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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I didn't see anything in the last couple of years here, and wanted a biased :) opinion of why I ought to stick with a V90 R-Design instead of a similarly priced E400. Well, a reason besides bursting blue and MPG.
 

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I wanted to like the E400 wagon because my MB dealership is very very good and the engine was the same V6 as in a 2013 E-coupe I was leasing. Then I saw one. Granted, they were either black or grey. But to me the E400 wagon looked like a hearse...unless you get the AMG package and then you get run flats (and I'm assuming no spare of any kind). Frumpy and fat looking. Comparably equipped, the 2018's I looked at were $15K more than my Ocean Race. That being said, the engine/transmission performance of the MB is probably a level or two above the Volvo, based on the performance of the 4cylinder/9speed in the C300 I'm currently leasing, though I'm not sure it's worth the additional $$$.
 

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I totally agree with VLD1 and his comment. A year back I was looking at either the E400 wagon or the V90CC and unless I was gonna double my budget and get the E63S Wagon or a Panamera Turbo, there was no way I was opting for the Germans.
 

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I would spring for a used E63s before buying a new E400 or E450. It's an excellent wagon, but the pricing with options climbs very quickly. The turbo V6 us a gem, so if performance is the only measure, the Benz wins.
 

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I also have to agree with VLD1. I had built out a E450 and it was quite a bit more expensive than a similarly equipped V90. In fact I just hopped onto the MB website and configured another one equipped like my V90 being built. E450 came out to $84,340 msrp. MY V90 through the OSD program is about $63k.

My biggest concern about the V90 was the engine compared to the MB (and others). I'm coming from a 4.5 0-60 second car so that performance was a big consideration. I was lucky enough to drive a Polestar equipped V90, which sold it for me. With that tune the car is not slow, especially for daily city driving. That extra cost of the E450 is just not worth it.

I'd argue the V90 is a much better looking car than the E450, but the E63 trim is gorgeous. I also really not like the E450 interior options and overall look. But looks are subjective, so ya.

Also, Volvo has better color options and the packages are better put together. And lastly, I'd say my only other complaint about the V90, for the cost, is lack of cooled seats in the R-Design. It's super minor but kinda sucks to have to lose in a $70k car...
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I should have mentioned I'm comparing a 2018 E400 demo that's on fire-sale, so there's no price premium compared to 16% off MSRP on a '19 R-design with a few thousand on the clock. I was about to pull the trigger on the V90 even though it doesn't have the full-leather package or the B&W audio, which is a bit of a bummer, but then I saw that E400, which I had previously written off due to the cost differential.

Even a well-used the E63 is out of my budget, but it can't just be performance bias that makes the E63 look so good. This one is comparable to the fire sale one, aside from rims. I feel like it dodges the boring hearse look I get from a dark blue or grey one: https://www.ebautobrokers.com/detai...line_4matic_wagon-used-wddzh6gb8ja379034.html

I did a short road-trip in an E-class wagon in Europe a few years ago and liked interior and feel of it, but unsurprisingly that one didn't have 300+ HP. Good to know it's worth checking the P* perf; I've only test driven the V90 without it, and the driving felt bland (compared to my S60R). I'll look around Seattle and see if there's a tuned S90 or V90 available for a drive. I'm worried if I drive the E400, it'll be hard to give up the performance...

Other notes: DrivePilot is missing on the E400 I'm looking at, and I'll have to check how I feel about the missing touch screen for the infotainment. But I haven't recently tried sensus or pilot assist, so I guess it's off to the dealerships...
 

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P* moves it to a rear bias for one. Response is much better in city driving. Curves are well mapped. You don't feel that lag nearly as much without the P* (almost completely gone). Shift points are a bit more crisp as well. I drove an S90 without P* so that is my reference point. It's a much more engaging driving experience.
 

