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Thank you very much for the reply. I'll try with the HID kit you recommended, (this one, in 35 W, with no additional harness, right?). It looks like they do ship to europe, and the ground shipping isn't that expensive.

The problem description in my original mail isn't completely accurate, because I didn't want to overcomplicate things. In all detail, it went like this:

- I had a HID kit (don't know the brand) installed for a year with no problems. After about a yeat the right bulb strated going on and of randomly and the BOW light was comnig on. At first it happened only once every month or so, but in the end it flickered almost constantly.

- The dealer I had bought the kit from offered to exchange the ballast for this new Canbus pro, that was supposed to eliminate the issue.

- immedialty after installing the new ballast my wiper motor burned out. I took the hid kit out of the car and repaired the wiper motor

- after repairing my wiper motor and building your BOWE eliminator (great writeup btw. thumbs up) I put the HID kit in again and everything worked flawelessly for one day. The next day I couldn't bring the right bulb tu turn on no mater what I did.

- I took the HID kit and the BOWE out of the car, inspected eveything, measured the current and resistance on the BOWE, and since everything looked to bo ok I put the HID kit and the BOWE eliminator back in. Now, magically, the right bulb turns on and of fine again, with no problems.

- After one day the right bulb again stops working, and there is no way to turn it on. So I took everything back out and went to ask for advice here.

Anyway, I'll order the new ballast from DDM and try to put this one into my 850, to see if it's really dead or no. As far as I understand it my trusty old 850 doesn't have PWM on the headlights.
 

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Discussion Starter #42 (Edited)
The DDMs that I use are slim 55w - it looks like the price has gone up since I last checked. I maintain a list of working HID installations in Excel format (p1hid.xls) and a number of people have had success with the raptors with and without a BOWE. I like 55w kits because they draw more current and are more likely to fool the monitoring system than 35w ballasts, and I always recommend using some sort of capacitive filter system regardless of if the kit works without it or not.

It is possible that the new ballasts were messed up in the short time that they were installed. Slightly more ominous would be a problem with the FET (transistor) inside of the CEM that does the actual modulation. However the ballast is the most likely suspect. Or, if the actual HID capsule (bulb) has not been changed, you should try swapping the inoperable one with the good one to see if that is the issue - a misbehaving ballast (like one that repeatedly reignites the bulb) can dramatically shorten the life of the bulb.

BTW for the 850, there is no PWM but it has a bulb out warning which is triggered when the bulb circuit draws less than 4 amps or so. I've gotten 55 watt kits to work without issue, but 35 watt kits (the standard ones) needed resistors (2x 3.8 ohm 50w in series to make 7.6 ohm 50w per side, in parallel with the ballast) to make the light go away. There are also ways to drill out the current shunt, etc, but I had the resistors lying around.
 

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how is this BOW eliminator different than anything else that I could purchase from either fleabay or a local tuning store? does this help with the wiper issue?

how wide spread is the wiper issue really, I just purchased a 35W HID kit along with a BOW eliminator, going to get it installed by a shop tomorrow...
 

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Discussion Starter #44
I would pull a RTFT but I'm in a good mood.

Question 1
how is this BOW eliminator different than anything else that I could purchase from either fleabay or a local tuning store?
From: http://forums.swedespeed.com/showthread.php?125561

theshadow27 said:
The circuit is not appropriate for our car.

With a 4700uF capacitor and a diode there would be 6.5A of AC current ripple running through the cap at all times. If you look at the datasheet the 25v 4700uF cap isn't even ripple current rated! The 80v version is rated to 3A, so the 25v is probably around 2.5a, so when the car is at 13.5v it's getting 250% of it's rated ripple current. Looking at the tan delta coefs it'd be running at close to 150c without the engine bay temps affecting it at all. Being coated in epoxy doesn't help heat get out.

The 22000uF caps you got are rated to 5.3A ripple continuous. The higher value capacitance reduces ripple so there is only 3A of actual ripple current. It's running at 60% of it's rated value, so heat dissipation is minimal.

Besides the caps, there's a couple of other problems with their circuit.

First, it grounds through the headlight wires, which I've measured the resistance of (including connectors) to be around 0.3 ohms. This doesn't sound like much, but it constitutes a 1.2 volt drop at operating currents. Effectively, their cap is working with 11V which makes everything worse (capacitors store charge exponentially), where as ours are working with 13 since the wires to the CEM are huge.

