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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
hey all, <br> long time lurker, first thread i've started here. i'm been following swedespeed for at least a year now reading about the r (good and bad). actually as i type this i'm wearing a nordkap blue r hat from takspeed. anyways, i'm going to be purchasing a car soon and i've been im'ing some of you (thanks for your help) about the r and figured i'd start a thread to get more opinions. I guess before I go any further I should say that I value low end torque and will use the car as a daily driver with the occassional autocross. Also, whatever car I buy I intend to drive for a long time-I'm not into selling and buying a new one every couple of yrs. (I drive a 1992 audi 100 with 185k miles and it's going strong). Also, I dont want another fwd car. the audi is nice but i much prefer rwd or awd. With all that said (thanks for reading if you still are <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/tongue.gif" BORDER="0"> ), some of the cars I've considered were the bmw 335i but i dont trust the new engine and bmw's can get pricey to maintain. i also considered the infiniti g35 6mt but it doesnt do it for me. I drove an 05 and didnt like it though the 07 is new. anyways back to the title of this thread. i found this r on ebay:<br><A HREF="http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230021222003" TARGET="_blank">http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...22003</A><p>I talked to the dealer and offered 30k even (invoice - 7500) and he said he wouldn't budge from his 33k asking price (basically msrp-7500) i know a big knock on this car is the lack of premium package but i could live without a sunroof and could upgrade the stereo in time. i've test driven a r and even on the 20 min test drive i experienced the dreaded wheel hop. i would want to put tme springs on it but i read threads about dealers trying to void warranty work (r kellys car comes to mind). the other car i considered in this price range is the sti limited:<br><A HREF="http://www.rsportscars.com/eng/cars/impreza_limited.asp" TARGET="_blank">http://www.rsportscars.com/eng...d.asp</A><p>it is priced the same as the 07 sti (34,120 including destination) and it has some features the r doesnt have (sunroof, dccd) but i'll be the first to admit its interior is not as nice as the r's. the r seems a little more spacious even though that's not its strong point either. both have heated seats so amenities wise they're somewhat even. performance wise the sti limited is better than the r and can be modded to a greater degree. subaru's awd system is pretty good. the r uses haldex meaning it's fwd untill power is sent to the rear wheels, right? finally, i want it to last and have some concerns about the electrical components of the r like 4c lasting 100+k miles. i saw in a recent thread that someone has 92k on theirs so that was nice but overall the r seems more problematic. I'd like to hear from r owners and anyone who may have driven the sti on their experiences. thanks in advance for your responses.
 

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I personally tried to buty two cars from Superior, an XC90 V8 and an S60R. I found them very arrogant and unwilling to negotiate at all, probably the most arrogant delaership I have ever dealt with, but if you can buy the car for the price you want who cares I guess.
 

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Re: s60r vs sti limited (vpolineni)

sti's are nice cars and the sti ltd is a nice grown up addition. To say the sti is faster is kind of 50-50. You can launch the crap out of an sti and it pulls hard through the lower gears, but if an r and sti did a highway run, say 40-100, the R with a competant driver should win. 06 R's can be had very cheap. The '07 sti ltd will have one hefty dealer markup over the msrp, so dont expect to see 34k as a starting point for negotiations.
 

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Re: s60r vs sti limited (gonelaxin)

Resale without a Premium Pkg would be<B> AWFUL</B>
 

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Re: (C130)

You can count on the R to be maintenance heavy, specially when 100K miles are gone thru it's wheels. May be the STi would be more reliable over time. The boxer engine from the Sti and it's mechanicall components are nice but the Subaru's desing and finish already looks-feels old.<p>But really, these are two very different cars, may be you should drive them both again and then decide. If you do 185K in 14 years (2006-1992) that's 13.2 K miles per year not too much, so the looks would be more important and the R will certainly age better and look classier over time than the Sti.
 

