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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Okay so a while back, I'd considered trading in my car for something else. Then I realized there's just nothing else that ticks as many boxes so I replaced the front left hub assembly (I'd thought it was the angle gear before) and fuel rail pressure sensor. I thought the rail sensor would fix my bizarre high RPM misfire. It did not.

A detailed history of this failure is in the next paragraph:

Sometimes, when I go at or near full throttle, the car hesitates, misfires, and the check engine light starts flashing. A message comes on the DIM saying "slow down or shift up". Once I let go of the throttle, it smooths back out and the light quits flashing. Well one day, it didn't. It continued misfiring and hesitating all the way home. I called my friend (A tech at a local chain - I know. I know. Chains. But it was 6:15PM and he's all I had as far as mechanics go) and he had me go to the local auto parts store to get the codes read. It showed a misfire on 3 cylinders, as well as an odd code: PO60C - 68 "Internal module main processor performance. Event information. Algorithm based failures." He then drove across town with his snap-on scanner and determined that I had a bad coil pack. A trip to autozone and $52 later, the car was running great, as long as I didn't go anywhere near full power. Based on that, I thought the failed rail sensor (which I already had a code for) was causing this, because it didn't know the fuel pressure. I went online and ordered the rail sensor and the hub assembly and had them installed at a local tire shop. The hub fixed my noise completely. I was expecting the rail sensor to fix my misfiring, but it didn't. It did help it, but it was not 100%. My friend volunteered to change the remaining coils and plugs. I ordered a full matching set of 6 OEM Delphi coils and NGK's new ruthenium HX spark plugs. Again, an improvement, but not 100%. Still has a slight hesitation and now a slightly lumpy idle. Every couple seconds I can feel a minute vibration that was never there before. Almost like it's stumbling, but I can live with it. Halloween night, I started my car to leave work. The cold start high idle engaged like always, but it had a much deeper sound to it. Like it was under a heavy load. Then, in park, while warming up, the check engine light starts flashing. The cabin lights start flickering, the "slow down or shift up" message comes on the DIM. The idle slowed down, but the misfire didn't go away. I turned the car off, crossed my fingers, and started it again. Absolutely no issue whatsoever. High idle came and went, no warnings.

This may be related but might be a coincidence. The next morning, the car started up fine, but the infotainment screen wigged out. I noticed it didn't boot up at all. It was completely dark except for temperature. It let me select media and telephone, and brought up those menus. it would not, however, change to ANY source of radio. AM? No. FM? Nope. XM? Sorry. But it would play a CD or stream Bluetooth from my phone. Again, I shut down and restarted the car, and the whole car worked perfectly the rest of Friday and all of yesterday. I haven't driven anywhere today.

With issues like these, the likelihood of them happening in the presence of a mechanic are almost zero, so I wanted to come here to pick some brains first and get some kind of idea.

A bit of background:

2012 Volvo XC60 T6. 186,000 miles. Vin is YV4902DZ9C2338241 It has been southern owned and garage kept it's entire life. Since I've owned it, it's always had full synthetic oil at never more than 7,500 mi. drain intervals. Every 50k, I have the transmission fluid serviced. It will be done again at 200k. Shifts great 99% of the time.

Oddities/extra info that may help with diagnosis:

For a while now, I've smelled oil. I have no leaks, and it does burn some. It only started burning oil after I had the PCV oil trap vent box replaced at an Indy because it was setting a lean code. I've always found this fishy. Oil consumption increases as the oil gets closer and closer to changing time. Fresh change 2000 miles before needing a quart, then 1200, then 1000, then 600. Very non linear. For fuel, there's a Mapco by my house that sells ethanol-free 90 octane and they sell it for the price of midgrade, so I buy that whenever available, from the same pump whenever possible. If I'm low and far from home, I find the cheapest 93 available, usually Sam's club. I'm not sure if either are top tier, probably not. Halloween night (the night of it acting up while in high idle) I was low on gas and decided to switch to Exxon 93, which is top tier. I was nearly out and pumped over 16 gallons. Only gone 50 miles so too soon to tell for sure, but it hasn't acted up on that fuel (yet).....maybe just dirty valves??? I hope it won't need head work, because that would definitely be the end of the line for me, considering the miles and multiple thousands to repair. I'd find some horrid Toyota hybrid or something.
 

