SwedeSpeed - Volvo Performance Forum banner
1 - 20 of 53 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am nearly completely ignorant when it comes to automobiles. I have a 2001 XC70 with over 140K. As far as I can tell the transmission fluid has never been replaced (I inherited it from someone who was notoriously frugal). The tranny is not smooth between 1 & 2 and 2 & 3 at lower speeds/slow acceleration in city traffic (for example, the RPMs might spike to around 3K and then a clunk and then new gear engages).

I have two different service guys telling me two different things. Recommendation 1) don't do anything based on the premise that the fluid contains the remnants of my transmission and is keeping things together. Recommendation 2) flush and fill immediately. Can anyone give advice and reasons for taking either route? Could this be a problem with the throttle control sending off codes and not clearing (discovered today)?

Thanks and sorry for the idiotic question.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
309 Posts
I am nearly completely ignorant when it comes to automobiles. I have a 2001 XC70 with over 140K. As far as I can tell the transmission fluid has never been replaced (I inherited it from someone who was notoriously frugal). The tranny is not smooth between 1 & 2 and 2 & 3 at lower speeds/slow acceleration in city traffic (for example, the RPMs might spike to around 3K and then a clunk and then new gear engages).

I have two different service guys telling me two different things. Recommendation 1) don't do anything based on the premise that the fluid contains the remnants of my transmission and is keeping things together. Recommendation 2) flush and fill immediately. Can anyone give advice and reasons for taking either route? Could this be a problem with the throttle control sending off codes and not clearing (discovered today)?

Thanks and sorry for the idiotic question.
Recommendation #1 is what I'd also suggest... Unless you like to take chances.. There was a new b4 servo cover that may help 2nd/3rd gear flare. You could also try a transmission adaption reset.. That helps sometimes.. Then there is a valve body rebuild that possible could be an issue.. but with the valve body you'll be changing fluid anyways..
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks, both. I was figuring #1 and budgeting for a new transmission vs. weighing the option of a trade-in.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
63,543 Posts
Neither of the above!

NO POWER FLUSHING at these miles, but...if you do not have any codes and if the fluid is NOT burned

1: do a series of drain and fills (three drain and fills usually does the trick, one full case of fluid.) Go buy a case of Toyota Type 4 transmission fluid. It's much cheaper than Mobil 3309 and it's exactly the same fluid.

You MUST use this fluid, do not buy anything else except Mobil 3390 which is hard to find and is the same.

2: Have the software upgraded (Volvo dealer)

3: Reset the adaptions and have a new drive cycle performed, (Volvo dealer only for this or someone with a VIDA-DICE unit).

B4 servo (fairly cheap), only if you're having shift FLARES between 2nd and 3rd or 3rd and 4th gears. I wouldn't be a bad idea to replace it anyway after the drain and fills, but before the software update.

Depending what's wrong, it's quite possible it will get much better or even become perfect, but the steps above ARE the steps you take before declaring death and taking the tranny to the cemetery!

This is what you do before declaring it dead.

If you do nothing it WILL die.

The above steps ARE the correct steps to take if you want to try to save it but you will never know until you try.
Have a mechanic who is qualified to check the transmission fluid. If he or she states it's just very dirty but does not have a burned smell it's worth a shot.

Who you ask to check the fluid condition should not have a dog in this fight, just some independent who is not particularly a Volvo mechanic and NOT the person who may be doing this work or would install a new transmission.
Just a good mechanic who knows what to look for or in this case smell!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,640 Posts
JRL is right on here(of course ;) ), you want to change out that fluid ASAP and make sure the TCM software is up to date. When people say "flush the fluid" it can mean more than one thing, like mentioned you don't want to do a "power flush" but you can do the usual drain and fill through a case of Mobil 3309 or Toyota Type IV ATF. I usually mark a gallon jug at 2 qts and then pump out 2 qts and pour in 2 new qts, repeat till the fluid is nice and red. It's important to reset the transmission fluid counter after exchanging the ATF so the TCM knows it's new and adjusts accordingly.

We just bought a 2003 XC70 that had all sorts of terrible transmission problems and a fluid change and new TCM software fixed everything, despite the dealer telling us it would for sure need a new trans at +$5000.....don't give up on it yet.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thanks JRL and NJGreenBudd. Can either of you explain the process of the drain and fill. E.g. should there be any miles between them (I think I had read something like 100 elsewhere in the forums)?

Then after the drain and fills, I have the B4 servo replaced (if still having shift flares between 2&3/3&4) then software upgrade and reset. Correct?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
63,543 Posts
Just do them all at once, save time.
Sort of self explanatory, drain fluid, put new fluid back, same amount what comes out. Run for a minute, repeat 2-3 times until the fluid is CLEAN!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
786 Posts
I would DEFINITELY do drain and top off/refill maybe every 2 weeks at least 4X; We did this (not the same interval which honestly I am just pulling out the air) with my 2005 S60R automatic- no issues so far. I think each drain we pulled @3.24-3.5 quarts out.
I used a mix of Mobil 3309 and Toyota T-IV which my understanding is the same -compatible with Aisin-Warner 5 speed automatics. I found it cheaper to buy Toyota T-IV from a Toyota Dealer than to order Mobil 3309.
I went at least a month or 2 between drain/refills due to the out of town location of my mechanic otherwise I would have done the intervals quicker.

