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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I'm dealing with an issue on this new to me 06 S60R M66 Passion Red. Ive had it 1 month.

I've had a hard starting issue since i got it, and through all the maintenance I've done now (new battery, low-mileage used starter too, as well as PCV, TCV, CBV, FPS, fuel filter, rebuilt injectors, silicone lines, new plugs, MAF, and more).... it's still present. (New ignition coils on the way, just to be sure.)

FACTS:

The tach jumps while trying to start it. This seems to be a big clue.

It takes 10 seconds or so or cranking it before it'll catch.

I've replaced the camshaft position sensor, AND the crankshaft position sensor (RPM sensor.)

I'm getting a RPM sensor (crankshaft position sensor) code in VIDA. Before and after replacing the RPM sensor.

9 times out of 10, the hard start eventually DOES start and it runs fine, performs just as it should and it's great. But that 1 time, it'll start with a "reduced engine performance" msg on the dash.

I know the seller replaced the clutch before selling it. I asked and asked, but he never got me the paperwork on what he used on it. He had mentioned it was a SACHS kit.... which I looked up on FCPEuro, and 1.) it's the cheapest one they offer (great)... and 2.) It looks like it may not be right for my VIN. (YV1RH527962538775) ... their website says "Up To Chassis -529999 (Last 6 Digits of VIN)".... in which case that wouldn't match. But the clutch seems to work/drive great. No issues there at all.

UPDATE: Seller is now saying it was the LuK kit. Still bugging him for some paperwork, or at least the email confirmation on his parts order. I really doubt this is an issue with the wrong clutch.

From what I gather, it's possible that this could be interference with the sensor and power cables in that area, or an issue with the wiring or connection. I'll inspect all that, clean the contacts, double-check my install, and double-check that the power cables are in the correct position.

But also.... I'm reading it could be from a missing or loose bell-housing bolt, or the mating surface between engine and transmission wasn't cleaned possibly? Ugh. Ugh, real close to redoing the whole clutch job in that case.

Any of this sound familiar?

Thanks for the help!
 

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If they replaced the flywheel with a wrong one then that might cause it. But more likely the bracket where the crankshaft position sensor sits in is dented from removing/installing the gearbox. Take it out and make sure its clean of foreign metals and nice and round.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
If they replaced the flywheel with a wrong one then that might cause it. But more likely the bracket where the crankshaft position sensor sits in is dented from removing/installing the gearbox. Take it out and make sure its clean of foreign metals and nice and round.
Ok. I'll check that out.

So I remember when I had the sensor out... it's just a hole. And you can see the flywheel or clutch or whatever it is through that hole. You're saying that's a bracket? I'll look again.
 

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If he installed a SMF (single mass flywheel), then the earlier clutch would be required to mate to it. This issue can be caused by not cleaning the mating surface between engine and trans. I've heard of that from Volvo techs who have dealt with just this issue in the past.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
If he installed a SMF (single mass flywheel), then the earlier clutch would be required to mate to it. This issue can be caused by not cleaning the mating surface between engine and trans. I've heard of that from Volvo techs who have dealt with just this issue in the past.
Geez, that sounds like an awful job. Separating the two and cleaning it.
 

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I've seen this a few times and it's been the starter. I know you listed it as being low-mileage, but how low?

The cars I diagnosed with this issue would see a huge current draw and low speed while cranking, causing low a)low voltage at the ECM -which by itself can cause a bunch of issues- and b) a very unstable wave form at the crank position sensor. After the initial spike these issues smooth out enough to let the car start. ECM sets RPM code because it can see the key in the 'start' position, but it doesn't pick up engine RPM within a certain amount of time. The crank sensor holder should also have a shield in the cavity that is supposed to help cancel out interference, I noticed Volvo updated this part somewhere around the 03-04 production range. Replacing these components has proven to successfully fix this issue on the few I've seen with this issue.

edit: contrast is also right on the money.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Its an inductive sensor so if the metal is damaged, it disturbs the magnetic field created by the sensor.

Ok.... this is great... I will definitely check that out.

So am I looking at the underside of this piece on this picture? That piece is facing down INTO the hole? And the RPM sensor's silver cylinder piece slide into there? This doesn't look familiar, probably because i was repalcing JUST the sensor and not even really looking at this. But I'll check it out again.
 

