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Random aside. I'm putting in my monthly Amazon order and decided to take see if any oil was on sale.
To my surprise, Amazon Basics is now also in the oil repackaging business.




Anybody want to roll the dice on this stuff? I wonder who is "Warren Distribution" is?
 

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I know that many of you in this thread use Mobil or Castrol 0W-40, but what could the Volvo tech be talking about?
It's not because he has a tech diploma or perhaps '25 years of experience' that he knows everything right. Actually many people don't have a specific technical knowledge when it comes to argue why this oil is better than that oil. Volvo was arguing up and loud about no transmission oil change, while perhaps there were already clients with transmission problems waiting in the line (same way they've denied there were no transmission problems with the old T6 XC90)

As for the 0W-40 or 0W-30 oils, these are the best of the 'consumer' grade synthetic oils. The 0W-30 oil is actually the only one not bottled in the US, but rather in Europe (I think in Belgium). As far as my experience, the advantage with the 0W grade is faster engine warm up in cold climates (such as the northern States). Faster engine warm up also means faster cabin heat. If money wasn't a problem, I would use the 0W-30 Castrol, unfortunately here in Canada is sold only by 1qt bottles for about $15 (tax incl) and never goes on discount. The 0W-40 sells in 5L jugs for around $40 on discount. The 0W-40 may be better for old engines that may consume oil. A 0W grade also gives better engine protection at start up in very cold areas such as Alaska when temps drop to -5F and below.

While there, at no moment I would trust a 'High Mileage Castrol' just because it has Castrol in the name. To me these 'oils' are lower quality consumer grade products with a catchy name.

Speaking about oil, the filter is also worth same care. I know many swear by Mann only, which is a good brand, however, at this time it's rather Mahle that seems to be making the genuine filters for Volvo

. Product Filter Auto part Oil filter Label
 

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Your counter argument is well formed, but I think his comment was for the less initiated who don't want to deal with the mental process of sussing out what is good-better-best in oils by reading through volumes of reviews and recommendations or deciphering technical analysis charts.

Some simply want the largely worry free route of "this is what the engine manufacturer said to use, so use it.*"
(*Not to say even the OEM spec gets it wrong on occasion, or doesn't update their data sheets).

While some of us like to take a more rigorous approach and examine new improvements that can deliver value added benefit. Neither path is wrong in my opinion. It comes down to the individual.

I for one like reading your thoughtful analysis, Chitown. But I know if I tried to send this to my girlfriend or if I attempted to convey why Xw-XX is better for her vehicle than Yw-YY, after she saw Xw-XX was in the owner's manual, after about 30 seconds, her eyes would roll around in her head like Jujubes.
I know better than to try. So, my answer to her would almost always be: "Use what's in the owner's manual, babe." :)
+1 I Also like reading thoughtful analysis from people like Chitown and other SS members. Thats what I like about this forum. As for my thoughts of using the 0w40 is because that's what walmart had and it meets the requirements for my car I think. i ain't going to be making a chart, graph or compiling information for a matrix. I'll leave that for the much smarter people than me.

And your right it was initiated for people like your GF, my wife and other. Yea we all know they do stupid shiit like say lifetime ATF.
 

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RE: Amazon Basics:


Seems like good stuff. Frustratingly, Amazon is not easilyproviding simple things like MDS or MSDS for the oils, and is vague on the industry standards it meets.

I'll keep running M1 in the various Volvos in the driveway. Wally-mart has free shipping on the 5-L jugs. The Fiat seems to need the fancy pants Pennzoil Platinum Euro stuff.

I've noticed that Amazon Basics is expanding into tools as well. Curious times.

-Ryan
 

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Your counter argument is well formed, but I think his comment was for the less initiated who don't want to deal with the mental process of sussing out what is good-better-best in oils by reading through volumes of reviews and recommendations or deciphering technical analysis charts.

Some simply want the largely worry free route of "this is what the engine manufacturer said to use, so use it.*"
(*Not to say even the OEM spec gets it wrong on occasion, or doesn't update their data sheets).

While some of us like to take a more rigorous approach and examine new improvements that can deliver value added benefit. Neither path is wrong in my opinion. It comes down to the individual.