My understanding is many people have used Redline D4 Full Synthetic with success which is recommended by Redline as a replacement for Toyota T-IV:
http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=51&pcid=9

Redline application listing from their website for D4:
Mobil ATF 3309, JWS 3309, Toyota T-IV and T-III,
(96-'97 Supra Turbo, '98 Supra, '00 on Echo, Celica, '01-'03 Prius, '01-'03 Prius, '02-'05Camry and 4-cyl. Solara, Rav 4-4WD '01-'04 Highlander, Rav4, '03-'04 Sequoia, Tundra, Tacoma 2.7L, 3.4L, '03-'04 4-Runner w/4 speed,'03 Land Cruiser, '05 Tacoma)
(Volvo '01 to '04 C70, '01 on S40, V40, S60, S60R, '99 on V70, V70R and XC70 w/AW50AWD or AW55-50SN transaxle)

However I wouldn't go synthetic without changing all of the old fluid out first with Mobil 3309/Toyota T-IV and seeing how it behaves with that many miles on the original fluid.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,640 Posts
Don't drive it between drain and fills, do them back to back until it's clean. I like to row the gear shift back and forth while it's pumping out the old fluid too but I can't say for sure that does much.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
32 Posts
JRL is right on here(of course ;) ), you want to change out that fluid ASAP and make sure the TCM software is up to date. When people say "flush the fluid" it can mean more than one thing, like mentioned you don't want to do a "power flush" but you can do the usual drain and fill through a case of Mobil 3309 or Toyota Type IV ATF. I usually mark a gallon jug at 2 qts and then pump out 2 qts and pour in 2 new qts, repeat till the fluid is nice and red. It's important to reset the transmission fluid counter after exchanging the ATF so the TCM knows it's new and adjusts accordingly.

We just bought a 2003 XC70 that had all sorts of terrible transmission problems and a fluid change and new TCM software fixed everything, despite the dealer telling us it would for sure need a new trans at +$5000.....don't give up on it yet.
At the risk of getting flamed, would it be OK to pump out a quart or two at at time from the fill port, using a Mity Vac? I realize it probably makes more sense to let it drain, like changing oil, to get any crud out of there. The Mity Vac would make it easier to be precise.

Bill
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
63,543 Posts
No
It's not done this way
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
786 Posts
I wouldn't be that concerned especially with your mileage getting all the fluid exchanged at one time; it actually maybe less of a shock to the transmission to slowly freshen the fluid a few quarts at a time (drain and fill) over a period of time. As stated I have had no issues with my automatic since slowly over a year exchanging a few quarts at time. My fluid was a very dark brown when we started at maybe 80K miles on the odometer, I am up to 114K miles now but it has been at least 6 months since my last drain and fill. I plan to do at least 2X more drain and fills this year - its quick and easy to do. I live in a high rise and I can't work on my car in the parking deck (HOA rules) so I try to time maintenance when I visit my home town in AL through out the year with a mechanic I have known for 23 years.

We "snake" a piece of hose into the filler tube for the transmission and insert small end funnel into the hose to top off the transmission fluid after draining via the plug as it is a bit tricky otherwise to reach the transmission filler tube on the R models; I don't know if its easier on other model variants.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
808 Posts
VERY IMPORTANT if you don't know already, the trans is refilled via the dipstick tube ONLY! DO NOT touch the big bolt/nut on top of the trans! This bolt holds the 3rd gear band in place and bad things will happen if you remove it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,640 Posts
At the risk of getting flamed, would it be OK to pump out a quart or two at at time from the fill port, using a Mity Vac? I realize it probably makes more sense to let it drain, like changing oil, to get any crud out of there. The Mity Vac would make it easier to be precise. Bill
Hi, I wouldn't advise that for a few reasons, you are going to be sucking out the same flid you dump in the dipstick each time and it's certainly a lot more time and effort than letting the vehicle pump the fluid under it's own power. The correct way to do it is to unhook the return line from the trans cooler on the raditor and fit the 3/4" plastic hose over the end of the line. Then turn the car on and it will pump 2qts in about 30secs into the marked jug. Pour 2 new qts into the dipstick. Repeat till nice and red.

How much is a case of this trans fluid?
You can usually get Mobil 3309 around $70 a case, like here:
http://www.avlube.com/mobilatf3309.html

Toyota Type IV usually about $5 a qt from the local dealer.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
112 Posts
Just do them all at once, save time.
Sort of self explanatory, drain fluid, put new fluid back, same amount what comes out. Run for a minute, repeat 2-3 times until the fluid is CLEAN!
Please dont mind me butting in but I'm a bit confused. Do I,
1) buy 3 cans of 4 liters toyota Type IV oil and then drain-fill-discard *open new can* fill-drain-discard *open another can* fill-drain-discard.
or
2) just refill the same oil over and over again (3 times) before finally putting in new transmission oil (which means only using 2 cans of 4 liter oil)?
Over here they dont sell oil by quart (or 1 liter bottle), only in cans of 4 liter.

Thanks for the tips :thumbup:
 
1 - 20 of 53 Posts
Top