[likeXC90]

I don't quite get this. A PHEV only makes sense if you are able to plug it in while you don't use it. If you have the ability to plug it in in your garage, why not buy a BEV rightaway?

The average American commutes to work about 32 miles each day roundtrip, and about 11,000 miles per year (which is about 30 miles per day). So driving a 200+ or 250+ mile range BEV doesn't make economic sense (purchase price only) while gas cars are cheaper. (Yes, there are studies showing overall BEV ownership costs can be lower than ICE.)

Further, the amount of energy, current environmental pillaging, etc, used to create a BEV where most owners (heck, most drivers, EV or not) in the world only tap ~15% (30/200) of the range potential ~90+% of the time isn't the greatest argument for BEVs with bigger batteries. Then throw in our wonderful "naysaying" politicians' pockets (lined with oil campaign dinero?) holding back electric charging infrastructure, etc.

In America we are overly consumed with a "bigger is better" mentality despite the fact we don't need 200+ miles of range (and added $$$) for ~10% of the time when ~35 miles of range (and lower $$$) will cover us ~90% of the time.

Now this is just a "use efficiency" argument. There are a host of different angles to debate but this is one not many speak of.

 

[likeXC90]

I wish they can surprise me but there is no magic in EV battery capability, range and price world. Nobody could do significantly better unless some in-house breakthrough happens. And Volvo doesn't make battery cells as we all know. Even they get to use the best battery in the world, there is no magic as somebody else are already using it.

Completely agree!

The only thing that would surprise me is if SPA2 has (access to) a production solid-state battery which no one else I believe is putting out soon. (I'm still expecting a beautiful, functional, heavily Scandinavian themed design, in and out, so no surprises here!)

Range, battery capacity, acceleration - yawn . . .

Practical level (3 or) 4 driving - wake me up in 2028, no make that 2030.

 

[likeXC90]

I am in no hurry to trade in my MY16 XC90 T8, except that my extended VIP warranty ends on 01 Feb 2024 (which is in the back of my mind).

I would lean towards a longer range BEV . . . Otherwise, I stick with my MY16 or I upgrade to a well-equipped CPO MY22. I am in the proverbial "rocking chair" waiting to see, no hurry, and not really interested in first year production purchase.

+1
I too need a very compelling reason to ditch our awesome flawless-to-date MY2019T8. I'm hoping some 3rd party, or maybe Volvo in the spirit of less waste, develops a process to drop out the Lithium battery and replace it with a solid state battery (& a faster charger would be a plus, but that probably means thicker gauge wire and a more capable cooling system) that will result in 2x the range (so the current literature says), for what would be my sweet spot - 40-50mi of all-electric range.

 

[likeXC90]

Whoever has the answer key to this puzzle is probably chuckling at all of us.

Marketing - who the heck can follow these people? I work with them and their irrational, which way does the wind blow at this moment "stories" drive me nuts!

If their external messaging is confusing & cryptic, I am imagining how much more it is behind the scenes?!!!

(In fairness, in our company they have the tough job of predicting the future by translating customer wants to executive recommendations & company wide actions. Nooo thank you.)

 

[likeXC90]

Does PHEV battery move out of the armrest (omg what a stupid idea in retrospect) to a place where it can grow a bit bigger for a bit more EV range?

Hehe, and from an engineering perspective I thought the center tunnel battery placement (known limited battery size constraint) was a brilliant, low risk idea to easily switch from hybrid (shaftless tunnel) to non-hybrid (shaft in tunnel) configs. TETO

I'm surprised the competitors at the time (2013-2017) with similar battery sizes and electric axles didn't do the same and opted instead to impact rear storage space or passenger space. (Volvo patent maybe?)

 

[likeXC90]

I think the next generation is going to offer some VERY big surprises to the industry.

Sounds like you know something the public doesn't know yet!

OK maybe stupid is a bit harsh for the time. But there's no doubt in my mind that it needs to move and grow in capacity/range for next gen, whatever SPA2 (SPA+2"?) really means for XC90.

