for daily driving. In other words, the software in our cars was designed to take advantage of the 93 octane, but 91 shouldn't cause any problems with pinging. None of this means that the car knows how to take advantage of 100 octane.<p>-Eric
 

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Re: (Sue Esponte)

US gas is rated as the average of the theoretical Research Octane Number and the measured Motor Octane Number. RON is always higher and yes I think 98 RON ~ 94 (RON + MON)/2.<p>I fill with about a 2:1 92/101 ratio which should net about 94. There is a noticable difference in summer heat and/or with winter formula 92 (up to 10% ethanol).
 

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Re: Your thoughts on 100 Octane Gasoline... (Sue Esponte)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Sue Esponte</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">He never said he proved the difference between 93 and 100 on a dyno. The difference he referred to was 91 and 93 which, as I've said, the R was engineered to use.<p>Everything I've read on the R recommends 93 octane (98 RON) but says that it's okay to use 91 octane (95 RON) for daily driving. In other words, the software in our cars was designed to take advantage of the 93 octane, but 91 shouldn't cause any problems with pinging. None of this means that the car knows how to take advantage of 100 octane.<p>-Eric</TD></TR></TABLE><br>I should have stated that I am in Cali, and have only had access to 91 when I filled up with 100. I realize 93-4 to 100 will be little to nothing, but 91 to 100?
 
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