[23109VC]

i believe there are one or two people here to used to have an EVO or an STi before buying the R.

I"m curious, what you guys think of the R vs. the EVO or STi in terms of performance/handling??

i know stock vs. stock - either an EVO or STi will easily beat an R in a straight line or on the track. I think Road and Track claism the EVO and STi do the 1/4 mile in 13.3 or 13.4 while the R is at least 14 flat. I think my latest R&T claims 14.4 for a stock R.

i figure an R with ECU/dp/exhaust *might* be about as fast as a stock EVO or STi in a straight line...or at least close..maybe a tad slower not sure.

i get the impression, though, that with basic bolts ons, an EVO or STi will be crazy fast. I looked at the Vishnu tuning site and they sell a package for about $3000 and they claim 390hp at the motor....with a claimed 12.1 sec 1/4 mile time. that's insane.

so basically, one could buy an EVO or STi for less than an R, and if they spent what a lot of us ahve spent for the "basic" bolts ons, they are running in the low 12s - basically keeping up with Vettes.

I've NEVER sat in an STi or EVO - so maybe they are complete crap inside and no matter how fast they are - it would suck to drive it. I lke my R and all the "nice" stuff....but man would it be fun to have all that power.

i'm not sure i see myself in an EVO. the EVO conjures up images of 21 yeard old guys with their nose pierced and a baseball cap on backwards....with stickers all over the car.... being a 34 year old attorney, father of 2, i'm not sure the EVO or STi would be the kind of car i see myself in...but that power would be awesome.

any of you ever even "fantasize" about swapping your R for an EVO or Sti....

for those of you who had one, or have driven one, or been in one, what do you think about them...

 

[stevectsai]

Re: R vs. EVO or STi (23109VC)

Long story short: I can't picture myself associating with STi crowd. Call me a car racist.

 

[MagoonR]

Re: R vs. EVO or STi (stevectsai)

Quote, originally posted by stevectsai »

Long story short: I can't picture myself associating with STi crowd. Call me a car racist.

I would call you an "elitist".

 

[phuz]

Re: R vs. EVO or STi (23109VC)

Quote, originally posted by 23109VC »

i know stock vs. stock - either an EVO or STi will easily beat an R in a straight line or on the track. I think Road and Track claism the EVO and STi do the 1/4 mile in 13.3 or 13.4 while the R is at least 14 flat. I think my latest R&T claims 14.4 for a stock R.

phuz bounces the ball over to MagoonR's court

 

[MagoonR]

Re: R vs. EVO or STi (phuz)

Quote, originally posted by phuz »

phuz bounces the ball over to MagoonR's court

C'mon now 23109VC, this looks like a Zigger thread. Ooops, he would have "destroyed" those cars.......I forgot.

 

[HJZ]

Re: R vs. EVO or STi (23109VC)

Quote »

I've NEVER sat in an STi or EVO - so maybe they are complete crap inside and no matter how fast they are - it would suck to drive it. I lke my R and all the "nice" stuff....but man would it be fun to have all that power.

That's about right. I wouldn't call the interior complete crap but it is most definitely not what you have in the R. I cross shopped (yes I know) the cars and they (Evo, STi, R) communicate a different feeling. One would associate the Evo and STi as more track oriented tuner cars, as loosely put as that maybe. Whereas the R is more of a performance sedan that gives luxury and refinement meaning.

The Evo and STi can be made to be monsters, fairly easy and inexpensive, but your tradeoffs are obvious if you sit in the car, and drive it. Then again, there are so many different aspects to see the cars it will really depend on you as a driver. Yes you may have a 400hp EVO/STI for less than 3 grand, but you are not going to be driving down the street with your super soft comfy leather seats. You can also have a fairly fast R for about 3 grand, with all your everyday creature comforts, but you are not going to have skull crushing acceleration.

BTW, the image is now really mostly 21 years of age or less, with baseball caps sideways.

But no that's really just a stereo type; I've seen many a professional men driving them. Though everytime I see one or hearing one, usually the latter more, I do associate them with the "boyracer" image.

 

[R Salesman]

Re: R vs. EVO or STi (23109VC)

I sat in a STi once . . .

The seat was the most ungodly excuse for a chair I've ever sat in. And there's NO adjustment for the seat bottom (up or down). You can only move the seat forward/backward, and the seat back forward/backward. I don't even recall there being lumbar adjustment. So anyways, the seat was horrible.