No worries. Yeah, the skateboard battery / structure design is the BEV standard so when I hear/read "VERY big surprises to the industry" it makes me think of "next generation" tech like (but not limited to) solid state electric batteries, structural batteries, fully cast car structure (ie Tesla's gigapress), or etc, but definitely not autonomous driving (good luck with national / state regulations just by itself nevermind the technical challenges).

 

[likeXC90]

We do know lidar will significantly change auto driving

So I had the chance to work on LiDAR during its bubble years, which in itself is revolutionary. Actually using it for autonomous driving IMO will not happen anytime soon because of regulation / certification and technical challenges. But using LiDAR for increased safety and awareness - and not for autonomous purposes - is completely feasible, just a little pricey compared to existing alternatives. Just my two cents.

the battery integration will offer some unique solutions to the industry.

This will be interesting . . . Thanks for the slow drip teasing

 

[likeXC90]

Clearly you don't understand marketing.

Please, don't reply only to minimalize the opinion of someone else.
If you think this some special marketing of Henrik, please make clear why...

As an engineer who works with marketing only one thing is sure: dont believe everything marketing says. If you remember this you will keep your sanity.

Marketing's mission is to forecast, predict, generate interest, identify new markets and opportunities, etc and not much of their work (the ones I deal with) is definite. They have to sell their grandiose futuristic plans to their executives where the wise ones ask just how sane their ideas are.

If you want definitive answers talk to the design and manufacturing engineers who get the big bucks money from executives to make sheet.

Otherwise marketing is all speculation, pure speculation that knows no end. To engineers it's all just noise, no signal.

 

[likeXC90]

I do wonder why there hasn’t been any spyshots though. Obviously the simplest explanation is that they don’t have test mules running but that doesn’t sound like good news.

Given the logistics involved in the high volume, multi-national, multi-supplier auto business, there is zero doubt functional prototypes already exist from a (sample) production line. From the copious emptiness of SPA2 spyshots I get the impression Volvo runs a tight ship that doesn't leak. Was this the case for SPA way back in 2013-2015? I thought most automakers release photos and specs 1+ years in advance of sales to grow the hype . . .

Between the contradictory marketspeak and global pandemic altered timeline, this is product release torture

And to make things better, "Reunification" might be just around the corner which will do wonders to help stabilize the global chip crisis (/Sarcasm)

the XC90 sales are still very good. Why decrease them by unveiling (details of) the new model? Volvo has and needs the time until it will inform us.

Exactly. Keep the big money reap-your-investment SPA sales going - aka strike while the iron's hit; milk the cow for all its worth; etc - but drop some hints that the EV revolution is "imminently" coming to whet those EV appetites.

Reminds me of the subway operators on the intercom telling the crowds outside: "This train is full. The next one is right behind us." Sure, yeah, it's coming - but when exactly?

 

[likeXC90]

I think its worse than I thought. Just happened to visit Volvo PR site - and guess what it leads with? The f'in handbag. Maybe something has gone really wrong

I wouldn't lead with a handbag either but maybe Volvo marketing is appealing to our better halves (assuming most posters here are men)? I wonder what the stats are for luxury car purchases . . .

If anyone figures out marketing, let me know

https://www.cars.com/articles/its-true-women-really-do-shop-more-for-cars-403085/

A bit old:

https://apnews.com/article/ab7e040783514ecdb098939111ee3099

 

[likeXC90]

Nice. But does a handbag increase your identification with the brand? Strikes me as stereotypical - what's next, shoes?

Uh oh.

Volvo X Casca – Casca Designs Inc.

Volvo Marketing is certainly getting the word out on sustainability - see, we're talking about it!

And BTW, those shoes are for both men and women!

 

[likeXC90]

What's next, Henrik's sportswear and workout video?

With marketing, you never know!

(I work with them and can't justify why they get so much to expense!)

