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The 2012 S60 R Design IS the new R

41K views 187 replies 49 participants last post by  Needsdecaf  
The point is your missing the point.
No, actually I think it is you who is missing the point.

All of the suspension bits will be available in the catalog. Speaking solely about performance, you can't build an M3 from an accessory catalog. Similarly, you can't build a Mazdaspeed car from an accessory catalog. I don't care about the cosmetics and labels. If you can build an R-design performance-wise from a catalog then "R-design" is nothing more than a cosmetics package. Don't mix my comments with those of others. I've made my differences in opinion regarding the R-design vs. R labeling pretty clear. If you read through the thread, you'll see my thoughts. Volvo is taking the one material differentiator between the T6 and the "R-design model" and, in my opinion, materially diluting its value. Blue dials and leather don't make a model. You'll be able to get the R-design suspension tweaks and engine tune from the catalog. That may not be important to you. I was simply giving my opinion. You don't have to agree.

-Eric
 
oh wow, so we are finally to the days where you have to pay to unlock the performance pent up in your car. A milquetoast s60 owner should not have to pay for software to unlock performance his car already has. This is massively lame.
You mean just like every Stage 1 kit offered by every aftermarket company that tunes a turbocharged car?! Welcome to 1995 if not even longer ago. ;)

-Eric
 
Buy it in the first place, or wait until later? Seems reasonable.
Not sure what you're talking about. If Volvo is offering the tune at the dealer, you'll be able to order the T6 with the tune the day you pick it up from the dealer. Why offer the "R-design" has a separate model? Is a distinct leather package a worthy differentiator for a separate model name?!?!

-Eric
 
Rumor has it that Volvo will sell the tune as an accessory for other T6 models which is why I have the opinion I do. If the difference between a T6 with an optional engine tune and an R-design is limited to interior leather then I see that as an insignificant advantage at best. What's the point?

-Eric
 
Wish the wheels weren't directional, hate one side looking like they are going backwards.
Do you mean you wish they WERE directional? If they weren't directional, then you'd have the problem of them pointing in different directions. Making them directional means that they're supposed to be pointing in the same direction on both sides if installed correctly, no?

Stupid name, should just have called it a T6R, "R-design" is stupid sounding. It has an upgraded suspension, more power, special interior, unique exterior... that makes it an R (except for brakes).
Except that you'll probably also be able to get all of the R-design goodies (including the tune) on a regular old T6 which doesn't make it all that exclusive or special. Calling it a T6R would have created even more confusion around whether or not it is an "R." You can't build an M or S4 from an accessories catalog. You shouldn't be able to do the same with a true R (at least not in my book). For this reason alone I'm happy they called it an R-design.

-Eric
 
YES. was in the past and still is. smoking air. I never complained my r was lacking power, it was faster to 100km/h then fact.figure. so I don't care how much whp she gave.
I'm not sure what complaining about your R's power has to do with it miraculously finding an extra 25hp/tq! It's one thing to say that someone's car might perform marginally better after break-in. It's another to suggest that a proper break-in will span the gap of 25hp/tq...which is just silly. Both cars will go through a break-in process. Assuming a 300hp car's performance improves marginally after break-in, wouldn't a 325hp car's performance also improve by a similarly small margin? I don't know what's being mixed into your air but I'd talk to the environmental board in your town. ;)

-Eric
 
I see the R-Design as a $10-$25,000 cheaper alternative than an S4, M3 or C AMG.
The S4 and M3 no longer play in the same league. The S4 makes 333hp and bases in the mid-$40Ks, whereas the M3 makes 400hp and bases in the mid-$50Ks. The currently unavailable RS4 is the M3's direct competitor. The S4 and R-design are the closest equivalents to one another and the R-design is competitively priced a few thousand less than the S4 (not $10K+ less). Don't expect to see any magazine articles comparing the R-design with the M3.

-Eric
 
While I understand your argument, it has its flaws. S4 owners can still buy an S4. It would be similar if the S4 was discontinued and the A4 S line was all that was available.
Actually, that's not quite accurate. Yes, there's an S4 but it's not really a direct market replacement for the previous model. In fact, the current car's specs are close to those of the car it replaced (much like the specs of the T6 to the R...funny, huh?). Previously, in the US, they sold a 2.0T, a 3.2, S4 and an RS4. The S4 was Audi's rival to the M3 in terms of performance and price until the RS4 came out as the A4's halo car (besting the M3's horsepower and price point as well). For the current generation A4, however, Audi did away with the 3.2 variant and, essentially, "downgraded" the S4 into the 3.2 replacement. Remember, when the RS4 came out, the S4 and M3 both made ~330hp.

-Eric
 
it will be called Red Headed Step Child when they come out with something wearing just an R badge. owners will really feel duped then knowing they dont have a true R....either from the past or the present.
Why? Did S4 owners feel duped when Audi decided to trump the S4 with an RS4? What about M owner when BMW released the "is"...which nips pretty closely at the heels of the M3. People know what they bought. Besides, most R owners don't even know what an R is. Why would R-design owners be any different? If it's a special order package, in most markets it's going to sell to people who simply want the top of the line, fully loaded S60. The fact that they call it an "R-design" will be lost on 99% of the customers. A fringe set of owners will care and only a percentage of those will show up on SS.

-Eric
 
You say, "ass."
He says, "aRse."
I say, "who gives a ****?"

Seriously, some of you are way too label conscious.

What if Volvo offered the equivalent of the R-design package (i.e., power, performance, cosmetics) and didn't call it anything? Too many people are bitching and moaning over whether T6R, R, R-design or sexual chocolate is the appropriate label for the car and almost nobody is talking about the merits of the car itself! The fact is, regardless of whether or not someone wants one or can afford one, if we're comparing the S60 R-design to the P2R, the R-design is a better car all around. Oh, and Volvo didn't call it an R. So, instead of complaining about its name and whether it is or should be an R, maybe try to see the bright side: 1) It's a great car, and 2) By not calling it an R, Volvo left room for an R in the line-up.

-Eric
 
why is Volvo afraid to use the R and just the R?

could it be because they know that simply upping the boost on an otherwise milquetoast car doesn't equal R?

Hell, at least call it a T6R like the original T5R....but stop dancing around the issue. It is either an R or it isn't. R-Deisgn is only a shadow of the former.
I think you answered your own question. An R-design is not an R replacement. It's the functional equivalent of a 335"is" as opposed to a 335i or M3. It has more power than the car upon which it is based, improved handling and a sports kit. What's wrong with that? Personally, I think calling this car an "R" would only further dilute the value of the R brand. Besides, who cares what they call it? Is that what everyone is flipping out about? Call it a T6+ for all I care. It's the specs that count.

-Eric
 
It's not that much of an increase but it can be appreciated they are finally adding some power to the mix.
The 300hp T6 is decent enough and supposedly offers acceleration times that are comparable to a late model GT equipped R (read: 6 sec +/- to 60mph). The R-design represents an increase of ~25hp and tq over the T6 model. That's not bad and, more importantly (IMHO), still leaves room for an R variant that would offer a little more power with some additional cosmetic tweaks and probably a 'unique to the R' technology upgrade (e.g., brakes, a DSG-like transmission, etc) to distinguish it from sub-models (much like the P2R introduced 4C, which was later rolled out to other models). If the R-design was a 400hp car...it would be an R replacement. I think this leaves room for Volvo to treat it like an IPL package or an "is" variant of the 335 and still roll out a halo "R" model if they want to do so in the future.

-Eric