SwedeSpeed - Volvo Performance Forum banner

1 - 17 of 17 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
16,049 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Where do YOU stand on the important issues of the country, today?<p>Cary asked for my positions, which is a bit odd since I've expressed opinions on all of these over the past year, I am sure. Nonetheless, it is a fair question.<p>All of my positions are FACT-based, reality-based, rational-thought based, science-based, and not BULLPUCKY- or FEAR-based, like Cary's<p>Energy: Energy policy: Developing additional energy resources (including more power plants) is good for the country, provided the significant, negative, impacts of the development are mitigated. We can afford it. We don't need additional pollution of air, water, etc. in many places in the country. <p>As I've said, drilling is not the answer, but ONLY because the oil companies already HAVE land to drill on and this is just a blatant land grab. Let them show that the land they have is without resources, and let them give them back to the people. I'd ask for that showing before simploy giving them more land. It ain't a complicated policy.<p>Some areas (can we agree on Yosemite Valley, at least for the next twenty years or so?), unless we have a true national emergency. We don't have one, right now. I am not anti-offshore drilling. It can be done safely. <p>Economy? The middle class FIRST. Then the poor. I think we can all agree, the wealty can pretty much take care of themselves. I'm not saying give handouts to the middle class and poor. I am saying make it easier for poor people to become middle class, and for middle class to stay middle class or achieve more wealth, by their choice (and their hard work). <p>Proviide tax incentives for business behavior that makes the country stronger.<p>I believe wholeheartedly in lower taxes. But lower taxes where it has a positive impact on our country.<p>National Security? I don't believe in it, as I hate America. I know Cary hasn't said that, but I believe that's what he thinks of me.<p>I believe America needs to remain strong, and protect the American way of life against forces that desire to eliminate that way of life. I also believe that America can only do this by being very active around the world, in many ways, from missiles to school-building. From helping build Democracies to helping build roads to helping restrain nutjobs. I am willing to pay whatever it takes to do this, provided the people in charge are competent at doing it. I don't believe it includes invading countries that have no ability to harm America's way of life, and may not include countries that DO have that ability. But I also believe that you have to lie to the public to get good work done. "Selling" the Iraq war, for example, on faulty grounds, is necessary if you have some other VALID reason for invading Iraq. The problem is, none of us can find that valid reason. <p>Just as there needs to be a valid reason for giving comfort to our enemies, as Reagan-Bush did with the Iranians after the hostage crisis of the 80s. Why did they empower the Ayatollah? <p>Right to bear arms? I support it, 100%. I don't support criminals having guns. I don't support insane people's ability to get guns easily. I support your right and my right to have as many freakin guns as we want, provided we understand gun safety and can minimize the likelihood our guns will get misused.<p>I am not sure how I feel about concealed weapons being carried. I see the pluses and minuses to it. It's the hardest issue in this area, for me. <p>Even IF the Constitution doesn't protect it (and I submit that I am not sure of how I read it), it may still be OK for people to carry guns. The Constitution is a limit on government power; it is NOT a statement of what is "right" and "wrong." There are plenty of things that are Constitutional, but not "right.'" Should you or I be allowed to carry our gun on an airplane? Probably not. But maybe we should be allowed to carry it back and forth to work. Again, for me, it's more than a Constitutional issue (unless the Constitution says we can carry one no matter what, of course, though it could still be "wrong" to do so under some circumstances).<p>Abortion? As rare as possible. I think we all agree on that. Not to be crass, but I'm not sure I want all those poor people being forced to have children, who are far more likely to turn into crirminals than any of our children.<p>I know it is crass and horrible, but the facts point in that direction. And I know that all life is sacred, but poor people are having most of the abortions, and that's probably been a good thing for our society, given all the other ills in our society. <p>There are people in our society who understand that if you eliminate abortion, you are going to increase crime, and they think that is a GOOD thing, not a bad thing. That crime places additiona burdens on cities. That crime turns more people into hard-line, pro-prison, conservatives, not liberals, not moderates. <p>Abortion IS a moral issue, but it involves MORE moral issues than the life of the unborn person (who does not have any Constitional rights, though that doesn't mean we shouldn't protect it/him/her; I'm all for protecting the unborn. But you can not protect the unborn at the EXPENSE of the living, and that is the basis for much (not all) anti-abortion policy, in my opinion. I sincerely respect all pro-life folks who are actually pro-LIFE and not just anti-choice, anti-woman. Most pro-life folks (99%? are good people who are NOT anti-humanity. But there are people who do not desire to protect the middle class, the American way of life, as we know it. I can not support the use of anti-abortion policy in order to achieve societal changes that I abhor.<p>We can not afford more police. We can not afford more prisons. I'm not anti-police or anti prison. But it's been a HUGE growth industry and is a drain on the economy, so it needs to be looked at carefully. Growing police wages and growing prison guard wages (and pension costs) are just as valid to criticize as growing teacher wages (and pension costs).