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Have you had the car checked with VIDA and looked at what specific codes the car is giving?
 

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With those miles and going through a quart every 600 miles it may be time for a new motor or a new car for you. There have been a few posts of earlier SI six motors needing to be rebuilt, typically earlier than yours.

The electrical items would point to battery, alternator or both but that's secondary to the oil burning.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
With those miles and going through a quart every 600 miles it may be time for a new motor or a new car for you. There have been a few posts of earlier SI six motors needing to be rebuilt, typically earlier than yours.

The electrical items would point to battery, alternator or both but that's secondary to the oil burning.
It only goes through a quart that fast if it's almost due for an oil change. After a fresh change, it goes almost 2500 miles (depending on use) before needing a quart, then burns steadily faster after that. But it never burned a drop before the PCV vent box was replaced at 155k.

As far as Vida diagnostics, not yet. Figured I should tackle the common sense stuff first. I've driven the car to work and back every day this week and not had a single issue. It's performed flawlessly. I even got brave this morning and went full power while going up a hill and it didn't skip a beat. Maybe the injectors were just dirty and the top tier fuel is helping? I haven't run any kind of additive/cleaner in it because the manual says not to.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
The broader issue here is.... if it is time for a new car, WHAT ON EARTH DO I BUY????? All brands are having problems right now, even the staples for reliability. Toyota is recalling transmissions, and their V6 engines have VVT problems. Honda's new earth dream motors are having problems with oil dilution. Subaru head gaskets have always been suspect, and Nissan CVTs barely make it out of the factory. GM and FCA are on some other planet, and Ford is moving to this ecoboost stuff that's turbo and GDI, same as Volvo's SPA cars, and getting valve problems. I drive 35,000+ miles a year (Uber on weekends) and really want something that will outlast it's payments without needing serious work.

I really like my Volvo. I bought it with 100,000 miles, got an incredible deal, and it's treated me pretty well. But as the 200k mark approaches, I'm starting to worry about getting stranded somewhere at 2am.
 

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I think it may be coincidence that your started burning oil right at 155k when you had the breather box replaced. Either that or the repair went seriously wrong. From what I've read the replacement on these newer motors is a breeze compared to the old five cylinder motors.

As to what car to buy, maybe get another Volvo if you really like the XC60. The SPA XC60 has been out for a few years now so I would imagine that latter model years of the previous gen should be getting more reasonably priced.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I think it may be coincidence that your started burning oil right at 155k when you had the breather box replaced. Either that or the repair went seriously wrong. From what I've read the replacement on these newer motors is a breeze compared to the old five cylinder motors.

As to what car to buy, maybe get another Volvo if you really like the XC60. The SPA XC60 has been out for a few years now so I would imagine that latter model years of the previous gen should be getting more reasonably priced.
I took it back to the Indy and they denied any mistakes (predictably) and recommended an oil consumption test....when I already knew it burned oil.

I really do like my XC60. The only 2 problems with it are fuel cost (premium costs 60 cents more per gallon where I live and that adds up at 35k miles/year) and it not having a 3rd row for Uber/Lyft XL rides. It does qualify for Lyft Lux but not many people use it. So I'd either step up to a XC90 or down to a V60 or S60. In my area, Volvos tend to be pretty reasonably priced. I got mine for $13,000 back in January 2017. At the time it was worth over $20k according to NADA. I did find a 2014 XC60 almost just like mine at a BMW dealer with 80k or so for $14,000. Tempting, but again... known oil consumption issues. In some ways, I'd rather keep the monster I know than buy one I don't.

