I am no expert on LR by any means but I believe that they are equipped (possibly as an option) with locking differentials although I'm not sure if it's front, center and or rear. That being said, I wouldn't hesitate to use an AWD Volvo, especially those with a raised ride hight like the XC or CC, on the terrain you've described. Good luck with your decision :beer:

 

Haldex is usually an inferior solution than other AWD systems, but it does its job:

The Discovery will be better, but unless you run the Dakar, you might not notice any difference.

 

I disagree! Our 2010 XC90 with Haldex Gen 4 is amazing off-road. And I mean real off-road going on overland outings with more traditional overland rigs like Landcruisers/LX, 4R, Monteros, Tacomas, Jeeps, and the occasional LR TDI. We get lots of compliments and especially when our XC90 shows up rigs that have a more "rugged" off-road persona compared to a Volvo. It's been excellent in deep snow, deepest was this last season when we went up for our annual Christmas tree run. We only needed an occasional tug due to ground clearance (2010 is 8.9") and with our overland crew we were cutting our own path through a fresh 40"+ of fresh powder over forest service roads. On mud and over difficult terrain it's just as competent. AND, the 2010 doesn't even have the new electronic countermeasures found in the new XC90s, like hill descent control, air suspension, remapped throttle response for off-road, etc. That and it's super comfortable off-road (just as well as on-road and I even more so than an LR on-road). Plus it's roomier and safer for our family of 5.

These are some of the reasons we committed to another XC90 in our garage. We can't do without 2010 and the only non XC90 we considered given how unstoppable ours has been was a V90CC. In the end we're now enjoying our new XC90 and can't wait to adventure in it, too! We'll have the luxury of having either one off-road now! Our 2010 has Volvo's 5mm thick aluminum skid plate and we also optioned our new one with it as well! We also have AT tires on our 2010 for summer/off-road and for winter we recently outfitted it with Hakkapellitta SUV 8 with studs. The only challenge I am having for our T8 is settling on an AT tire and size. I'm thinking I'll end up going with 19" and keep the 20" for winter studs once I wear the Pirellis out.

Pick your line and you can drive anywhere

We haven't tried our new T8 out off-road yet and can't wait to see how much more capable it is.

 

As mentioned before, I believe the Discovery can be had with a true locking differential. If you're trying to crawl over rock shelves, experience situations where one or more tires are off the ground, or trying to start moving forward up a very very steep section of snow/ice, the locks on the Discovery will be useful. For normal snowy highway driving, and dirt road driving, diff locks would not be helpful.

The XC90's "locked" differential in off road mode is really just the Haldex system engaging so the front gets 50% torque, and the rear gets 50% torque, guaranteed. The ABS system is used as a simulated differential lock and will stop a spinning tire and send torque to one with grip.

For your needs, just be sure you get a set of dedicated winter tires and both vehicles should be up to the task.

 

Also, the Discovery can come with a low range transfer case which allows for a 50:1 crawl ratio. This is about what the "real" off road folks expect for steep ascents/descents. The xc90 has a 17.5:1 ratio. For reference the Trailhawk "Trail Rated" Jeep Renegade has a 20.4:1 crawl, while the normal Renegade is 17.1:1.

 

Tires are the key in off road situations


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vermonster, Very cool pictures and owners experience in snow storms this winter on this forum. You should look it up.

 

The land rovers have weight on their side. Very lower center of gravity.


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I don't know much about Landy's other than what I've seen other drivers do. And what they did was amazing, and all this without any modifications but stock standard car.

So, I'm inclided to trust a Landy much more than our Volvos. I realised also that Volvo (at least the T8) takes a little while before transferring power to wheels slipping. And I think this is the major reason it can easily get stuck compared to a Discovery. Discos system is quick and all wheels are powered whereas Volvo does not seem so, though the manual says the car does.

I have first hand experience of Volvo's not so All wheel drive all the time as they claim the AWD or OffRoad Mode is. Worst still, this happened on a tar road. I had 3 wheels on tar and only the left rear wheel on wet grass. The wheel slipped for several seconds with smoke coming out of it, I had to drive forwards, change the angle, retry again and I managed to go over a small bump in the grass.

