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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Leading up to the appointment scheduled for Camera & BLIS not functioning occasionally and then the City Safety Reduced Functionality Service Required message on the DIM it stopped charging. The dealer suspects it's fuses to the tune of $840 ($80 for charging fuses and $760 in labor). It sounds like it's the fuses for the charging module (the ones that are on the battery and hard to get to). Of course being fuses they're not under warranty, but if there it were something else in the hybrid system it would be. Is it likely something else? In the XC60 forum I saw mention of a similar issue with the charging module and the OP being put through the ringer for the fuses first.

This visit's current estimate sits at $5500 pending they start working on it and find it's other thing(s).
 

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When the on-board charger fails, it typically blows one of the fuses. Mine did this at ~2 years, so they changed the fuse, it immediately blew again and they replaced the charger ($$$).

The TJ has instructions to always change the fuse first but that's unlikely to resolve the issue. It's similar to the air suspension pump procedure to change the fuse only for it to blow again shortly thereafter. Typical cost control measures that waste the customer's time.

The on-board charger is not considered part of the "hybrid system" because the non-plugin portion of the system still functions. So, it's not explicitly covered outside of an extended warranty. But, Volvo may consider this a "good will" case, which has happened to at least one person who posted here last year.
 

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it stopped charging. The dealer suspects it's fuses to the tune of $840 ($80 for charging fuses and $760 in labor). It sounds like it's the fuses for the charging module (the ones that are on the battery and hard to get to). Of course being fuses they're not under warranty, but if there it were something else in the hybrid system it would be. Is it likely something else? In the XC60 forum I saw mention of a similar issue with the charging module and the OP being put through the ringer for the fuses first.
When the on-board charger fails, it typically blows one of the fuses. Mine did this at ~2 years, so they changed the fuse, it immediately blew again and they replaced the charger ($$$).
The TJ has instructions to always change the fuse first but that's unlikely to resolve the issue. ... Typical cost control measures that waste the customer's time.
Ironically, EV battery fuses were discussed at work today!

Yes, most battery packs have several one-and-done (safety) fuses buried inside them. And just like fuses or circuit breakers in your house panel, replacing the fuse does not solve the underlying problem that caused the current surge but just flags that there's a problem and possibly where (like the garage or refrig). The most you can gleen from a broken fuse is which one and what electrical lines the fuse services such as A/C, charging, water pump, or several of these, etc - I'm just making these up as an example. I highly recommend you ask the techs / service advisor before they pull the fuse to remember which fuse tripped to help the debugging process.

So replacing a blown fuse and setting you on your way is really a waste of time until it happens again - and it will very likely happen again - because no competent electrical engineer designs an electrical system to trip a fuse.

Maybe discussing this reasoning with the tech and/or service advisor will motivate them to go beyond just replacing the fuse(s) and do some sleuthing, saving them and you time and headache down the road? Good luck!
 
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I'm not a tech, but I do work on my own cars. IMO a blown fuse normally means something else failed. It's possible a fuse was substandard, but more than likely something caused it to blow. I'd sure hate to replace a fuse that has an $800 bill without having some understanding of why it went.
 
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Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
I'm not a tech, but I do work on my own cars. IMO a blown fuse normally means something else failed. It's possible a fuse was substandard, but more than likely something caused it to blow. I'd sure hate to replace a fuse that has an $800 bill without having some understanding of why it went.
Right! That's the discussion I had with the service advisor and he said that they have to get to the fuse and see if that's the issue first to troubleshoot from there. It seems to be the same playbook as documented in this other thread on the XC60 T8 side of things. But this is in addition to charging me up front $210 just to diagnose it. So all told if it's only the fuses it'll be $1000. If it's the charger as some have indicated is the typical root cause then it seems like it'll double to at least $2000. I have been hoping it would be something like the charger but then I didn't realize it's not considered part of the Hybrid System. 🤯


It's the only mention of a T8/Recharge I found not charging and it's in line with @lamarguy own experience as well. It seems bogus for sure and a bit mind-blowing that Volvo designed the system to have a pair of fuses tucked in deep on top of the battery that would require such extensive work to replace. I'd already troubleshot other fuses that seemed related to the charger, but apparently not the ones not readily accessible without the right equipment.

I'm also surprised the on-board charger isn't considered part of the hybrid powertrain as it's core component for a PHEV. I recall recently someone had posted a list from Volvo of all the components considered within the hybrid warranty. Anyone have that list again? I've been looking for it and instead finding lots of Hybrid System Service Required posts with issues ranging form the old IGM failure to new batteries, to just about everything else but the charger.
 

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Don't they roll the diag fee into the repair if you follow through? The shops at dealers I've worked at generally waive the diag fee if you go ahead with the repair.

And are you saying the charger isn't part of the hybrid system for the warranty? I assumed it was too. Volvo isn't great at detailed questions when sales folks ask.....
 

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It seems bogus for sure and a bit mind-blowing that Volvo designed the system to have a pair of fuses tucked in deep on top of the battery that would require such extensive work to replace. I'd already troubleshot other fuses that seemed related to the charger, but apparently not the ones not readily accessible without the right equipment.
These battery management system (BMS) modules are very complex and the protection system is not typically designed by automakers so automakers have to buy these modules from component suppliers who have this expertise. Automakers require these suppliers' modules to break fuses in their module out of liability concerns - automakers just don't have the time, expertise, infrastructure, desire, etc to design every last detail.