<p>We need to be careful how we spend the people's money. It's OUR money, not somebody else's.<p>Gay marriage? Not being gay, I find it hard to be as objective on it as I should be. Since I am not gay, I don't know how a person feels to not be able to marry. I am guessing it feels like they are a second-class citizen, and I don't see any reason why ANYBODY who hasn't done anything wrong should be a second-class citizen, not in America, anyway. I thought we were supposed to be better than that. Allowing civil unions get us 99% there, so maybe that's enough. But that's not really fair for me to say, again, since it's not MY rights that we are talking about. <p><br>OK, I gots to go to bed. I'm sure I failed to express many of my ideas.<p>By the way, had W done the right thing lo these many years, then I'd have supported him. But he didn't. Everything he touched turned to ****t, and he does not share, apparently, my philosophy of what makes this country great. As a result, he takes actions that hurt the people of this country. I don't know if it's because he is "a bad man." I think he is a non-entity- a figurehead, at best, controlled by forces who want to have our government work in a certain way. And I don't agree with having our governmentv run that way. Of course, it's always possible that he is evil, and bad, etc. But I doubt it, and it really wouldn't change my feelings about his Administration. <p>I don't believe that McCain will be any different, because his campaign his been filled with the same sorts of lies that his party has always given us in elections (at least for the past thirty years, while I've been aware of these things). I don't believe all politicians are liars. But McCain seems to be one. Sarah Palin has certainly been lying to us. The myth is a good one, I suppose, but it's a lie. For example, selling the American people on "Drill Baby Drill" is lying to the American people, because the issue ISN'T energy independence, but transferring public resources into private hands, with little/no benefit to the public. OilCompanies are private entities, working for their shareholders. It's a myth and a lie to portray to the American people that more leases will help Americans. It isn't supported by any fact. In fact, the facts support the opposite, because of the transfer of resources from the public to the private sector without benefit.<p>But that's just a single example of the lies. I'm sure other folks have other more poignant examples.<p> <p> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/embeer.gif" BORDER="0"> <BR><BR>
<i>Modified by adp at 8:50 AM 9-7-2008</i>
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,044 Posts
It seems to me that ALL politicians stretch the truth at times. Some more than others as well. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/smile.gif" BORDER="0"> I hope you had a good nights sleep. Take care.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16,049 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Re: (barrysharp)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>barrysharp</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It seems to me that ALL politicians stretch the truth at times. Some more than others as well. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/smile.gif" BORDER="0"> I hope you had a good nights sleep. Take care.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>I DID! <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://********************/smile/emthup.gif" BORDER="0"> It cooled off nicely on this side of the bay. Yesterday was HOT. And since I don't have a pool (or air conditioning), there wasn't much relief. It's gorgeous outside right now (and in the house), but it will be too hot pretty soon. Too early for a beer, so I'll save it for later! <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/smile.gif" BORDER="0">
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,044 Posts
Re: (adp)

Hey, if we make Democracy work too well all people will be equal. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/wink.gif" BORDER="0"> That's scary for me as I believe Darwin was right and I sure don't want to end up as a clone to you. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/biggrin.gif" BORDER="0"> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/wink.gif" BORDER="0">
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,515 Posts
Re: Issues Challenge - Where do I stand on the issues? (adp)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>adp</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Where do YOU stand on the important issues of the country, today?<p>Cary asked for my positions, which is a bit odd since I've expressed opinions on all of these over the past year, I am sure. Nonetheless, it is a fair question.<p>All of my positions are FACT-based, reality-based, rational-thought based, science-based, and not BULLPUCKY- or FEAR-based, like Cary's<br></TD></TR></TABLE><p>If you are going to call me out in your henpecked insults (that BTW violate TOS as your looking to incite a flame war), you could at least spell my name correctly. Heck, how many years have you been using my name as if it bothers me.<p>The funniest part is that many don't know you are referring to me. You'd be well served to use 2k. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/tongue.gif" BORDER="0">
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,489 Posts