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Re: s60r vs sti limited (JRL)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>JRL</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Resale without a Premium Pkg would be<B> AWFUL</B></TD></TR></TABLE><p>I sure hope he likes that R because there's little chance of escape if he buys it. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/eek.gif" BORDER="0">
 

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Re: s60r vs sti limited (vpolineni)

A well thought-out writeup. <p>As much as I want to encourage you to get an R I'm not sure I would expect one to provide you with inexpensive transportation up to and beyond 100K miles. As much as I love my car - and it has been very reliable so far - I will likely be selling it (as will many others I think) before its extended warranty coverage expires. There are too many expensive-to-repair items on the R and, worse, several of these items are proving to be problematic... $1,200 struts, angle gear failures, $2,000 clutches, etc. I suggest choosing an R with the Premium Package if you do opt for one.<p>I'm not a Subaru fan, so it's hard for me to encourage you to go that route. The STI looks ugly and cheap to me, both inside and out. The new Limited version is a vast improvement, though. Subaru can pack as much luxury and sportiness into their cars as they want to, but in the end it's still *just* a Subaru. That said, it will probably be a good choice for the long haul.<p>The early-'90's 100-Series is a nice car, especially if it has CS trim. Congrats on the high mileage. I hope it keeps running strong.<p>Best of luck with whichever car you choose.<p>- Tryg<p>
 

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wow i never knew there was a "grown up" edition STI. I think it looks awesome. Having driven a regular one, I know it drives and handles just as well too. The only thing I didn't like about the car was what the limited has done. Made it classier and more like the Legacy. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://********************/smile/emthup.gif" BORDER="0">
 

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i have to say, I think the STi version looks better. The "limited" version looks lame. The STi may be ricey looking, but at least it looks sporty/fast. That limited thing just looks lame and boring.<p>i wouldn't want an R long term. the closer you get to 100k miles, the more and more stuff is going to go wrong and cost you a pile of money<p>I have 53k miles on mine, it's still going strong, and i Love the car, but I don't see myself keeping it to 100k. <p>I can sense that by the time it has 75k - there will be a pile of repairs. struts, clutch, timing belts, etc etc..... unless you drop another $3000+ for the extended warranty, figure you'll spend AT LEAST that much or more on repairs from 50k-100k.<p>i'd rather just get a newer car.<p>the R is a great car, but not sure it's a "long term" keeper car.
 

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Re: (23109VC)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>23109VC</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>the R is a great car, but not sure it's a "long term" keeper car.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>I'd love to hear why you think this when you can get a CPO with about 4 years + and 75,000 miles plus of warranty left?
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
wow i go out to run some errands and see all these responses! thanks again. just to address a couple of things:<br>-gonelaxin, there is no markup for the car. i can purchase it at msrp and if anything will try and get some taken off. <br>-JRL, i know premium package would kill resale but like i said i could live without sunroof and wouldn't replace the car untill resale is a non-factor anyways. If anything I thought that the lack of premium package would kill the value now so i could get it for 30k. but superior volvo is adamant as of right now about the price.<br>sean, i noticed that you have the evolve power pack on your car. with either car i'd be tempted to mod since you can gain nice benefits from turbos but there's the issue of mods and dealers with volvo far more than with subaru and the sti. oh well i'll think about it some more but my gut reflects what a lot of you have said-the r isn't the best choice for a long term car. thanks again for all of your input. this is one of the best forums i've visited.<br>btw, if i go with the sti i will have 2 18" pegasus wheels for sale cheap. i believe the color is graphite but i'll check. both are in excellent condition and obviously havent been mounted/used. let me know if you're interested.<BR><BR>
<i>Modified by vpolineni at 6:51 PM 8-23-2006</i>
 

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Re: s60r vs sti limited (vpolineni)

Must have been an ordered car that the dealer got stuck with because most would not order one without Premium unless it was already sold. The R will most likely require more repairs than the STI but is a very different car altogether. Really depends on your preference. That buy-it-now price on the R seems pretty reasonable to me, given the rarity of Sonic Blue. I would get the R but realize that resale will be low without the Premium package.
 

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Re: (vpolineni)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>vpolineni</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> "... with either car i'd be tempted to mod since you can gain nice benefits from turbos but there's the issue of mods and dealers with volvo far more than with subaru and the sti. ..." </TD></TR></TABLE><p>I would not mod the car too much if I would like to keep it for many years, at least with the same engine.<p>You have a dilema here because Volvo won't let you mod the R and you may very well get bored-tyred of the STi in a few years.<p>Good luck.
 