I don't think I'd have had the same experience with a Disco or if I put the car in Power mode as this, I believe, is the only Mode Volvo truly uses all wheels simultaneously. I can believe this because as soon as you put the T8 in power mode, you feel that extra grunt even when the car is stationary.

The only way to settle this would be a comparative test on the same offroad track with the same conditions

 

What mode was the xc90 in when you were having difficulty? Was the ICE running? If the ICE was on and both front tires had grip, they should have pulled the car easily as the engine drives only the front two wheels. In that situation, you want steady easy throttle so the ABS system will engage and apply torque to the wheel opposite of the one spinning. I have a feeling if a wheel is spinning wildly and the throttle is too great, ABS won't engage so the car doesn't cook the brakes.

 

I took my xc90 offroading last weekend.

I used to own a range rover and I think the xc90 performed well.

It's not going to have as much traction on mud as the range rover would but it does the job. For 95% of most peoples needs including basic offroading it does a great job. I drove in offroad mode so speed was restricted, so if you're wondering about travel on gravel etc then that may not apply.

 

It's not going to have as much traction on mud as the range rover would but it does the job. For 95% of most peoples needs including basic offroading it does a great job. I drove in offroad mode so speed was restricted, so if you're wondering about travel on gravel etc then that may not apply.

Exactly, for most folks it will get the job done but being a haldex style system without a center or low end diff it isn't going to have the characteristics in poor traction or severe weather situations. especially for most folks who do not properly equip their wheels with winter/snow/offroad tires.

 

@vermonster

LR Discovery 5 OFF-ROAD GEOMETRY is

Approach Angle (Coil/Air Suspension): 29.0° / 34.0°
Ramp Angle (Coil/Air Suspension): 22.2° / 27.5°
Departure Angle (Coil/Air Suspension): 27.0° / 30.0°

Ground clearance is 11"+ in off road mode

Best to consider the air suspension for both to give the ground clearance and better off-road geometry. You'll note the LR Disco 5 has much better off-road geometry versus the XC90. Together with the 2 speed transfer case and the multi-mode traction control, you will go further off-road in a Disco versus the XC90. For both, standard tires will be limiting, so all-terrain or snow tires are a must.

Like the XC90, the standard Disco 5 uses a center differential with 50/50 split on lock-up. Front and rear diffs are open, with psuedo diff locking via traction control. You can get an electronic locking rear diff with the Disco 5, but it is an option with the HSE Luxury trim level per the website. The Disco also has cross-linked air suspension in off-road mode, so the opposite wheels act in a similar fashion to a rigid axle, providing more articulation and hence a better chance of maintaining tire contact over uneven ground.

I've taken my 2016 XC90 with air suspension off road on some moderate trails. Dry conditions, gravel and sand. It was fine with traction, just less of an approach angle than I would like. I haven't driven it in snow, but I'd be concerned in deep snow without proper tires.

 

I would hope the Swedes would know something about getting through deep sneaux! [emoji1303]⛄

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@Volvouhu

T8 wheel size could be a challenge without going aftermarket, since I the OEM 18" is only good with the T5/T6 (T8 is too heavy), and you really need the 18" size to get some good all terrain tire choices.

For my T6, I am thinking 18" 5 spoke #233 wheel with the BG Goodrich KO2 A/T LT255/55R18/D 109 R, which will keep the overall diameter at about the same 29" the stock 20" wheels and tires are at. With the air suspension and engine protection plate, this should prove more than satisfactory for my off-road needs.

 

@Volvouhu

T8 wheel size could be a challenge without going aftermarket, since I the OEM 18" is only good with the T5/T6 (T8 is too heavy), and you really need the 18" size to get some good all terrain tire choices.

For my T6, I am thinking 18" 5 spoke #233 wheel with the BG Goodrich KO2 A/T LT255/55R18/D 109 R, which will keep the overall diameter at about the same 29" the stock 20" wheels and tires are at. With the air suspension and engine protection plate, this should prove more than satisfactory for my off-road needs.