Second, there's no diode in the DDM box. It's pretty hard to explain why this is necessary, but try to think of a capacitor as a tank of water with a fill and a drain at the bottom. The drain goes to the HID, and the fill goes to the CEM. The CEM feels the need to maintain the level of water in the tank by hooking a garden hose up to the fill. The level goes up, and after a certain point the CEM removes the hose. Well water still goes out the drain, but it also goes out the fill because there's no hose connected. The diode is a one way valve that stops water from back washing out the fill when the CEM disconnects the hose. (jdsr917 - I tried, I really did)

Third the inductor is a great idea, but is way too small for our PWM frequency of 82hz. As I went over in the original posts, you'd need a huge inductor (several pounds) to dampen such a low frequency significantly. 1uH is nowhere close, it'd take more like 300mH...



Question 2

does this help with the wiper issue?.
From: http://forums.swedespeed.com/showthread.php?129216

theshadow27 said:
(the wiper motor issue) is caused by a ground connection shared between the headlights and the wiper motor. My guess is that if you have a capacitor between the positive and negative leads of the headlight wire without a diode, when the CEM goes to open circuit (PWM low) the cap can put the potential of the ground connection below 0v because the JFET has a flyback diode connected to V+. My diode blocks current flow backwards through the CEM, and we've been running this for a couple months with no issues.



Question 3
how wide spread is the wiper issue really, I just purchased a 35W HID kit along with a BOW eliminator, going to get it installed by a shop tomorrow...
If you search for "WMM" on this board you'll get quite a few threads, and there are similar threads in international forums (including Noway, Russia, and Sweden...). I compiled a list of HID users and their results here.

That said, do whatever you want - it sounds like your mind is made up. But as I've said before:

theshadow27 said:
Yes it's possible for an aftermarket HID kit to work without a warning. Certainly there are some kits that work out of the box.
No it's not possible for an aftermarket HID kit to function normally.

Here's the analogy: Take a bunch of cars (BMW, Volvo, Honda, Ford, etc..) and fill up the tank with 9 gallons of fuel and 1 gallon of water. Is it possible for for some of them to run without a warning? Sure. Will some refuse to start? Absolutely. Is it good for any of them? No.

Just because it works doesn't mean it's good for the ballast or the electrical system. One, or both, will fail much sooner than otherwise because neither is running under design spec conditions.
 

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Discussion Starter #45
19 FEB 2011 - Added troubleshooting section to first post
 

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Hi guys,
First time poster, short time lurker. Just bought a 09 C30 T5 and ordered my 55W raptors today. I'm fine with soldering and electrical stuff, but I can't seem to find the proper wires in the CEM connector. I found one wire that is green and white, but I cannot find the green and purple one. Anyone have pictures or updated information on the harness for the US spec C30 T5? Is the green and white wire still the one I want to use? Also, where did you route the wires, as the CEM in weather protected in the engine compartment in the C30. All information is appreciated.
 

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Discussion Starter #49
Hi guys,
First time poster, short time lurker. Just bought a 09 C30 T5 and ordered my 55W raptors today. I'm fine with soldering and electrical stuff, but I can't seem to find the proper wires in the CEM connector. I found one wire that is green and white, but I cannot find the green and purple one. Anyone have pictures or updated information on the harness for the US spec C30 T5? Is the green and white wire still the one I want to use? Also, where did you route the wires, as the CEM in weather protected in the engine compartment in the C30. All information is appreciated.
I've uploaded the wiring diagram for the C30 (also 09 S40, C70, V50) here: http://theeshadow.com/files/volvo/39129202.pdf

The CEM is in the passenger footwell, the ECM (engine control module) is the one in the engine bay. It is easy to find, the interior fusebox is part of the CEM.
 

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I want to install HID but I don't want to disable DRL and don't want to build a KBOW as i'm not good with that kind of work.

So my solution is to use a relay harness... This WILL give me the bulb(s) out message. Also I don't have fog lights to connect too.

A load resistor is the only way I guess.
Would something like this produkt work?: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/H8-H...rcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item5646281731

By replacing the connectors to be plug & play with the cars halogen lamp connectors...

Will it work?
The resistor will get really warm as I understand, but will it work by mounting it into the chassis?

How many Watts or Ohms is needed to clear out the bulb out message from the low beams?