If an otherwise wealthy Henrik / Volvo official starts offering personalized video greetings for a small fee then I'll start to get worried

 

[likeXC90]

OK so when I get my garage wired in the next year or so, I expect I'll be doing 50 amp wire which has max sustained output 40 amp (w/ NEMA 14-50 being the best outlet choice?). But as configured now, today's Volvos (PHEV only? EV too?) can only draw 16 amp. And they do no better on a public charger or megacharger? Is any of that right?

The current XC90s are limited by their internal 3.3kW charger and the physical connector (SAE J1772 in the USA, IEC 62196 type 2 in Europe). So these super duper fast chargers don't even have a physical connector compatible with the Volvo's SAE J1772, and it is not electrically compatible either. So the current (USA) XC90s (and apparently the larger battery ones arriving 2022Q1{?} in the USA, unfortunately aaargh) are stuck with Level2 charging, period.

Side note: the USA is still bickering about what the charging standard should be (out of our current 4) versus China and Europe who have already chosen one for their countries.

The only way to charge faster on an XC90 is for Volvo to release a new XC90 with a new charger and hardware (connector, etc) compatible with fast charging or for a current owner to revamp their entire XC90's charger, electrical system, software, and likely battery system to handle faster charging - not impossible but very, very, very, very challenging.

 

[likeXC90]

Literally almost anything is better than "Em-blah". Please tell me this is just a bad rumor with no basis in fact . . .

 

[likeXC90]

Emblaze?
Emblazon?

They trademarked "Em-blah"? Oooh no . . .

 

[likeXC90]

Also too close to EMBlog.

And embolism. Emblahism?

Horrifying.

I didn't want to go there but since this door is opened now . . .

Embalm (to fix in a static position)
Embar (to imprison)
Embezzle (to fraudulently use to one's benefit)
Embowel (to remove the substance of)
Embrue (to stain)

What other creative wordsmiths are out there? Gotta work the other side of the brain once in a while!

 

[likeXC90]

Not sure how informative it is, but apparently the trademark application for the name Embla was only applied for in Europe. Hopefully that is a good sign for us in the U.S. where the name Embla conjures up images of embalming.

There's a whole thread (or off topic conversation) on this somewhere:

Blah
mmm, blah
Embalm
Etc.

 

[likeXC90]

I was looking forward to the new fully electric XC90 but slowly giving up and considering now the BMW iX50 when my lease ends next year

With so much electric car development happening, I'm trying to stay out of the all-electric market - it's hard! - until there's some technology, price, and infrastructure stability, 2028-2030 maybe?. But out of curiosity I was also checking out the competition last week and was surprised to learn that BMW released this iX (smaller 2 row) all-electric SUV last year. (The styling, features, etc is just not for me.)

Not following BMW at all, I was surprised they went from (what I find to be a horribly designed ie lose trunk space with marginal if any benefits over the non-hybrid) PHEV X5 to a "legitimate" all-electric vehicle. Heck, even Kia has all-electric SUVs out already also!

Granted these are much bigger, higher volume car companies, I'm hoping Volvo has settled quickly after finally deciding (somewhat late?) not to pursue the parallel track of developing a new PHEV and new all-electric car at the same time.

Maybe those Volvo shoes/handbag folks and "Mmm, blah" decision-makers can convert their energy instead to help the all-electric development effort!

 

[likeXC90]

Can't help be think SPA2 EVs are still struggling due a variety of internal + external circumstances.

Prior to releasing SPA1 for sale globally, how much in advance did Volvo have press releases with pictures and tech snapshots, 1-2 years? If history is any indicator, wouldn't the same timeline be applicable for SPA2? So where are the press releases with pictures and tech snapshots?

The fact that Samuelsson left without a public retirement party tells me somethings not quite right.

I wish you were wrong but my spideysense and article-reading eyes cannot dispute your assessment. Yikes. Was it the parallel SPA2 path of PHEV and all-electric that was the deal killer? "Enquiring minds want to know."

 

[likeXC90]

What is this Autocar article talking about when saying the new gen "Embla" will have combustion engine variants? It won't. It's an EV only.

As our Volvo insiders posted elsewhere, this seventh model year is supposedly not the last MY where SPA1 is being offered.