Re: Issues Challenge - Where do I stand on the issues? (adp)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>adp</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br>All of my positions are FACT-based, reality-based, rational-thought based, science-based, and not BULLPUCKY- or FEAR-based, like Cary's<br><i>Modified by adp at 8:50 AM 9-7-2008</i></TD></TR></TABLE><p>Most people think the same of their own positions, which may be dramatically different from yours.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16,049 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Re: Issues Challenge - Where do I stand on the issues? (2k2S80t6)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>2k2S80t6</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>If you are going to call me out in your henpecked insults (that BTW violate TOS as your looking to incite a flame war), you could at least spell my name correctly. Heck, how many years have you been using my name as if it bothers me.<p>The funniest part is that many don't know you are referring to me. You'd be well served to use 2k. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/tongue.gif" BORDER="0"> </TD></TR></TABLE><p>what the heck is a henpecked insult?<p>and I wasn't using your name to demean you. I'm sorry if it comes across that way. The lurkers may not know you, but the folks who usually engage in these discussions know you by name. I feel silly referring to you as "2k" but I am happy to accept that approach. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/embeer.gif" BORDER="0"> <p>Want to discuss any of those issues, or how we differ, or anything other than my stupid insults, which were, in fact, admittedly, stupid? (though accurate, but now edited and gone) And I do apologize for the TOS violations. They don't add any value.<p>I onluy posted these positions, above, because you asked. They are remarkably cogent, considering how drunk I was at the time. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/embeer.gif" BORDER="0">
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16,049 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
Re: Issues Challenge - Where do I stand on the issues? (greek2us)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>greek2us</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>Most people think the same of their own positions, which may be dramatically different from yours.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>no, they don't. When pressed, most people admit that their positions are NOT fact-based or the resulot of rational thought, but are grounded in their gut.<p>Their opinions may be theirs, and may be heart-felt, but they do not stand up to rational discourse.<p>Not EVERYthing is "opinion." There are actually some FACTS in the world. There is such a thing as "truth."<p>It doesn't matter how strongly your opinion is that poop don't flow downhill. All facts in our universe establish that poop does, in fact, flow downhill. You can't disagree with that!<br>
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,489 Posts
Re: Issues Challenge - Where do I stand on the issues? (adp)

I'm not arguing that there is not absolute truth. Far from it.<p>But to paraphrase a very wise person, it is very good and astute for a person to believe that he/she can observe truth, allow the truth to speak to him/her, and then draw conclusions from that truth. It is also very arrogant to assume that others do not have the same faculties.<p>One of the first things they taught us in the police academy (one of the things I still remember from a very long time ago) was that if you had four eyewitnesses to a crime, there were five accounts - one for each witness, and then the truth. When the responding officer took the statements, there would now be six accounts, because his/her own perceptions would shape how he/she viewed the facts. Once the investigation concluded, and even if everybody was being completely honest, there would be at least eight accounts - the witness accounts, the prosecution's account, the defendant's account, and the truth. If it went to jury, now we're talking at least 21 accounts...<p>It's not that anybody saw different facts, or that the truth ever changed, or that the truth wasn't absolute. It's just that 3.5 lbs of grey matter, five limited senses, and the preknowledge and prejudice of our worldview all combine into an imperfect perceiver and analyzer of truth.<p>So can we agree that I can have a very logical, rational, and reasonable stance on the same issues, based on facts/truth, and that you can also have a very logical, rational, and reasonable stance on the same issues, based on the same facts/truth, and that those two stances might not always agree?<p>If not, you ought to express your wisdom in a much larger forum than SS.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16,049 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
Re: Issues Challenge - Where do I stand on the issues? (greek2us)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>greek2us</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">So can we agree that I can have a very logical, rational, and reasonable stance on the same issues, based on facts/truth, and that you can also have a very logical, rational, and reasonable stance on the same issues, based on the same facts/truth, and that those two stances might not always agree?</TD></TR></TABLE><p>yep, agreed<p>do you agree that some people take positions that are less grounded in fact and more grounded in something else?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,489 Posts
Re: Issues Challenge - Where do I stand on the issues? (adp)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>adp</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>yep, agreed<p>do you agree that some people take positions that are less grounded in fact and more grounded in something else?</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Absolutely.<p>And I'd remember that anytime we point fingers at someone, we ought to realize there are 3 more pointed back at us. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/wink.gif" BORDER="0">
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,857 Posts