//Kensy
 

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Discussion Starter #51
I want to install HID but I don't want to disable DRL and don't want to build a KBOW as i'm not good with that kind of work.

So my solution is to use a relay harness... This WILL give me the bulb(s) out message. Also I don't have fog lights to connect too. A load resistor is the only way I guess.

How many Watts or Ohms is needed to clear out the bulb out message from the low beams?
Hi Kensy,

I understand your concerns, and you are correct, a load resistor will work. Thank you for taking the time to review my research :)

I would say the ideal resistor would be 4 ohms, 100w, to provide a 100% safety margin. The resistor in your link is 6 ohms, rated to 50W. At 13.0V (the regulated output voltage) that resistor should draw 28 watts (2.1A), which is slightly more than half of the designed headlight current. Some people have reported success with 30W HIDs, so it might be sufficient, but worse case put two in parallel (6 || 6 = 3 ohms) which will surely work.

You are also correct in the heat produced by the resistor, will be 28 (or 56) watts, which will get it very hot - probably 70-80c (160-180F) if not warmer. Bolting the resistor to the chassis (with self-tapping screws, or rivets, etc... metal fasteners only!) is the best approach, however if one is sufficient to prevent the BOW then you can probably leave it in side of the headlight housing without causing issues (remember, a halogen bulb is just a resistor where some of the heat escapes as light). If bolting to the chassis is an option though, I would recommend it.

You should not have to modify the connectors if you use the one in your link and bolt to the chassis, because HID retrofit kits have a grommet with a passthrough for that type of connector ("superseal") on the outside already, with the H11 connector on the inside. So you can use that passthrough to connect the resistor. Then just connect the HID power supply to the relay harness.

Hope this helps,

Jacob
 

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Thanks for a good and usable reply. Then I really should try get some 100W, 3ohm resistor instead. Better to be safe than sorry. Much more work needed if 50W, 6ohm doesn't work.
Do you think 75W, 3ohm is enough?

Also happy that this really will work.
I will check for a suitable place to put these resistors and find a good way to mount it with screws onto metal.

Found a webpage that has 100W, 3ohm at aprox $10 each + shipping. Will go for those I guess.
I'm not sure how exactly to install these? Can I really do this:

1. + from lamp connector to resistor +.
2. + from lamp connector to relay harness (remote, that activates the relay).
3. Then connect the HID relay harness as normal.
4. - from lamp connector to resistor - (ground)
5. - from lamp connector to relay - (ground).

Is this correct?


//Kensy
 

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Discussion Starter #53
Then I really should try get some 100W, 3ohm resistor instead. Better to be safe than sorry. Found a webpage that has 100W, 3ohm at aprox $10 each + shipping. Will go for those I guess.

A 100W 3 ohm resistor is perfect, that will work no matter what. I recommend the 100W over the 75W, to be safe (especially if you do not know the brand of resistor). Don't use wire smaller than 16 AWG in the hookup. A 3 ohm resistor should be mounted outside of the housing - the HID bulb produces a lot of heat and the housing is not designed to dissipate both heat sources.

I'm not sure how exactly to install these? Can I really do this:

1. + from lamp connector to resistor +.
2. + from lamp connector to relay harness (remote, that activates the relay).
3. Then connect the HID relay harness as normal.
4. - from lamp connector to resistor - (ground)
5. - from lamp connector to relay - (ground).

Is this correct?
Yes, the connections are correct - the relay should be in parallel with (one of) the resistors. The resistor and relay are not polarized (the "+" and "-" do not matter, it can be reversed) so do not worry too much about that - however the relay might have a common ground so stick with the color codes (red/yellow = +, black/brown = -). For the relay harness, I recommend using the ground studs on the strut where there should be plenty of extra bolts, this is where all of the heavy electronics in the vehicle ground. Don't try to re-use the headlight ground wires (except for the resistors, which is OK - the resistor should be hooked up just like it was a bulb). The positive terminal of the relay harness can be hooked to one of the the fusible link bolts on either the main fuse box or starter side of the positive battery terminal.

Hope this helps,

Jacob

P.S. Aside from the extra work of running the relay harness, the only disadvantages to this method are theoretical: 100W of wasted power = 0.134 HP... not really an issue. The alternator will not miss the 8 amps either, as it puts out about 120 if you have the base model. So I really don't have a good argument against it. If you manage to do it for less than, say, $40 and can take some pictures, I'd post them on my website and update the writeup to mention it as an alternative to the KBOWE. I agree it is much simpler than trying to order and solder together capacitors and diodes.
 