And, of course, the interior was on par with what most 20-grand cars should have.

There's no way I would ever consider one of those vehicles for a daily driver. Maybe a track-only vehicle. That being said . . . they are fast as heck.

 

[djeuch]

On the autocross course, either one will had the R it's ass...

On the road, I'll take luxury over plain performance... I spend too much seat time to be jarred around...

 

[phuz]

Re: (djeuch)

Quote, originally posted by djeuch »

On the autocross course, either one will had the R it's ass...

Well, they don't typically design a 3500lb "safety-cage" to Autocross, now do they...

 

[djeuch]

Re: (phuz)

Quote, originally posted by phuz »

Well, they don't typically design a 3500lb "safety-cage" to Autocross, now do they...

Not usually, but damn, I do look good out there:

 

[Needsdecaf]

Re: (phuz)

Quote, originally posted by phuz »

Well, they don't typically design a 3500lb "safety-cage" to Autocross, now do they...

Ok, easy now just calm down.

Let's not get too personal, I think that Sean was upfront in his first post that he realizes that the EVO / STI are not in the same league as the R, nor are they meant to be. Different horses for different courses.

I think he's just looking for some objective opinions about what's better and what's worse.

In any event, check out Car and Driver's results from their Vishnu Tuning experience on their long term test car.

And you think modding an R is risky?

 

[Rangeball]

Re: R vs. EVO or STi (MagoonR)

Quote, originally posted by MagoonR »

C'mon now 23109VC, this looks like a Zigger thread. Ooops, he would have "destroyed" those cars.......I forgot.

I took an EVO off the line, well from a 5 mph roll and pulled him all the way. Then again he was probably 16 and couldn't reach the pedals.

 

[940GLE]

Well Ive driven in Sti's and Evos here in JA and Ive driven in Volvos in the US and all I can say is...

the Evo and STi are fast but the Volvo is both fast and classy. In JA there is a 850 T5 [Sorry to bring this up in the R forum] that is "evo fast" and this is with just a few mods.

If I could get an R in JA...I would take it hands down http://********************/smile/emthup.gif

 

[mister2cool]

Re: (needsdecaf)

OK as a formal STi owner, and somewhat involved in STi crowd for almost 3 years, I must put in my 2 cents.

First of all, the claim that STi seats are not adjustable up/down is not correct. They do go up and down with a lever on the side. Secondly, the STi seats are horrible on in US/Canadian version because they took out padding in the chair to fit the LARGER bodies. Many STi owners hated this fact, and many have got their hands on original JDM seats.

As far as performance goes, STi weights just over 3000lbs, couple that with 300ft.lb of torque and extremely short gears, the acceleration is nothing short of mind bugling. The first time I did a launch in the car at 4K RPM, chair knocked me out for almost a second, and I left 50 ft of tire mark on wet pavement. When I say short gears, I do mean SHORT! The car's 1/4 mile time suffered greatly because you actually have to go through 4 gears to get there as 4th gear tops out at 99MPH. Personally I was never able to shift fast enough in 2nd gear, and always ended up hanging on rev limiter. That's with the aid of built-in shift light and audio alert. To sum it up, STi had great acceleration and it responded instantly with no lag whatsoever. Right now in the R I have to wait for the power to kick in. Maybe I need to get use to keeping the RPM in higher range or downshift.

As far as handling, STi has great handling thanks to Subaru's AWD system, and EVO is right up there if not better. One unique feature on STi was the adjustable power distribution where driver can manually change the ratio of power front to back, from 50/50 to 25/75. This allowed the car to take on many different personalities, from 4WD all the way to almost a rear wheel drive, depends on what the driver prefers. It's great for autocross because you could make the car behave more predictablely.

Now comfort features, well... you get the bare minimal, no more no less. You do get power everything, but only auto-down on driver side; You get a climate control which is cool, but it's semi-automatic, as it doesn't adjust the vents; You do have a big trunk, but there's no padding anywhere; The whole car has no sound insulation anywhere, so you hear the nice engine/exhaust/turbo tune, as well as every rock that you just run over.

I traded in my STi to a R, while I do missed the rush from driving a STi, I have no regrets. As I grew out of my 20's, a car with a 5 ft tall wing just doesn't go with the occasion anymore.