I for one like reading your thoughtful analysis, Chitown. But I know if I tried to send this to my girlfriend or if I attempted to convey why Xw-XX is better for her vehicle than Yw-YY, after she saw Xw-XX was in the owner's manual, after about 30 seconds, her eyes would roll around in her head like Jujubes.
I know better than to try. So, my answer to her would almost always be: "Use what's in the owner's manual, babe." :)
In the end, motor oils are a religion, unless a manufacturer (like VW and MB) has a very specific material standard. I do like synthetic fluids, as the fluids seem more "stable" in the low temps. I think happy synchros in manual gear boxes in cold weather is the only instant way to appreciate good fluids. But now we're away from motor oil. :)

-Ryan
 

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In the end, motor oils are a religion, unless a manufacturer (like VW and MB) has a very specific material standard. I do like synthetic fluids, as the fluids seem more "stable" in the low temps. I think happy synchros in manual gear boxes in cold weather is the only instant way to appreciate good fluids. But now we're away from motor oil. :)

-Ryan
My M/C buddies used to have a saying:
"When in doubt, use Shell Rotella."

And sure as the sun shines each morning, they used Rotella in everything from Ducatis to little dumpy Honda Groms.

LMAO!
 

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I've noticed that Amazon Basics is expanding into tools as well. Curious times.

-Ryan
Oh god, no.
We already have enough 'Harbor Freight' quality goods polluting the tool market. Less we need Amazon Basic chintz to add to the pollution.
 

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In the end, motor oils are a religion
That's why forums are so helpful; it's the anecdotal evidence that can be a turning point. Someone mentioned in another thread that Castrol's reddish additive in the synth oil was an issue in PCV problems. That, and the high marks others have given Mobil 1, have caused me to switch, although I generally have high confidence in Castrol. I don't have the vaguest idea if it's true about the additive, but the inside of my 3.2 has that reddish varnish cast to it inside the oil filler cap.I figure it can't hurt to switch, since people report good results with M1 and it meets the specs. I'm curious to see if the M1 cleans that off over time.
Allegedly meeting the specs is, unfortunately, no guarantor of performance. In the late seventies, Volvo had a real problem with camshaft lobes wearing off in certain markets within the US only. I had just started working for what was then Volvo North America, and, as a Regional Service Manager (fancy name for Service Rep), was involved in information gathering to analyze the expensive warranty problem. It turned out to be clustered around Volvo dealers that used a certain brand of oil. Samples of everything were collected and sent back to Sweden, and ultimately, the results were shared with us foot soldiers. Technical meetings were held quarterly and the real scientists in a particular area would provide an educational overview and provide a summary. In the camshaft case, they had determined that a particular high pressure lubricant additive required by the SAE spec wasn't present in the product so they arranged a meeting with the petroleum company to address the issue. The oil company heard the spiel from the Volvo petroleum engineers and chemists, and summarily denied their allegations. Having anticipated such a reaction, the Volvo guys pulled out sheafs of chemical spectrographic analysis proving the point. The oil company pretty much said "Yeah, so what? Good luck getting any money from us". I won't even buy gasoline from the company, since (Hint: I do buy Shell and Arco).
In about the same time frame, Quaker State had a compounding problem where they omitted a vital additive during their manufacturing process that resulted in a significant number of engine failures. They caught that problem quickly, and Quaker State stepped right up and accepted financial responsibility to anyone, whether a customer from an oil change outlet or an over-the-counter DIYer.
Before anyone asks, I hesitate to name the oil company because I really don't need ugly letters from attorneys.
 

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Oh god, no.
We already have enough 'Harbor Freight' quality goods polluting the tool market. Less we need Amazon Basic chintz to add to the pollution.
Well for the average joe a harbor freight tool will get the job done for the couple times they might use it. For someone turning wrenches for a living that’s a different story. I have some harbor freight stuff that works good for me. Lots of the small miscellaneous cheap stuff they have I can do without. You definitely get what you pay for.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

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Some of their stuff is actually pretty good. I bought a 1/4" flex head ratchet that appears to be very good quality. Other stuff is really not worth even the cheap price they're asking (motorcycle wheel balancer with bent axle...) The third category is functional tools you'd otherwise do without if they weren't so cheap, since you'll probably only use them once.