Unfortunately, inaccessibility to changing these fuses is standard in the EV industry, for the foreseeable future.
 
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Heard back from service this afternoon and as expected, the fuses blew out immediately on them upon replacing them. They've now validated it's the onboard charger. Only they're adding an incremental $2700 to replace it and not taking off the $960 charge to replace the fuses which wasn't the problem. Still in disbelief that the onboard charger isn't covered under the hybrid system warranty.

The total estimate is now >$8200. 🤯

 

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Wow, just wow. Unbelievable.
The plug-in portion of the plug-in hybrid is not covered? Doesn’t make much sense at all.

With my own tow hitch software issue and many other warranty issues, I’m wondering if I should just sell our <500mi XC90 right now. These are great cars, but the difficulty (and high cost) in repairs just make me sad.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Wow, just wow. Unbelievable.
The plug-in portion of the plug-in hybrid is not covered? Doesn’t make much sense at all.

With my own tow hitch software issue and many other warranty issues, I’m wondering if I should just sell our <500mi XC90 right now. These are great cars, but the difficulty (and high cost) in repairs just make me sad.
Yes, I saw your post about your troubles with the tow module. It seems odd that the p/n on the module is different than the part number on the packaging it comes in. The car is great and we enjoy our XC90s quite a bit. The T8 is amazing! Getting into a T6 loaner is always a disappointment the different is that great but it's shocking how all of a sudden it had a cascade of issues (one mechanical - the air suspension dust cover slipped off but that was a known problem due to use of plastic zip ties retain the cover in place by ATE (supplier) and was later revised to use metal straps. The rest were all electrical components failing which makes me wonder if the onboard charger may not have lead to a series of systems failures. The ADSM control module is for CitySafety, turns out a separate relay was what was causing problems with the camera and BLIS, and of course the blown charging fuses behind the charge port which were blown by the onboard charging module.

I'm wondering if it wasn't all (except mechanical bit) triggered by potential surges or problems with the charger prior to fuses interceding, especially if there was low voltage situation/low current that is more likely to damage circuits than an outright spike which fuses protect against.
 

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That price is approaching a full on ICE replacement . This really sucks.... Just to confirm, this isn't covered under the factory warranty? Extended warranty? CPO? Can't remember what coverage you're currently under.

Sent from my SM-G781V using Tapatalk
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Yeah, well $40 out of $8200, that is nuts.
The labor for those 2 fuses is $960 and the diagnostic fee to troubleshoot that was $209. But yes the whole thing is just surreal at this point.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
That price is approaching a full on ICE replacement . This really sucks.... Just to confirm, this isn't covered under the factory warranty? Extended warranty? CPO? Can't remember what coverage you're currently under.

Sent from my SM-G781V using Tapatalk
The charger and charging module fuses are not covered by the Hybrid System Warranty. The service advisor specifically reached out to the Volvo Warranty person on that and it was expressly declined as that component of the hybrid system is not covered.

And of course the dust cover slipping off due to Volvo having accepted air springs assembled with zip ties is also something Volvo is not offering any sort of assistance with post warranty despite clearly being a poor design choice/flaw much like the air compressor for which they did offer an extended warranty to all owners. I’m grateful for that one as our compressor failed within one month of the car coming out of warranty last summer and it resulted in a series of misters by the dealer that attempted to fix it, ultimately taking them 3 new compressors, control modules, and tools they learned late they didn’t have to do the work properly in the first place. 3 months at a dealer >1100 miles from home. Still the air springdust cover being a known issue with a TJ describing it and how to resolve with metal straps seems like it should be offered an extended warranty as they’re known to have a problem that will lead to suspension failure. I submitted an NHTSA complaint on that one and used the TJ as additional evidence of a know defect on critical component. It won’t help me now with the $1500 cost out of the $8300 estimate but I hope at some point it avoids others that expected burden.
 

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The charger and charging module fuses are not covered by the Hybrid System Warranty. The service advisor specifically reached out to the Volvo Warranty person on that and it was expressly declined as that component of the hybrid system is not covered.

And of course the dust cover slipping off due to Volvo having accepted air springs assembled with zip ties is also something Volvo is not offering any sort of assistance with post warranty despite clearly being a poor design choice/flaw much like the air compressor for which they did offer an extended warranty to all owners. I’m grateful for that one as our compressor failed within one month of the car coming out of warranty last summer and it resulted in a series of misters by the dealer that attempted to fix it, ultimately taking them 3 new compressors, control modules, and tools they learned late they didn’t have to do the work properly in the first place. 3 months at a dealer >1100 miles from home. Still the air springdust cover being a known issue with a TJ describing it and how to resolve with metal straps seems like it should be offered an extended warranty as they’re known to have a problem that will lead to suspension failure. I submitted an NHTSA complaint on that one and used the TJ as additional evidence of a know defect on critical component. It won’t help me now with the $1500 cost out of the $8300 estimate but I hope at some point it avoids others that expected burden.
So the hybrid system warranty is separate from the factory warranty? Does it overlap with any other coverage? Can't remember if you have a VIP or CPO or anything. I didn't see the charging system fuses listed as not covered under platinum.

Sent from my SM-G781V using Tapatalk
 
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