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Thanks for a good answer!

I will buy these 100W, 3ohm resistors at the end of the month. 0.134 HP and 8A, I don't mind too loose. I won't even notice it :) My previous car was a Volvo V70 GLT 1998 and this V50 upgrade is a big boost so ... :)
I will try to take a lot of pictures and try to make a write up on the installation. I might get back here for some further assistance if it doesn't go as I want =)

Thanks.


@theshadow27: The link I first posted that had connectors to pass throu, isn't that wrong? These resistors need to be installed in parallell and not in a serie?
If it's possible to that kind of connector, then it's the best to get some connectors and make the resistor plug & play :)
 

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Hi again.

The resistors have been ordered and waiting for delivery =)
I now have all the parts besides the resistors.
I have a question about how to connect, have another connection idea. Does this work?


Can I connect the resistor to the H11 orginal connector (both earth and plus) and then make a split/joint on the plus cable to be forwarded to the relay. Then ground the relay to chassis and so on? This will be easier so I don't have to modify the relay connectors :)
Ie. use a 2 way crimp terminal/"faston" at the original H11 connector and connect resistor and relay at the + and then resistor - to negative on the H11 connector?
 

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Discussion Starter #56
Yes, that is how I thought you would originally do it. Maybe this will help:


Sorry for the bad photoshop!
 

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Thanks.

Good picture. I will try to get some plug & play connector so I don't have to use a crimp or anything. If I use crimp, I'm thinking of using it on the inside even if it's more work, it's much safer and easier to do.
I'm thinking of using some kind of these to make it easier. My Xenon bulbs does not have H11 connectors for plug & play.



I hope the resistors will arrive during this week. Will try take pictures and document everything.

The resistor should be installed in parallell but will it work to install it in a serie too? On the left side the orginal cables won't be used at all as the relay powers everything on the other side. So can I just plug in the resistor on that side? + to + and - to - on the orginal connector? My guess is yes but calculating electrical things are not my big strenght :)


Edit:

I now have all the parts needed for this operation! Yay. I did just took a look where to place these resistors but it's not easy to put them anywhere. Is there someone who has some pointers? :)
 

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I've read this past as well as other information regarding this issue at length and I'm looking for some slight clarification. I would prefer not to cut into the CEM wiring on my C30 and so I'm going the route of using a battery harness. The clarification I'm looking for is whether or not the BOW3 error cancellers I've ordered from DDM will be sufficient to eliminate the Bulb out warning without an additional resistor load, given that it appears the relay is powered by only one of the headlight connections and the other will therefore be connected to the BOW3 with no output from there (obviously I would also install a BOW3 in-line with the wiring harness and relay). For information I've ordered a set of 55w HIDs as well as a set of BOW3 error cancellers and a battery wiring harness; I'm not planning to touch the fogs or the associated wiring. Also I'm hoping I will not need to build an additional resistor load for the light harness. Guidance is appreciated.
 

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Discussion Starter #59
The clarification I'm looking for is whether or not the BOW3 error cancellers I've ordered from DDM will be sufficient to eliminate the Bulb out warning without an additional resistor load, given that it appears the relay is powered by only one of the headlight connections and the other will therefore be connected to the BOW3 with no output from there (obviously I would also install a BOW3 in-line with the wiring harness and relay). For information I've ordered a set of 55w HIDs as well as a set of BOW3 error cancellers and a battery wiring harness; I'm not planning to touch the fogs or the associated wiring. Also I'm hoping I will not need to build an additional resistor load for the light harness. Guidance is appreciated.
No, the BOW3 does not draw any current itself, it is just a bypass capacitor and series inductor. The BOW is triggered when not enough current is drawn. So a relay harness will always BOW without resistors.
 

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Hello I write from Italy and I have a MY12 v50 with DRL. I would like to mount a slim 35W xenon kit and I want to also KBOWE, but not inside the cabin but in the engine compartment. My doubts about the connection of kbowe and ballast. the positive kbowe I have to put between the + coming from the lighthouse and the ballast and the negative ground. The negative from the lighthouse I connect it directly to the ballast? is better to have 35W or 55W kit to have no errors at cdb? If I mount a 35W should I put an additional resistance to Bowe?
Many thanks to everyone who participated in this fantastic topic



By veloce288 at 2012-03-31
 
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