On another subject, I'm not convinced that there's a measurable (in the field) difference between top tier oils meeting the same standards. There is a measurable difference between (say) 10w and 0w oils when the temps are around zero. On the other end of the scale, if your engine wants 60 psi and you can make that on a hot summer day with Xw-30 oil then Xw-40 oil won't buy you anything, other than possibly reducing consumption. That said, you're not going to convince me that my engine will last any longer with Amsoil or Mobile 1 or Red Line or Royal Purple or any other color than it will with Shell or Castrol or Penzoil or Quaker State meeting the same spec.

Regular use and regular oil changes will do more than picking the perfect oil.

TMSAISTI!
 

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Some of their stuff is actually pretty good. I bought a 1/4" flex head ratchet that appears to be very good quality. Other stuff is really not worth even the cheap price they're asking (motorcycle wheel balancer with bent axle...) The third category is functional tools you'd otherwise do without if they weren't so cheap, since you'll probably only use them once.

On another subject, I'm not convinced that there's a measurable (in the field) difference between top tier oils meeting the same standards. There is a measurable difference between (say) 10w and 0w oils when the temps are around zero. On the other end of the scale, if your engine wants 60 psi and you can make that on a hot summer day with Xw-30 oil then Xw-40 oil won't buy you anything, other than possibly reducing consumption. That said, you're not going to convince me that my engine will last any longer with Amsoil or Mobile 1 or Red Line or Royal Purple or any other color than it will with Shell or Castrol or Penzoil or Quaker State meeting the same spec.

Regular use and regular oil changes will do more than picking the perfect oil.

TMSAISTI!
AMEN on the oil. My engine runs fine.


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I for one like reading your thoughtful analysis, Chitown. But I know if I tried to send this to my girlfriend or if I attempted to convey why Xw-XX is better for her vehicle than Yw-YY, after she saw Xw-XX was in the owner's manual, after about 30 seconds, her eyes would roll around in her head like Jujubes.
I know better than to try. So, my answer to her would almost always be: "Use what's in the owner's manual, babe." :)
That is true. Have done the same. Know your audience, lol.


Random aside. I'm putting in my monthly Amazon order and decided to take see if any oil was on sale.

Anybody want to roll the dice on this stuff? I wonder who is "Warren Distribution" is?
I tried to locate the data on the Warren Distribution products, like the private label Amazon and Walmart, but they won't release it. There are some people who have gotten an oil analysis done on new and used oils and they do well. The data I was able to locate was in an oil weight I wasn't going to use, just a single analysis, and unofficial. So, I didn't add it to my chart. I wish there was more information on them. I was going to try Amazon's oil this past year, but it was more expensive than buying either Mobil 1 or Castrol's 0W-40 from Walmart, but now Walmart raised their prices on the 5 quart oil jugs.

Warren Dist. also makes Mag 1 which is a very good oil, but is also a little more expensive. You can find it on Amazon and just a few other places.


Regular use and regular oil changes will do more than picking the perfect oil.

TMSAISTI!
That is another key. That is one reason I like to use shorter intervals. Oil is rather cheap.
 

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Random aside. I'm putting in my monthly Amazon order and decided to take see if any oil was on sale.
To my surprise, Amazon Basics is now also in the oil repackaging business.

Anybody want to roll the dice on this stuff? I wonder who is "Warren Distribution" is?
Bought a couple jugs when it was brand new and used them on my last oil change in the V70 before it was murdered by road debris. (RIP)

Seemed fine, no issues. Ran exactly the same as when I was putting Mobile 1 in it. Wouldn't hesitate to put it in the new car, but why bother if it's not significantly cheaper than better known alternatives?
 

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Well for the average joe a harbor freight tool will get the job done for the couple times they might use it. ...You definitely get what you pay for.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Some of their stuff is actually pretty good. I bought a 1/4" flex head ratchet that appears to be very good quality. Other stuff is really not worth even the cheap price they're asking (motorcycle wheel balancer with bent axle...)
My position on HF is as such. If it's a specialty tool that I'm only going to use a few times, OK.
But if it's a tool that also requires fine calibration or need to deliver fine measurements, or it has more than 3 moving parts, I don't want it.
 

