From all my previous threads im sure you all know im having boost issues. (Only up to 10psi) Ive checked almost everything I can think of. I noticed that the previous owner played with the wastegate already and set it to 6psi. Im planning to set it back to the stock 4.5psi to get a baseline. My question is if the previous owner set the wastegate too high, what would it damage? Im also worried to what else they may have messed with :-/. The hunt continues:beer:
Wastegate Adjusting Question
1 - 17 of 17 Posts
I would like to clarify on some of your terms.
The item you are speaking of adjusting is the wastegate actuator arm. It connects the wastegate to the wastegate actuator, and whichever length it is set to dictates when the wastegate will open.
![]()
This is NOT the turbo from an R, but the quickest pic I could find.
The big shiny thing on the left is the acutuator, the actuator arm comes out of that, and then connects to the wastegate.
![]()
This is NOT an R turbo either, but gives you an idea of what the wastegate looks like from inside of a turbo. You can see the arm on the top right. When the arm actuates, it turns, which opens up cup looking thing with the arm inside of the turbo, dumping all exhaust out, instead of spinning the turbine, thus getting rid of boost.
So, with all of that said...
Having the wastegate actuator arm adjusted too high or low can cause various issues. So far, to my knowledge, poor adjustment does not BREAK anything, but it can lead to piss poor performance in a few different ways. It can limit boost, bring boost on too quickly, bring it too late.
I will warn you though, my father has gone round and round chasing down a boost issue on his R, and adjusting the wastegate actuator arm can be a TRUE PITA. Even with the tool from iPd, it can be tough to lock in right at 4.5psi.
I hope this helps, some.
The item you are speaking of adjusting is the wastegate actuator arm. It connects the wastegate to the wastegate actuator, and whichever length it is set to dictates when the wastegate will open.
This is NOT the turbo from an R, but the quickest pic I could find.
The big shiny thing on the left is the acutuator, the actuator arm comes out of that, and then connects to the wastegate.
This is NOT an R turbo either, but gives you an idea of what the wastegate looks like from inside of a turbo. You can see the arm on the top right. When the arm actuates, it turns, which opens up cup looking thing with the arm inside of the turbo, dumping all exhaust out, instead of spinning the turbine, thus getting rid of boost.
So, with all of that said...
Having the wastegate actuator arm adjusted too high or low can cause various issues. So far, to my knowledge, poor adjustment does not BREAK anything, but it can lead to piss poor performance in a few different ways. It can limit boost, bring boost on too quickly, bring it too late.
I will warn you though, my father has gone round and round chasing down a boost issue on his R, and adjusting the wastegate actuator arm can be a TRUE PITA. Even with the tool from iPd, it can be tough to lock in right at 4.5psi.
I hope this helps, some.
Thanks for the awesome pics, I learn more and more everyday on this forum. I really appreciate it. Yes you assumed correct I was talking about the actuator. I was told previously that if you unplug the TCV and take the car for a ride,tThe boost reading on my guage will read what it is set at. Is that correct? Do you think I should just leave it or at least try and bring it down closer to 4.5psi? At this point I might just leave it because the car runs fine besides only pushing 10psi.
That is correct
Joined
·
4,477 Posts
I think you unplug the yellow line...and have you replaced the vac lines yet?? Setting the PSI is easy...with two people..you have to look real closey to see when it starts to move..and another look at the gauge for the psi it starts to move at..
If you haven't done vac lines...I say do all the vac lines..even the one or two not goin to the TCV...and a snabb intake..and a CBV upgrade and an oil catch can all at once..cuz you never ever ever want to take that shiitt apart again
If you haven't done vac lines...I say do all the vac lines..even the one or two not goin to the TCV...and a snabb intake..and a CBV upgrade and an oil catch can all at once..cuz you never ever ever want to take that shiitt apart again
Ive done all the vac lines to the TCV when I put in a Phuzzy HD TCV(they all looked in extremely good condition). Id love to do a snabb intake and CBV upgrade but im still trying to recover my bank account from vacation a couple weeks ago haha Its all on the list of next things to buy for sure.
Joined
·
3,157 Posts
A base wastegate pressure of 6psi is pretty much ideal. I would leave it alone.
Do you have access to VIDA and a DiCE tool? If so, I would suggest doing some datalogging to compare the boost pressure that the ECU is reading from the stock pressure sensor (you'll have to subtract ambient pressure from the reading that VIDA gives in order to compare it directly to your boost gauge), as well as the target boost pressure that the ECU is trying to hit.
You probably also want to look at the temperature readings from the intake air temperature sensor, because if it is flaky and it is putting out temperature readings that are higher than actual, the ECU will be pulling timing and limiting boost.
I would also suggest pressure testing the intake piping from the MAF to the throttle body to verify that you don't have any leaks. You can build a leak tester yourself or just buy a ready-made one, like this one from siliconeintakes:
3.25" ID tester to directly couple to the MAF housing: http://www.siliconeintakes.com/prod...d=171&osCsid=a8e4b29b386fd83c9e89fa25da69195d
(You'll need a compressor to hook up to the intake tester to pressurize the system)
One thing that I know has caused some 04-05 R owners to have boost issues is a damaged or missing o-ring on the charge pipe that runs over the top of the engine. It is relatively easy and quick to check that it is still in place and undamaged. Here's a photo of the o-ring that I'm talking about (courtesy of rangeball):
![]()
You way also want to consider pulling off the intake and/or the downpipe to inspect the turbo housing for cracks.
