You are crazy. Then again, Einstein was called crazy.

 

This mornings paper has a review of GLK Bluetec. Last week was Q5 TDI. Both were glowing.

I assume/understand the Volvo won't bring VEA diesel here just because they won't. But given where Volvo is/was/wants to be in NA, I'd think diesel would make lots of sense in newest plans for this market.

Call me crazy.

Welcome to VCNA. How would you like to get screwed today? No diesel is definitely a big mistake.

 

A mistake is definitely different than screwing people over constantly....

 

The new VEA T5 engine is rated at near diesel efficiency at 26/29/39 mpg US and without any of the inconveniences many people associate with diesel - real or imagined. For example, no worries of a clogged up or malfunctioning diesel particulate filter. I was hoping Volvo would consider bringing the diesel plug-in hybrid V60 to the US eventually but it looks like it will be a gasoline (VEA T5) plug-in hybrid if and when it ever arrives.

 

The new VEA T5 engine is rated at near diesel efficiency at 26/29/39 mpg US

That combination of city/combined/highway mpg is not possible. 26/39 city/hwy yields either 30 or 31 mpg combined, depending on rounding.

 

Volvo hasn't said diesels wont come to the US

 

I read an article over at ANE that showed how Volvo was doing great in China, and very good in Europe. Then the topic of NA came up and Samuelson said, we recognize we have a problem there, and it's being studied closely. He said everything's on the table for NA. Maybe we might be surprised by a diesel offering or two before it's over.

And I know at the company where I work, whenever they say something is not going to happen, it's a sure sign that it will.

 

From what I read, I would think the future of Volvo AWD with the VEA engines will involve electric motors on the rear axle a la the V60 plug-in hybrid in Europe.

 

VEA (now eDrive) AWDs (non-electric) expected 2015/16. (Read it in some Austrian car-magazine.)

 

Hurrah for that! I'd hate to see haldex 5 and the newly designed torque vectoring system go away!

 

I'm willing to bet Volvo also has sufficient stock of drive shafts of the perfect length for the T5 and T6 AWD they don't want to be stuck with. Plus they have to get in stock of the drive shafts for the VEA engines.

Plus they have to sell all of the non-VEA engines they still have in stock, even if they wanted to go fully VEA.

 

I'm willing to bet Volvo also has sufficient stock of drive shafts of the perfect length for the T5 and T6 AWD they don't want to be stuck with. Plus they have to get in stock of the drive shafts for the VEA engines.

Plus they have to sell all of the non-VEA engines they still have in stock, even if they wanted to go fully VEA.

Given the "just in time" logistics used by virtually all car makers these days, a much more likely explanation is that VCC is contractually obligated to buy certain quantities of those driveshafts and engines from their OEM suppliers for the immediate future. The Welsh-built Ford 3.2 and T6 engine supply was probably dictated by the terms of the divorce settlement.

 

To answer the topic "No VEA diesel in NA? Big mistake?", YES! Volvo just look at where the market is heading.

 

So in case nobody's figured this out yet, the way to understand Volvo's future direction is to simply pick any of the top five manufacturers in the word and review their 5, 10, etc. year plans. Then, just think what the opposite of that is and you will have Volvo's "strategic vision." You'd think that because they're owned by the Chinese they would just copy everyone else with the trends... but nooooo sirreeee, Frank Sinatra, they're doing it their way. I should applaud them for their uniqueness and be less critical of their direction. If one could award points for original, non-conformist establishment of automotive marketing trends conducive to financial ruin, Volvo would win hands down! So, see, I'm not a hater after all. Volvo is best at some things!

 

Not so sure. Here in Europe new rules are interpreted as the sun setting on diesel dominance.

 

I did make my comment with a bit of hesitation. I also have been reading about the environmental issues that are starting to appear in diesel prevalent areas. There is no free ride.

 

The 3.2 will undoubtedly be replaced by the end of next year or else as soon as Volvo is contractually allowed to with the Drive-E T5. It's better in basically every way.

1. Peak horsepower is higher and comes at lower RPMs.
2. Peak torque is higher and comes at lower RPMs and across a broader range of the power band.
3. It's compatible with the 8-speed Transmission
4. Fuel Economy is drastically improved (maybe about 23% on the Euro cycle)
5. It takes 2.7 seconds less to reach 100km/h.
6. It puts out 30% fewer grams of CO2 / km.

The true T5 has never been paired with the XC and there is not advantage to pairing it now.

 

XC70 will receive the VEA T5 soon. It's already in the price list.

Car will be FWD though. Acceleration 0-100 km/h 6.8 seconds. Top speed 210 km/h.

 

XC70 will receive the VEA T5 soon. It's already in the price list.

Car will be FWD though. Acceleration 0-100 km/h 6.8 seconds. Top speed 210 km/h.

Useless in this area. We will never sell it. Same with FWD XC60. No market.

 

The argument for diesels is tough in North America. While there is an improvement in fuel economy over gas cars of similar displacement, the taxation differential between gas and diesel in in North America does not exist. Thus, the break even point for diesels requires a much higher number of km's driven per year to reach. Add to that Volvo is priced above mass market brands, and most moderately affluent buyers will not be swayed by a few hundred dollar of gas savings a year.