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That's why forums are so helpful; it's the anecdotal evidence that can be a turning point. Someone mentioned in another thread that Castrol's reddish additive in the synth oil was an issue in PCV problems. That, and the high marks others have given Mobil 1, have caused me to switch, although I generally have high confidence in Castrol. I don't have the vaguest idea if it's true about the additive, but the inside of my 3.2 has that reddish varnish cast to it inside the oil filler cap.I figure it can't hurt to switch, since people report good results with M1 and it meets the specs. I'm curious to see if the M1 cleans that off over time.
Allegedly meeting the specs is, unfortunately, no guarantor of performance. In the late seventies, Volvo had a real problem with camshaft lobes wearing off in certain markets within the US only. I had just started working for what was then Volvo North America, and, as a Regional Service Manager (fancy name for Service Rep), was involved in information gathering to analyze the expensive warranty problem. It turned out to be clustered around Volvo dealers that used a certain brand of oil. Samples of everything were collected and sent back to Sweden, and ultimately, the results were shared with us foot soldiers. Technical meetings were held quarterly and the real scientists in a particular area would provide an educational overview and provide a summary. In the camshaft case, they had determined that a particular high pressure lubricant additive required by the SAE spec wasn't present in the product so they arranged a meeting with the petroleum company to address the issue. The oil company heard the spiel from the Volvo petroleum engineers and chemists, and summarily denied their allegations. Having anticipated such a reaction, the Volvo guys pulled out sheafs of chemical spectrographic analysis proving the point. .
Interesting! Was this the feed problem with the B27/B28 V6? What a nightmare that was. There's a little varnish in my 3.2L. No idea what it's from. I switched to M1 in all the Volvos since there's a number of anecdotal information from some mechanical engineer friends that seems to prove its worth. A mech engineer friend of mine does 25,000 mile oil changes in the Volvo (VW) turbo-diesels of the 1980's. On tear downs, he finds no appreciable wear or varnish.

-Ryan
 

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Oh god, no.
We already have enough 'Harbor Freight' quality goods polluting the tool market. Less we need Amazon Basic chintz to add to the pollution.
I suspect much of it will be just fine. A lot of import tools are the "same tool", just rebranded over and over. Laser-etched with another logo. Gearwrench and Tekton are where I've been spending money on tools. They do fine. Sadly, American made tools are sooooo limited nowadays. Crazy expensive, and marginalized with the increasing quality of of import tools, but the American tools still have an edge where the rubber meets the road, which is hard to believe.

-Ryan
 

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Interesting! Was this the feed problem with the B27/B28 V6? What a nightmare that was. There's a little varnish in my 3.2L. No idea what it's from. I switched to M1 in all the Volvos since there's a number of anecdotal information from some mechanical engineer friends that seems to prove its worth. A mech engineer friend of mine does 25,000 mile oil changes in the Volvo (VW) turbo-diesels of the 1980's. On tear downs, he finds no appreciable wear or varnish.