CPO Drive-e S60s are under $20,000 and get 40ish MPG. Also tempting, but is Volvo finicky with the warranty claims? Would they deny because I drive for Uber? Should I stretch it out to 10 years and put 300,000+ miles on it? I've never even owned a car that's under warranty before. Every warranty I've had has been "extended"....it extends from here to the end of the driveway LOL
 

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We've never used premium in our T6 and it runs okay. I haven't read of oil consumption issues on later T6 cars like mine. I'd rather take my chances with a later model year six cylinder T6 than a Drive E - just my opinion.
 

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The broader issue here is.... if it is time for a new car, WHAT ON EARTH DO I BUY????? All brands are having problems right now, even the staples for reliability. Toyota is recalling transmissions, and their V6 engines have VVT problems. Honda's new earth dream motors are having problems with oil dilution. Subaru head gaskets have always been suspect, and Nissan CVTs barely make it out of the factory. GM and FCA are on some other planet, and Ford is moving to this ecoboost stuff that's turbo and GDI, same as Volvo's SPA cars, and getting valve problems. I drive 35,000+ miles a year (Uber on weekends) and really want something that will outlast it's payments without needing serious work.

I really like my Volvo. I bought it with 100,000 miles, got an incredible deal, and it's treated me pretty well. But as the 200k mark approaches, I'm starting to worry about getting stranded somewhere at 2am.
Like everything else in this world, cars are throw away items. Everyone makes junk now, it's just the way it is. Putting 35k a year on a vehicle puts you in the extreme driver category. Unless you can drive a car that's a few years older and fix it yourself, there is no winning this game. You'll be in a constant cycle of wearing out a car every 3-4 years on then back to something else.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
We've never used premium in our T6 and it runs okay. I haven't read of oil consumption issues on later T6 cars like mine. I'd rather take my chances with a later model year six cylinder T6 than a Drive E - just my opinion.
Mine runs fine on 87, it just makes a ton of noise. The manual says it won't harm reliability, but it sounds awful. Seems to burn more oil as well. Wasn't 2012 fairly late in the model year run for the 6 cyl T6? It started production in 2007 and ran to 2015, right?

I agree on the topic of old gen T6 over drive-e, because of the turbo-gdi-vvt. But if the CPO warranty covers it all and it gets better MPG...
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Like everything else in this world, cars are throw away items. Everyone makes junk now, it's just the way it is. Putting 35k a year on a vehicle puts you in the extreme driver category. Unless you can drive a car that's a few years older and fix it yourself, there is no winning this game. You'll be in a constant cycle of wearing out a car every 3-4 years on then back to something else.
So sad, yet so true. There's a reason cars depreciate. Tyler Hoover is the best example of why not to buy old cars. I'm not very mechanically inclined... I stripped out the oil pan threads during an oil change....on TWO cars. I don't learn lessons.
 

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Mine runs fine on 87, it just makes a ton of noise. The manual says it won't harm reliability, but it sounds awful. Seems to burn more oil as well. Wasn't 2012 fairly late in the model year run for the 6 cyl T6? It started production in 2007 and ran to 2015, right?

I agree on the topic of old gen T6 over drive-e, because of the turbo-gdi-vvt. But if the CPO warranty covers it all and it gets better MPG...
I think the SI6 was produced from 2008 to 2015 and there were two versions - 2008-2010 and 2011-2015. Your motor is one of the earlier years of the 300 hp version and there have been a few threads on swedespeed about these early years as having oil burning problems. I haven't seen that yet with the 2014-2015.5 model years.

The Drive E that was outside of the early years that were prone to oil burning would be a 2017 and may be at the top end of your budget. I also wouldn't put total reliance on any CPO warranty - best to read the fine print.

Mileage probably depends on how the car is being driven. I would imagine there wouldn't be a lot of difference in the city but on the highway is where the Drive E mileage would shine.