On the other hand, if you want a car as a toy, and pack it with as much power as you can, and still have good handling, you really can't go wrong with a STi or an EVO. I have many friends with STi's and EVO's that are tuned to over 500HP without any engine internal mods, and they can still autoX with the best of them. I personally had surprised a good number of C55 AMG, Porsche 911, Supra drivers and one Maserati on the road.

Lastly I want to point out, Subaru really didn't sacrifice safety for performance when it comes to the STi's. while it looks like an Impreza, it really is a different animal all together. They removed all insulation to save weight, and initially left out all audio equipment to save cost and weight, the entire cabin was built around a reinforced safety cage with a beam running down the center of the roof. That is why STi's do not have sunroof as an option. I know a few people who had got into bad accident with their STi's, and everyone walked away without a scratch.

Oh yeah.. one more thing. Don't think any STi's or EVO's you buy can really do off-roading like you see on WRC. The frames on those cars are specially made to withstand the impact of landing after jumping a bump. Hard to tell those things actually cost $600K each.

To sum it up:
Things I like (Stock features):
1. Hard acceleration in ANY speed with no delay
2. IC water spray
3. DCCD (Driver Controled Center Differential - can also be disengaged to auto mode)
4. tilting HID reflector (from a knob on the console)
5. BBS forged mag wheels
6. Turn on a dime compare to the R. 2.5 lane width for a full U-turn.

Things I hated:
1. Seats
2. Noise
3. No sunroof
4. No leather
5. No heated seats
6. The headache and backache everytime coming out of the car from the noise and bumps

Modified by mister2cool at 2:41 PM 5-30-2006

 

[Needsdecaf]

Re: (mister2cool)

Quote, originally posted by mister2cool »

Oh yeah.. one more thing. Don't think any STi's or EVO's you buy can really do off-roading like you see on WRC. The frames on those cars are specially made to withstand the impact of landing after jumping a bump. Hard to tell those things actually cost $600K each.

Not when you've seen them next to each other in person.

 

[23109VC]

Re: (needsdecaf)

thanks for all the input. I'm not really in the market for a car right now..i was just watching car videos on the computer last night and saw that top gear video where Clarkeson races a 400hp EVO vs. a Murcielago and the EVO keeps up and then the Stig runs a faster lap time in the EVO than they did in the murcielago...amazing.

Clarkeson had really nice things to say about the EVO. there was another one that was EVO v. STi. very fun to watch videos.

makes you appreciate the cars more and see them not so much as econobox ricers but as really nice performance cars. they aren't meant to be luxurioues..just fast and furious!

I would love to have all that power..but like many of you have pointed out - most of us R owners are a bit older than the average EVO/STi owners. That's not to say there aren't 40 year olds running around in an EVO somewhere...I've seen one or two........but the typical 20something guy in the EVO is more the norm......while image shouldn't constrain the car one drives...in reality....cars are as much about image as they are trasnsportation/fun/etc.....

rolling up to the courthouse in my suit...and stepping out of an EVO might create an image I don't want.

getting out of a 911 turbo would be ideal.

too bad my budget won't allow the latter.

maybe if I'm ever in the market for a track toy....i'll pick up a used EVO and mod the hell out of it..

or a Z06.

for the money....i would think a used C5 Z06 would be more bang for the buck than the EVO.

 

[JRL]

Re: (23109VC)

If you recall, I had a (modded) Evo a couple of months ago.
This car was crazy fast, it would have BLOWN THE DOORS OFF MY R before you could blink your eyes twice

 

[mister2cool]

Re: (JRL)

Quote, originally posted by JRL »

If you recall, I had a (modded) Evo a couple of months ago. This car was crazy fast, it would have BLOWN THE DOORS OFF MY R before you could blink your eyes twice

Haha... I must say I totally agree.

Then again, the cops were trying not to blink everytime when I drove by.

 

[R_Rated]

Re: (mister2cool)

remember too that the butt dyno will say a loud, windy, rattly car is faster then a quiet one going just as fast.

 

[KillerB]

Re: R vs. EVO or STi (23109VC)

I know Cloaked brings all 3 cars with him to the track...the Evo, STi, and the R. Takes turns in the cars. Actually the Evo belongs to a buddy of his that he races with. I've asked him about the cars and to sum it up...the Evo and STi are for the track and the R is to take someone to dinner in. The STi and the Evo are pretty effective around the track, but I would want one as a daily driver.

Here is Cloaked and his buddy with all 3 cars at the California speedway at our last race.