-Ryan
No, it was strictly a matter of a particular oil company using the wrong high-temperature stable high-pressure lubrication additive. Certain dealers used bulk oil from the one vendor. The B-27 was affected to a degree, as well, and for the same reason. The issue was that the lobes of the camshaft simply wore off. This was at a time when engine operating temperatures were becoming hotter for emissions reduction technology.
I bought my XC90 used at 85k, and it was clean with the reddish varnish in the rocker. When I changed the oil with Castrol Edge and saw the red cast to the oil, I assumed there was a relationship although I do not know.
Not much can be said for your mechanical engineer friend's practice. Diesel engine design and markets vary, somewhat, but in my experience with medium to high performance marine diesel engines (and the D24, in the day), I see some different manufacturer service requirements. Essentially, the older 2-cycle engines had oil change intervals at 100 t0 150 operating hours, depending on the sulfur content of the fuel. Those engines, if non-turbo'd, would expect a major overhaul at 10,000 operating hours. The Turbo version were expecting 3,000 operating hours. Newer 4-cycle medium to high-performance Turbo diesel engines have oil change intervals around 250 operating hours and an anticipated time to major overhaul of 10.000 hours. Some diesel manufacturers predicate oil change intervals on engine operating hours OR amount of fuel used. Small diesel engine oil change recommendations, like constant-duty generator engines, also have head-scratching intervals. A 3-cylinder generator engine will have a 100 hour change interval, and the same engine in a 4-cylinder variant will be 250 hours. Diesel is such a dirty fuel, that the engine oil is completely black after 50 operating hours. It would seem that ignoring oil interval change recommendations would be perilous.
Interestingly, when changing the oil in my wife's S60, which hadn't reached either one year or 10,000 miles when the service reminder popped on. I noticed in VIDA when resetting the reminder, that the interval is set for 10k miles, one year, OR 500 hours.
The info I have from the Volvo engineers back in the camshaft day, was that oil never wears out. It becomes contaminated, and the additives that enhance it's properties deteriorate.
When it comes to using "plain wrap" oil like Amazon, my first thought is about recourse. If you can't figure out who makes it now, before there's a problem; you'll probably end up facing your problems alone IF they develop. At least with a name brand, you'll know who to talk to, and they'll have the facility to evaluate your receipts and analyze the oil samples you send to their laboratory. There will probably be some hoops to jump through, but they'll at least be do-able. No doubt there are enough people that don't maintain their cars properly and will try to get a free ride, that the companies won't make it easy.
 

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My experience. First 6 years I used Castrol and get heavily clogged PCV on my xc90 2.5t 2006
After I changed PCV and all parts even flushed engine (put new oil drive 50 km warm hot oil flushed out)
Yes I know I blow away 5 liter of new oil but it was time to flush even engine like this.
From than I use only Mobil 1 Peak Life 5W50 as my car have 318.888 km and add 2 dcl of oil every 3000 km is normal
for low pressure turbo 2.5t. With small camera we check inside PCV and its clean after 80.000 km
not like before using Castrol oil. This is my experience with bad Castrol sludge vapor.
And I drive fast and furious, high speed on highways and temperament in town :) Safety first of course.
Average on highways is 160 km/h limits are 130 but with full respect of others when Im alone I clean
all valves for prolonged time pushing even on 180 and time by time this is good to burn deposits out.
Of course when no one is on the street pls. :)

Try Mobil to feel difference.
 

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This is probably entirely coincidental, but, immediately upon switching to Castrol High Mileage oil I went from never having to add oil between changes to adding a quart every 1200-2000 miles. Since then I've tried many other types of oil but the consumption persists.

Not at all coincidence if the car had only mineral (non synthetic) oil before. When I switched mine to synthetic it started drinking oil at such rate, I basically had to check the level every few days at the beginning. It did so for at least 1-2 years, then stabilized and today the level doesn't move on the dipstick between oil changes, using a 0W-40 oil (perhaps will take a little with a 0 or 5W-30). Also my oil filter got clogged real fast when switching to synthetic, so I did replace the filter only again after a few months. I have zero oil leaks, it's really the engine that starts consuming oil when switching to synthetic. Again, everything comes back to normal a few oil changes later, but when switching to synthetic I'd keep a very close eye on the dipstick right from the start - these cars don't have a low oil level sensor so running low in oil will throw a low oil pressure light when it's already too late.
 

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RE: Amazon Basics:


-Ryan

I've once tested how fluid are oils by a chilling -13F (-25C) morning (real temperature, without the wind factor). I left the oil bottles outside overnight. I think I had mineral Castrol GTX 5W-30, synthetic Castrol Edge 5W-30 and again synthetic Castrol Edge 0W-30. The mineral was rather fluid, not water like, but not honey like either - would have no problem to believe it still lubricates well enough on a cold start. Both synthetics were very fluid, better than the mineral but again, the mineral wasn't much less fluid in comparison. Again, this was a very cold temperature. Unless one is living in Alaska or Siberia, even a mineral 5W-30 would be usable in cold weather - although I still prefer a synthetic 0W-30 (or 0W-40) because it helps the engine warm up a little faster so gives you cabin heat a little sooner.
 
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