Even if the new s60 diesel halved my gas expense per year (around 2000$) at similar purchase price, I would be highly reluctant to give up the top end acceleration on the T6.

 

I always used to rant about Volvo not bringing diesels to the US, but that was before petrol engine fuel economy started to take off. The new crop of 4-bangers are good enough (speaking in general, not the Volvo engines that we haven't experienced) that I question whether I would actually buy the diesel. I might if the fuel economy and power delivery were up to snuff, but that could easily be thwarted if the markup is as ridiculous as some competitors. Plus, despite the "clean diesel" moniker it still takes a lot of tech to make tailpipe emissions compete with those of plain old gasoline. Many of the diesel emissions tricks come at the expense of fuel economy (low compression ratios to reduce NOx, catalysts that burn extra fuel to regenerate to name two).

 

Sure, but people who already buy FWD Volvo's will now buy the Drive-E FWD models and it will help Volvo's CAFE.

 

Agreed, but how many people buy FWD Volvo wagons to begin with? All two people in the flattest and hottest area of Texas? Come on, get real. People who buy station wagons are the same people who live in the Dfa or Dfb regions of the U.S. People who live outside these regions generally don't buy station wagons, FWD or AWD. I can't wait for the sales numbers for the Drive-E V60 in the first half of next year.... 25 units per month, nationally? And then Volvo will blame America for not wanting station wagons. No, Volvo, we just don't want your inane configuration station wagon.

 

Why are you still here?

 

Because I am always willing to assist the blind.

 

This mornings paper has a review of GLK Bluetec. Last week was Q5 TDI. Both were glowing.

I assume/understand the Volvo won't bring VEA diesel here just because they won't. But given where Volvo is/was/wants to be in NA, I'd think diesel would make lots of sense in newest plans for this market.

Call me crazy.

There's always the VW Crossblue diesel hybrid plug-in designed specifically for the North American Market: http://media.vw.com/pressrelease/1343//volkswagen-crossblue-mid-size-suv-concept-makes-global

Volkswagen's manufacturer estimated fuel economy rating is 89 mpge combined in electric mode and 35 mpg as a hybrid. As well as offering excellent economy for a mid-size crossover SUV, the CrossBlue has impressive performance from a powertrain that produces up to 305 horsepower and 516 pound-feet of torque: 0 to 60 mph is estimated to take just 7.2 seconds.

If you're interested.

 

This mornings paper has a review of GLK Bluetec. Last week was Q5 TDI. Both were glowing.

I assume/understand the Volvo won't bring VEA diesel here just because they won't. But given where Volvo is/was/wants to be in NA, I'd think diesel would make lots of sense in newest plans for this market.

Call me crazy.

I have had direct conversations with VCNA on this topic and it boils down to economics.
The cost for a smaller manuafacturer to sell and certify diesel engines in the US market, exceeds the perceived loss in sales.
Remember that you would have to obtain EPA certification from zero, and the vehicle would likely need to be re-certified for impact testing.
(The engine is an essential component of the front crash structure).

It is unfortunate, and Volvo knows that there are enthusiasts that dearly want diesel engines.
VCNA expects to obtain 'diesel-like' fuel economy using the coming small-displacement forced induction engines with electrification.

 

I have had direct conversations with VCNA on this topic and it boils down to economics.
The cost for a smaller manuafacturer to sell and certify diesel engines in the US market, exceeds the perceived loss in sales.
Remember that you would have to obtain EPA certification from zero, and the vehicle would likely need to be re-certified for impact testing.
(The engine is an essential component of the front crash structure).

And the VEA 4 cylinder diesel has the exact same size block as the 4 cylinder petrol, so I guess no one figured out they may only need one crash test.

Oh, wait. Silly me. Of course they're different.

It is unfortunate, and Volvo knows that there are enthusiasts that dearly want diesel engines.
VCNA expects to obtain 'diesel-like' fuel economy using the coming small-displacement forced induction engines with electrification.

Let's see how they actually do in the hands of real customers. Time will tell if what is 'expected' matches reality. Remember the old saying: "In theory, there's no difference between Theory and Practice. In Practice, there is."

 

Hi

That assumption re same block size for petrol and diesel = one crash test assumption is incorrect as the NHTSA will require full crash certification for the new variant, so the costs are real.

I dont buy the argument that they can offer petrols with diesel like fuel consumption as petrol efficiency has improved with DI but at the same time diesel efficiency has also moved up a notch.

so, your new gasoline engines will be outpaced by newer diesel plants.

The comparison is a petrol plug in hybrid vs diesel which wins hands down. But what happens when competitors launch diesel plug in hybrids?

Geely needs to step up and pay for the homologation of Volvo's diesel variants to give volvo an edge in the US market

 

I don't know if it's been said yet in this thread, but the big deal here is that Volvo might not even bother selling the diesels in Europe if it weren't for the taxes imposed on vehicles with high CO2 and poor fuel economy. I believe it was in an interview with the great powertrain Crabb recently that he was the one who said that in markets without the tax, people tend to go for the higher powered engines over the diesels. Also, without the tax it takes much longer for one to recover the premium price of a diesel when comparing fuel economy to a petrol vehicle.