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Re: s60r vs sti limited (vpolineni)

Have you actually found any of these Sti's on a lot or up for order? I have heard that since there are only 800 of them, they will be very hard to come by and I have yet to see one in person. <p><br>The R may have issues over 100K, but the newer models have seemed to resolve many of the issues that the '03~'04 crowd now has. I have had a number of problems, but know many people with '05's+ that have put on more miles than myself and been trouble-free. <br>
 

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Re: s60r vs sti limited (JRL)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>JRL</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Resale without a Premium Pkg would be<B> AWFUL</B></TD></TR></TABLE><p>Unfortunately, resale <b>WITH</b> Premium Pkg will be awful. And, being the last year of the current platform won't help it either. Is that a precipice I see ahead? Its fairly steep.<p>-Eri
 

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Re: s60r vs sti limited (Sue Esponte)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Sue Esponte</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Unfortunately, resale <b>WITH</b> Premium Pkg will be awful.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>If you're comparing to MSRP...of course. If you're comparing to out the door price after incentives, not much different than most other brands.<p><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Sue Esponte</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> And, being the last year of the current platform won't help it either. Is that a precipice I see ahead? Its fairly steep.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>IMO, all depends on what the next S60 will bring to the table. If a non R (if there is another R that is), has higher horsepower, AWD, and a manual available, the R may be further diminished.
 

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Re: s60r vs sti limited (MagoonR)

hi,<p>just looking from outside, <p>subaru = simply a friggin ugly rally car, initially designed for motorsports and track purposes, which has nothing but a powerful boxer engine and awd. it has a hideous and old looking design, crappy uncomfortable interior and very low material quality. not to mention its cheap, ricey, low class image. very very bad choice as a daily driver IMO. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://********************/smile/emthdown.gif" BORDER="0"> <p>volvo = a high class luxury-sport sedan with a beautiful design, a very comfortable and roomy interior and high material quality. it has worldwide prestige and class that may be compared top class sedans of bmw, benz or audi. not to mention its powerful turbo engine, which can make it a serious opponent - especially if modded - to some supercars and most rally cars like the sti's and evo's on the streets. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://********************/smile/emthup.gif" BORDER="0"> <p>best of luck with your choice man <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/smile.gif" BORDER="0">
 

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Re: s60r vs sti limited (Serdar-S60T5)

My thoughts were, before you get too far into thinking about troublesome issues with R, you better get on a Scooby forum and do some searches.<p>The trans is huge problem and they love to void warranties at Subaru just like Volvo. It's a business wide thing these days.
 

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Re: (vpolineni)

Take a look at a new one through Euro Delivery and see what they will sell it to you for. It might surprise you, plus you'll get a sweet two-person vacation thrown in for free (virtually). The OSD pricing begins in the $34K range, trip included, assuming they aren't extending the same incentives to these orders. It's a really cool program and a very fun experience.<p><A HREF="http://www.volvocars.us/salesandservices/overseasdelivery/default.htm" TARGET="_blank">http://www.volvocars.us/salesa...t.htm</A><p>Get a new one and configure it to your liking - Sonic Blue on its own may be more difficult to sell down the road since it's a "love it or hate it" color and not having something people expect (like a sunroof) will also narrow your field of buyers. I suggest that you pass on the R on eBay, but you're right that the price is quite reasonable. Is this a lease-only price (I assume not since it is on eBay)?<p>Go with your gut! Just be sure you have a strong stomach... <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/rolleyes.gif" BORDER="0"> <p>- Tryg
 

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Re: s60r vs sti limited (Dzljet)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Dzljet</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">My thoughts were, before you get too far into thinking about troublesome issues with R, you better get on a Scooby forum and do some searches.<p>The trans is huge problem and they love to void warranties at Subaru just like Volvo. It's a business wide thing these days.</TD></TR></TABLE><br>I totally disagree I still own a Sti and although it's only been to th dealer twice for the cosmetic issues, it has been modified and while there they made no bones about it as a matter of fact many dealers sell aftermarket turbos intercooler areo kits etc. I've only heard of them voiding warranties when the car was abused as they should, only morons go out and beat their cars to death and then expect the dealer to flip the bill. <p> I think you should only buy an Sti if you want a stiff ride and basically and glorified econo box compared to the "R". Don't get me wrong I think the Sti is a great car but for younger man who still wants to race around town or back roads. I don't think the "R" can keep up with the Sti by any means especially after it's been modified.
 
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