What about a Honda Pilot for a different car? Has the third seat and that great Honda V6.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I think the SI6 was produced from 2008 to 2015 and there were two versions - 2008-2010 and 2011-2015. Your motor is one of the earlier years of the 300 hp version and there have been a few threads on swedespeed about these early years as having oil burning problems. I haven't seen that yet with the 2014-2015.5 model years.

The Drive E that was outside of the early years that were prone to oil burning would be a 2017 and may be at the top end of your budget. I also wouldn't put total reliance on any CPO warranty - best to read the fine print.

Mileage probably depends on how the car is being driven. I would imagine there wouldn't be a lot of difference in the city but on the highway is where the Drive E mileage would shine.

What about a Honda Pilot for a different car? Has the third seat and that great Honda V6.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volvo_SI6_engine Got curious. Started production in May 2006 so first cars it was actually sold with were likely 2008.

Money wise, it isn't the end of the world. I can afford to fix my car. But how long until the next thing fails? And the next? Who knows if the mechanic is cheating? And downtime is HUGE for me. I live alone, with no spare car. So basically I just want something that will work, and do so for a long time as long as I stay on top of maintenance. (which I'm really good at) Truthfully, I can afford to write a check for a new (very very base) XC40. I've looked HARD at the CPO XC90s, because it's one of only a handful of vehicles that qualify for Lyft Lux and XL, as well as UberSelect and UberXL. Regardless of ability to do so, am I really WILLING to dump that kind of money on a vehicle, then destroy it driving for rideshare? My current XC60 cost me $13,000, so that's the most I can lose to depreciation. But on the other hand, I'd get more years of service out of a vehicle with lower mileage. You're beginning to see the level of anxiety this is inciting...

I've owned a Honda before. A 1996 Accord LX. Bought with 200k, drove 10k and sold. Never burned a drop of oil and would run 130+ MPH. Great car, but pretty much everything was in the 90s. A 2016 Pilot EX-L with 50k is $26,000+/-. Same as a Highlander. But safety ratings aren't on par with Volvo's, especially the Highlander. In the past week, 3 people have been killed in head on collisions where I live. People can't drive here. I don't want to be next. I'd have to make sure it was a 2wd also. The AWD have a new 9 speed transmission and Motor Trend's long term '16 Pilot AWD had a transmission replaced under warranty. Maybe a fluke, but still makes me nervous for long term.

Sorry for being this way. You're being very helpful trying to get my head around this stuff and I really do appreciate it.

A list of vehicles that qualify for Lyft Lux, Uber Select, and both app's XL:
Lincoln MKT
Volvo XC90
Buick Enclave
Acura MDX
Mercedes GLK class
BMW X7
Audi Q7
I'd imagine the Escalade is there too, as well as the Navigator, but overhead is SO high in those.
 

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Actually, I'd recommend one that's not on your list - the Tahoe/Yukon, a little cheaper than the Escalade. Every time I take an Uber Select it's one of these or an Escalade. There's a reason why they're lined up outside every major airport in this country, lol.

None of the cars you listed will put up with more than a few years of 35k a year of use/abuse and while CPO is great, there's probably fine print negating coverage for livery use and your car will be sidelined for weeks waiting for parts from Europe - not good.

Sure, the Tahoe/Yukon won't get great mileage but will probably be more durable than any of the cars you listed - you just have to decide what's more important to you.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Actually, I'd recommend one that's not on your list - the Tahoe/Yukon, a little cheaper than the Escalade. Every time I take an Uber Select it's one of these or an Escalade. There's a reason why they're lined up outside every major airport in this country, lol.

None of the cars you listed will put up with more than a few years of 35k a year of use/abuse and while CPO is great, there's probably fine print negating coverage for livery use and your car will be sidelined for weeks waiting for parts from Europe - not good.