Cheers,
Jeff
Do you have access to VIDA and a DiCE tool? If so, I would suggest doing some datalogging to compare the boost pressure that the ECU is reading from the stock pressure sensor (you'll have to subtract ambient pressure from the reading that VIDA gives in order to compare it directly to your boost gauge), as well as the target boost pressure that the ECU is trying to hit.
You probably also want to look at the temperature readings from the intake air temperature sensor, because if it is flaky and it is putting out temperature readings that are higher than actual, the ECU will be pulling timing and limiting boost.
I would also suggest pressure testing the intake piping from the MAF to the throttle body to verify that you don't have any leaks. You can build a leak tester yourself or just buy a ready-made one, like this one from siliconeintakes:
3.25" ID tester to directly couple to the MAF housing: http://www.siliconeintakes.com/prod...d=171&osCsid=a8e4b29b386fd83c9e89fa25da69195d
(You'll need a compressor to hook up to the intake tester to pressurize the system)
One thing that I know has caused some 04-05 R owners to have boost issues is a damaged or missing o-ring on the charge pipe that runs over the top of the engine. It is relatively easy and quick to check that it is still in place and undamaged. Here's a photo of the o-ring that I'm talking about (courtesy of rangeball):
You way also want to consider pulling off the intake and/or the downpipe to inspect the turbo housing for cracks.
Cheers,
Jeff
Joined
·
3,157 Posts
FYI, noeish posted a lot of great information about building and using an intake leak tester in this thread: http://forums.swedespeed.com/showth...k-AGAIN...-with-problems&p=1834616&viewfull=1
dustbom05, I'm in the same boat as you are. Apparently, the previous owner of my car replaced the cbv with the one from ViVA and might have left the actuator adjusted to aggressively. My symptoms are poor low rpm performance and slight hesitation if I go WOT at low rpms. Unfortunately, I haven't installed my boost gauge yet so I have no idea how much boost I'm developing but it doesn't feel like the full 14psi.
I've made a wastegate adjustment tool and I will attempt to adjust it to the stock 4.5psi this weekend and let you know of my results.
I've made a wastegate adjustment tool and I will attempt to adjust it to the stock 4.5psi this weekend and let you know of my results.
Please do, I wish I had time to work on the R this weekend but I have a day wedding saturday to go to and the 50mi bike race in NYC sunday.
I had a chance to take off my Charge Air Pipe yesterday to see if the oring was still good. I noticed whoever took it off last put the clamp on crooked causing a nice slice in the metal. The oring was fine and the slash didnt effect the seal when I put it back on THE RIGHT WAY. I did notice a lot of oil around the seal. I know your supposed to put some on the oring but deffinetly not this much. Any clue if this is ok/bad or what its from? Could it be the cause of my boost issue?
![]()
![]()
![]()
![]()
![]()
![]()
![]()
![]()
![]()
After having messed around with my wastegate this past weekend using my home-made adjustment tool, I've come to the conclusion that the wastegate actuator begins to move at about the same psi every time (give or take a little bit) that has no relation to the position of the rod adjuster. Think about it.. if you're pumping the actuator full of air pressure, it's going to start expanding internally at the same psi regardless of how long the rod is that's attached to it. Adjusting the rod length does nothing to the resistance of the actuator to the air pressure that is being pumped in. No matter how much I adjust the rod in one direction the actuator starts moving the rod at about the same pressure every time since the actual wastegate flap doesn't offer any resistance on its own.
The best result I had was by unscrewing the adjuster nut completely off of the actuator rod and marking the wastegate flap at it's closed position by feel. Then I reattach the wastegate arm to the rod and adjust it to where it felt firmly closed.. tighten the locking nut and voila.. no more hesitation.. no more piss poor low rpm performance. So basically I "adjusted" the wastegate the same way you would on the older turbo (like in the IPD tutorial video for it's wastegate adjustment tool). Anything else and the car felt incredibly sluggish at low revs because the flap was open allowing the exhaust flow to bypass the exhaust side propeller and thus taking forever to build boost.
If anyone can chime in with what I'm doing wrong and make sense of the ipd method of adjusting the wastegate it would be much appreciated. As for now I'm leaving it as is because the car has never felt so good at low revs as it does now.
The best result I had was by unscrewing the adjuster nut completely off of the actuator rod and marking the wastegate flap at it's closed position by feel. Then I reattach the wastegate arm to the rod and adjust it to where it felt firmly closed.. tighten the locking nut and voila.. no more hesitation.. no more piss poor low rpm performance. So basically I "adjusted" the wastegate the same way you would on the older turbo (like in the IPD tutorial video for it's wastegate adjustment tool). Anything else and the car felt incredibly sluggish at low revs because the flap was open allowing the exhaust flow to bypass the exhaust side propeller and thus taking forever to build boost.
If anyone can chime in with what I'm doing wrong and make sense of the ipd method of adjusting the wastegate it would be much appreciated. As for now I'm leaving it as is because the car has never felt so good at low revs as it does now.
Joined
·
3,157 Posts
There is a spring in the wastegate actuator. Chances are it's a linear spring with a linear relationship between force and displacement of the spring (see Hooke's law: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hooke's_law).
When you shorten the rod, you are compressing the spring (displacing it from its equilibrium position), which means that a higher amount of force is required before the spring will be further compressed (compared to the force required to compress it from its equilibrium position).
1 - 17 of 17 Posts
Join the discussion
Join now to ask and comment!