Hi chrispybacon - On Volvo's accessory page there is a 19" option that doesn't have the advisory of "not for T8" which should work. In Europe and other markets you can get the T8 with 19".

http://accessories.volvocars.com/en...rs.com/en-us/XC90(16-)/Accessories/Document/VCC-499229/2018/T8 AWD (Twin Engine)

Unless I find a proper AT tire in 20" or 21" I'll go down. It's similar to what I did on our 2010 XC90. We ordered that one with the 19" R Design and when it was time to get a set of winter duty off-roads I went down to 18" and picked up the General Grabber AT2. They are great and then this last season since we've been towing a lot in winter to ski (heavy winter mountain conditions) I decided it would be best to get a set of hard core winter tires, thus the Hakkapeliitta SUV 8 with studs. Those are on the original 19" and then rest of year we use the 18" w/AT2.

 

Hi guys, nice discussion, will add my piece.
I found out, that even in off road mode, the delay of Haldex (gen 5) was similar as was in my Octavia 2005 with gen 2 Haldex. So there is still some delay for the oil to be pumped to "lock" the differential or is it really "locked" 50:50?
BTW I had P-zero 21".

 

For OP: the the application you describe I would use a Jeep Grand Cherokee (something with great road manners but serious capability). Can be had w or w/o air susp

 

Here is an interesting comparison between luxury SUVs in some off-road terrain.

 

LR is a better offroad machine. But an XC90 will do for what you describe. Just stay away from T8s. The hybrid drivetrain is not as good on snow/gravel. It's not horrible... but, after owning XC90s with T8, T6, and D5 engines, I would take the D5 above all for offroad, then T6, then T8.

 

Hi,
We're evaluating the XC90 vs the LR Discovery. One of the things that many review state is that the Discovery is more off road capable. But, none of them say WHY. I'm beginning to suspect that the only reason reviewers are claiming this is because of Land Rover's reputation.

In terms of off road capabilities, I think the critical specs are:

• Approach, Departure, and Ramp(Breakover) angles
• Ground clearance
• Wading depth
• Differential lock
• Turning circle
• Torque

Based on specs, here's how I see the two comparing:

Approach
XC90: 24
Discovery: 23.6
Winner: XC90

Departure
XC90: 21
Discovery: 25
Winner: Discovery

Ramp/Breakover
XC90: 23
Discovery: 20.1
Winner: XC90

Ground Clearance:
XC90: 10.5" (in offroad mode), 9.3" normal
Discovery: 8.6"
Winner: XC90

Wading Depth
XC90: 17"
Discovery: 33.4"
Winner: Discovery

Differential lock
XC90: Yes (offroad mode)
Discovery: Yes
Winner: Tie

Turning Circle
XC90: 39.7'
Discovery: 40.4'
Winner: XC90

Torque
XC90: 258-295
Discovery: 332-440
Winner: Discovery


The reason I'm trying to compare is that we live in Vermont, and spend a lot of time on dirt roads (which can get pretty nasty during mud season) and often have to drive through deep snow. We don't intend to do any true off roading, but definitely are off the pavement pretty regularly. (Our driveway, for example, has a 10 degree pitch, and can be challenging if the plow truck hasn't showed up yet in the winter).

Looking at the specs, the two areas where the Discovery shines are wading depth, and torque. However, the XC90 wins on what I think is the most important spec -- ground clearance.

Do people think that the Land Rovers are just assumed to be significantly better off roaders, or is there something I'm missing in the specs here? More importantly, is there any real compelling reason to pick the Discovery over the XC90 for our daily drive? FWIW - We're looking at XC90s with air suspension.

The 2018+ Discovery's (the full one, not the castrated Sport model) ground clearance is 11.1" (unless you cannot find the air suspension buttons on the middle console, but blind people shouldn't drive.)
The Volvo AWD has no two-speed transfer case at all, Volvos have no 4H and 4L gears whatsoever.
Locking differential is not a replacement for two-speed transfer case, it simply locks in the power distribution. Discovery features both, and it even offers an automatic terrain response mode when the car engaged the appropriate operational mode automatically based on the sensors.
When it comes to torque, the Volvo cannot compete to a two-speed transfer case-equipped drivetrain as the Volvo simply does not have 4L at all, it lacks the gear ratio(s) for low-speed torque performance e.g., in hill climbing, heavy towing, crawling etc. Discovery will beat any Volvo, any time on equal footing, hands down.

 

Bringing it back to life! I’d say this guy likes discos. Nice first post.
I’ve got a 02 Kalahari