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If he installed a SMF (single mass flywheel), then the earlier clutch would be required to mate to it. This issue can be caused by not cleaning the mating surface between engine and trans. I've heard of that from Volvo techs who have dealt with just this issue in the past.
I find this really hard to believe, that it would be caused by a poor electrical connection between the two components? There are something like 18 bolts holding the surfaces together, and it has to be something like 12-15 square inches of surface area contact.

If it were an electrical connection issue, could you not just toss a small ground strap between the engine and trans?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I've seen this a few times and it's been the starter. I know you listed it as being low-mileage, but how low?

The cars I diagnosed with this issue would see a huge current draw and low speed while cranking, causing low a)low voltage at the ECM -which by itself can cause a bunch of issues- and b) a very unstable wave form at the crank position sensor. After the initial spike these issues smooth out enough to let the car start. ECM sets RPM code because it can see the key in the 'start' position, but it doesn't pick up engine RPM within a certain amount of time. The crank sensor holder should also have a shield in the cavity that is supposed to help cancel out interference, I noticed Volvo updated this part somewhere around the 03-04 production range. Replacing these components has proven to successfully fix this issue on the few I've seen with this issue.

edit: contrast is also right on the money.
The starter I installed had about 60K. You're right, I should get a new one.

The cranksensor holder... that's the picture that contrast shared?
 

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I find this really hard to believe, that it would be caused by a poor electrical connection between the two components? There are something like 18 bolts holding the surfaces together, and it has to be something like 12-15 square inches of surface area contact.

If it were an electrical connection issue, could you not just toss a small ground strap between the engine and trans?
I didn't believe it at first either when I first heard of it but had 2 Volvo dealer techs tell me the same story independently so take it for what it is. I stumbled across it when I was having issues getting my car running after I R&R'd the head and turbo and was running out of options...I was being patient with the tuner. Ultimately his tune was the issue. :rolleyes:
 

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Its an inductive sensor so if the metal is damaged, it disturbs the magnetic field created by the sensor.
Sounds like the most likely issue but starter also sounds quite possible. Easier than decoupling the engine and trans no doubt. I would go in that order - check sensor, then starter then trans to engine interface.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Sounds like the most likely issue but starter also sounds quite possible. Easier than decoupling the engine and trans no doubt. I would go in that order - check sensor, then starter then trans to engine interface.
Agreed. I'm going to get in there and inspect the sensor, wiring, connector, and I have a new starter and new sensor holder on order. Should have them Tuesday and the day off of work... so we'll see. You're right, that's a lot easier / cheaper than anything else. Good place to start.

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RPM sensor, hard starts, tach jumping, "reduced engine performance"

It's from the block and trans service not being clean before putting it back together. Unbolt it and separate a little bit and clean the service with some scotch brite or something. It'll fix it. Ben had to do it on my brothers 06 S60 T5M that had the engine replaced. Tach jumped, all the bs. Oxidation on the block or trans case will cause the interference. Just clean it.

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
It's the starter, pulls to much amps and creates a magnetic field which interrupts the rpm sensor signal. It's somewhat common on these cars, and causes your symptoms exactly.
Hoping so. New starter is on the way.

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
It's from the block and trans service not being clean before putting it back together. Unbolt it and separate a little bit and clean the service with some scotch brite or something. It'll fix it. Ben had to do it on my brothers 06 S60 T5M that had the engine replaced. Tach jumped, all the bs. Oxidation on the block or trans case will cause the interference. Just clean it.

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Damn man. You make it sound easy... but still have to drop the subframe and all that. Essentially most of the way to a clutch job. Right?

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Before you go through all that trouble, make sure the main ground wire is going to the engine, and that its attached to a clean point. Shop that did the clutch work may have forgotten to attach it, or didn't to a good job of doing so.

It connects the front left fender area to the front of the transmission housing.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Before you go through all that trouble, make sure the main ground wire is going to the engine, and that its attached to a clean point. Shop that did the clutch work may have forgotten to attach it, or didn't to a good job of doing so.

It connects the front left fender area to the front of the transmission housing.
Driver's side?
 

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Yes. Unbolt it from the trans and clean the grounding point with a scotchbrite.

My buddy is having a similar issue with his M66 swapped 2000R. Going to direct him to this thread
 
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