Sure, the Tahoe/Yukon won't get great mileage but will probably be more durable than any of the cars you listed - you just have to decide what's more important to you.
Interesting. Interesting. I also checked....Uber is no longer accepting new Select vehicles in Nashville.
 

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Interesting. Interesting. I also checked....Uber is no longer accepting new Select vehicles in Nashville.
I just rented a Navigator for a few days while on vacation in Florida - only thing that Alamo had in the class I paid for so I grabbed it. Nice ride - averaged 21 mpg over a few hundred miles driving. I didn't know anything about them so had to look it up - 3.5 liter V6 turbo, $75k to start.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I just rented a Navigator for a few days while on vacation in Florida - only thing that Alamo had in the class I paid for so I grabbed it. Nice ride - averaged 21 mpg over a few hundred miles driving. I didn't know anything about them so had to look it up - 3.5 liter V6 turbo, $75k to start.
Insanely expensive. That's a lot to lose in depreciation. I'd snap it up in 3 years when it's worth $30k. I did pass by a Yukon XL for sale on the road. Loaded, 4x4, and pristine. My tech friend begged me to buy it. I guess he really hates my Volvo (but inexplicably told me to keep it too) But it's a 2008 and the guy was a dealer but said "It's my girlfriend's". Fishy. He sent me the link to the ad ( https://nashville.craigslist.org/cto/d/hermitage-2008-gmc-yukon-xl-4x4-xlt-3rd/7016756286.html ) and it says it has no leaks, but the whole bottom of the engine looked shiny and wet when I looked under it with a flashlight. Since he is a dealer, I offered my Volvo (clean retail $8800) plus $1500 cash, but he countered me with $5500 cash. 2008 model limits me to just 2 or 3 more years I could drive it for Uber, and until the end of next year for Lyft, so seeing where this was gonna go with him, I decided to pass. I can get into a 2011 Yukon with fewer miles for only about $5000 more. Also, someone messaged me on here and offered $3,000 sight unseen, but that didn't go up after I sent pics. No offense to him, but that's well below rough trade. My Volvo has been working great lately. Even trying hard to replicate the issue, it's just not doing it. So I guess I'll be keeping it for a while longer. We'll see what happens.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I just rented a Navigator for a few days while on vacation in Florida - only thing that Alamo had in the class I paid for so I grabbed it. Nice ride - averaged 21 mpg over a few hundred miles driving. I didn't know anything about them so had to look it up - 3.5 liter V6 turbo, $75k to start.
Insanely expensive. That's a lot to lose in depreciation. I'd snap it up in 3 years when it's worth $30k. I did pass by a Yukon XL for sale on the road. Loaded, 4x4, and pristine. My tech friend begged me to buy it. I guess he really hates my Volvo (but inexplicably told me to keep it too) But it's a 2008 and the guy was a dealer but said "It's my girlfriend's". Fishy. He sent me the link to the ad ( https://nashville.craigslist.org/cto/d/hermitage-2008-gmc-yukon-xl-4x4-xlt-3rd/7016756286.html ) and it says it has no leaks, but the whole bottom of the engine looked shiny and wet when I looked under it with a flashlight. Since he is a dealer, I offered my Volvo (clean retail $8800) plus $1500 cash, but he countered me with $5500 cash. 2008 model limits me to just 2 or 3 more years I could drive it for Uber, and until the end of next year for Lyft, so seeing where this was gonna go with him, I decided to pass. I can get into a 2011 Yukon with fewer miles for only about $5000 more. Also, someone messaged me on here and offered $3,000 sight unseen, but that didn't go up after I sent pics. No offense to him, but that's well below rough trade. My Volvo has been working great lately. Even trying hard to replicate the issue, it's just not doing it. So I guess I'll be keeping it for a while longer. We'll see what happens.
 

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Uhh... Go buy another P3 T6 with less miles and trade this one in?
 

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Is ride sharing your main source of income? I asked because you seem to be putting a lot of stock in it.
 
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