Re: Issues Challenge - Where do I stand on the issues? (adp)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>adp</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br>I onluy posted these positions, above, because you asked. They are remarkably cogent, considering how drunk I was at the time. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/embeer.gif" BORDER="0"> </TD></TR></TABLE><p>You were drunk at 10:30am on a sunday? or was that the time/date you edited the post?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,860 Posts
I'll go ahead and clear up all that up there. Where do you stand on issues? In that heap of steaming garbage over there on the left. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/tongue.gif" BORDER="0"><p>:: edit :: Please note my use of the <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/tongue.gif" BORDER="0"> smiley.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,839 Posts
Re: Issues Challenge - Where do I stand on the issues? (adp)

Man, you are so vague you really should run for office! <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/embeer.gif" BORDER="0">
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16,049 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
Re: Issues Challenge - Where do I stand on the issues? (AbsolutZer0)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>AbsolutZer0</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>You were drunk at 10:30am on a sunday? or was that the time/date you edited the post?</TD></TR></TABLE><p>I initially posted late on Saturday, (while drunk), but that thread got locked due to offenses<p>so I grabbed the non-offensive text and put it into a clean thread<p>I am no longer a Sunday morning drinker. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/wink.gif" BORDER="0">
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16,049 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Re: Issues Challenge - Where do I stand on the issues? (VolvoMax)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>VolvoMax</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Man, you are so vague you really should run for office! <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/embeer.gif" BORDER="0"> </TD></TR></TABLE><p>just because YOU can't understand the issues, that's no reason for you to throw stones<p>You just can't stand the fact that someone who disagrees with you might have a more intelligent, thoughtful perspective on an issue that you do, is that it?<p>I don't think I was particularly vague. Maybe when you see "complicated" your brain just shuts down??<p>and frankly, plenty of the issues I commented on, above, are freakin SIMPLE<p>Hard to imagine there's anything VAGUE with my energy policy, or my abortion policy, stated above, though to do them justice you really do need more words, I admit.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,489 Posts
Re: Issues Challenge - Where do I stand on the issues? (adp)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>adp</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br>Abortion? As rare as possible. I think we all agree on that. Not to be crass, but I'm not sure I want all those poor people being forced to have children, who are far more likely to turn into crirminals than any of our children.<br></TD></TR></TABLE><p>My late friend Jonathan agreed with you, but had a better idea he recently shared with me which would allow us to kill several birds [so to speak] with one stone... lessen the number of children forced upon poor people, reduce their criminal impact, and solve much of the financial and food crises. Now his idea suggested what we might do with infants, but when makes the logical jump (as Professor Singer has), the idea gains so much more impact!<p>My apologies for where my cut and paste leave out the true genius of his proposal.<p><br><i>It is a melancholy object to those who walk through this great town or travel in the country, when they see the streets, the roads, and cabin doors, crowded with beggars... followed by three, four, or six children, all in rags and importuning every passenger for an alms. These mothers, instead of being able to work for their honest livelihood, are forced to employ all their time in strolling to beg sustenance for their helpless infants: who as they grow up either turn thieves for want of work...<p>...whoever could find out a fair, cheap, and easy method of making these children sound, useful members... deserve so well of the public as to have his statue set up for a preserver of the nation.<p>...But my intention is very far from being confined to provide only for the children of professed beggars; it is of a much greater extent, and shall take in the whole number of infants at a certain age who are born (or are yet to be born) of parents in effect as little able to support them as those who demand our charity in the streets.<p>...I have been assured by a very knowing American of my acquaintance in London, that a young healthy child well nursed is at a year old a most delicious, nourishing, and wholesome food, whether stewed, roasted, baked, or boiled; and I make no doubt that it will equally serve in a fricassee or a ragout... (I am assured that a fetus is just as good)<p>...I grant this food will be somewhat dear, and therefore very proper for landlords, who, as they have already devoured most of the parents, seem to have the best title to the children...<p>...I profess, in the sincerity of my heart, that I have not the least personal interest in endeavoring to promote this necessary work, having no other motive than the public good of my country, by advancing our trade, providing for infants, relieving the poor, and giving some pleasure to the rich. I have no children by which I can propose to get a single penny; the youngest being nine years old, and my wife past child-bearing....</i><p><A HREF="http://art-bin.com/art/omodest.html" TARGET="_blank">http://art-bin.com/art/omodest.html</A><p><br>Edit: I'd add a "smiley face," but it cheapens the satire and sadness of the affair.<br>
 
1 - 17 of 17 Posts
Top