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It's entirely about equipment level for me. I prefer the well equipped Volvo, and equipping the Mercedes similarly will not make it similarly priced. I'm not willing to pay 33% more ($20,000) for a car with maybe 10% more to offer, and the V90 is even less expensive now (if you negotiate) than when I picked mine up.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Well, I went and test drove an E400 last week and while it exceeded the Volvo in many aspects, it completely failed in terms of UI for infotainment. Given that's one of the main interactions with the car, and I keep cars for a long time, it's off the list until Mercedes gets their touch screens in models and does a good job of it.
 

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Well, I went and test drove an E400 last week and while it exceeded the Volvo in many aspects, it completely failed in terms of UI for infotainment. Given that's one of the main interactions with the car, and I keep cars for a long time, it's off the list until Mercedes gets their touch screens in models and does a good job of it.
Interesting, and thanks for the update. I thought it was a very nice looking vehicle from the pics posted for the dealer site. But the small sunroof made it seem confined and a bit dark inside and would definitely need some window tinting. I think the Volvo would prove to be a much better experience to drive.
 

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I should have mentioned I'm comparing a 2018 E400 demo that's on fire-sale, so there's no price premium compared to 16% off MSRP on a '19 R-design with a few thousand on the clock. I was about to pull the trigger on the V90 even though it doesn't have the full-leather package or the B&W audio, which is a bit of a bummer, but then I saw that E400, which I had previously written off due to the cost differential.

Even a well-used the E63 is out of my budget, but it can't just be performance bias that makes the E63 look so good. This one is comparable to the fire sale one, aside from rims. I feel like it dodges the boring hearse look I get from a dark blue or grey one: https://www.ebautobrokers.com/detai...line_4matic_wagon-used-wddzh6gb8ja379034.html

I did a short road-trip in an E-class wagon in Europe a few years ago and liked interior and feel of it, but unsurprisingly that one didn't have 300+ HP. Good to know it's worth checking the P* perf; I've only test driven the V90 without it, and the driving felt bland (compared to my S60R). I'll look around Seattle and see if there's a tuned S90 or V90 available for a drive. I'm worried if I drive the E400, it'll be hard to give up the performance...

Other notes: DrivePilot is missing on the E400 I'm looking at, and I'll have to check how I feel about the missing touch screen for the infotainment. But I haven't recently tried sensus or pilot assist, so I guess it's off to the dealerships...
I find it interesting that this car was sent to auction if it was a “dealer car” per CarFax. Normally, dealers retail demos and service loaners. Wonder if something happened to the car that is not disclosed on the CarFax report.
 

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I wanted to like the E400 wagon because my MB dealership is very very good and the engine was the same V6 as in a 2013 E-coupe I was leasing. Then I saw one. Granted, they were either black or grey. But to me the E400 wagon looked like a hearse...unless you get the AMG package and then you get run flats (and I'm assuming no spare of any kind). Frumpy and fat looking. Comparably equipped, the 2018's I looked at were $15K more than my Ocean Race. That being said, the engine/transmission performance of the MB is probably a level or two above the Volvo, based on the performance of the 4cylinder/9speed in the C300 I'm currently leasing, though I'm not sure it's worth the additional $$$.
Yes
 

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I would spring for a used E63s before buying a new E400 or E450. It's an excellent wagon, but the pricing with options climbs very quickly. The turbo V6 us a gem, so if performance is the only measure, the Benz wins.
Not a bad idea if you can find a 2 yr old CPO'd E63 for under $60K.
 

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P* moves it to a rear bias for one. Response is much better in city driving. Curves are well mapped. You don't feel that lag nearly as much without the P* (almost completely gone). Shift points are a bit more crisp as well. I drove an S90 without P* so that is my reference point. It's a much more engaging driving experience.
I agree with this, w/ Polestar and the 2.0 update. Dynamic/Polestar mode also seems to be more livable on the highway - not holding lower gears so long when cruising. Generally, the car feels much quicker in P* mode; manual shift is fun.
 
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