[fallenfenix87]

I'm gonna start this here so it doesn't clog up the Smartphone Shot of the Day thread. If the mod wants to migrate those conversations here, that would be cool, but not necessary

So I've seen some WRX's and other Japanese turbo cars with their charge pipes wrapped in heat wrap or with a reflective engine tape. I thought I would take the plunge and give it a try.

When I posted the pics of my finished product it started quite a hubbub in the SPSotD thread, and nothing ever quite got resolved. So I'm going to post my findings as they appear.

My personal theory on this is: At start up, the wrapped CAP will keep heat in the pipe that would normally escape, bringing cold engine efficiency down slightly . Once the engine is up to temp and under normal driving conditions, the CAP temps will remain 3-5 degrees cooler as it enters the intercooler. Under hard/racing conditions when engine temps are their hottest, I could see wrapped CAP temps being slightly more insulated from the even hotter engine bay. These temp differences, if present, could slightly improve intake temps and/or gas mileage.

The basic idea is to keep the hot air in the charge pipe from getting hotter from the engine block/bay heat as it goes up and over to the intercooler, theoretically giving the intercooler a little less work to do. A thread on another site claims a 3-4 degree drop in intake temps from wrapping the CAP on a turbo Prelude, but no graphs or before/after numbers are posted: http://www.preludepower.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-284970.html

There are questions I have that hopefully someone can answer though!

1. What is the average under hood temp when driving at highway speeds?
2. What is the average charge air temp in the pipe at highway speeds?
3. What are the symptoms of early detonation, which can be a sign of intake temps being too hot? I'd like to know what they are just in case this happens to cause them.

Until questions 1 and 2 are answered, I'm kind of doing this blind. I'm not sure there are even good ways to measure those

Since this was day 1 of the experiment, I really don't have any results yet. The heat wrap I used was this: http://prosportgauges.com/fiberglass-header-wrap-1-1.aspx

Current avg. mpg is 19.8. We'll see if it stays relatively the same, degrades, or improves with the wrap under my normal driving habits.

As stated before, I have no idea if this will do nothing, make things worse, or make an improvement. This is not the mother of all forgotten mods or anything, but I think it could make a *slight* improvement, although at the expense of having a fuzzy CAP, which isn't the most attractive under-the-hood accessory I was tempted to grab the blue wrap they offer, but figured I'd go ceramic versus colored fiberglass.

Anyways, I'm kind of interested to see how this comes out, no matter the outcome.

 

[H3dlund]

Heat wrap a pipe will keep the air warm in the pipe, and that is oppsite what you want. Dont wrap it, thats why you wrap exhaust manifolds. After turbo you don't want any wrap on the downpipe. Only if you have major heat problems for other things nearby it. But after the turbo you want the exhaust gas to cold down and get out of there as quick as possible!

Warm air takes more room than cold air, so you don't want your turbocharged air to be warm.



If this even is understanable, haha i feel like a 5 year old sometimes when i write in english instead of my main language.

 

[tomedkaz]

I always admire ingenuity - so kudos to you

My take is that there isn't enough time to heat the air flowing through that pipe so your wrap won't do much. You'd benefit tremendously with a FMIC though

...also...it makes your engine bay look like it's 20 years old

 

[dave_n_ruth]

If anything the rough texture of the charge pipe provides greater surface area for heat transfer. Even polishing it will reduce the ability for the air to be cooled, though I am guessing not by anything measurable. If anything your making the FMIC work harder. How about wrapping the charge pipe with copper tubing and running coolant around it.

 

[fallenfenix87]

If anything the rough texture of the charge pipe provides greater surface area for heat transfer. Even polishing it will reduce the ability for the air to be cooled, though I am guessing not by anything measurable. If anything your making the FMIC work harder. How about wrapping the charge pipe with copper tubing and running coolant around it.

That would be awesome, actually, but lots of time and $$$

 

[fallenfenix87]

My biggest question at this point that no one has been able to answer is this:

What is the temperature difference [if any] between the charged air in the pipe and the engine block/engine bay????

If it's like 0-20 degrees difference either way, the wrap probably does little harm or little good, but if we're talking 80-100+ degrees difference under load, then it could be *significant.

*significant meaning the wrap might make a temperature difference, but not necessarily a "performance" difference. the time the air spends in the pipe is not long.

My latest brainwave on this whole concept is if folks have the dual hood grilles, the passenger side one could have a scoop/snorkel fashioned to push outside air over the charge pipe. That might be able to make a difference without looking all furry

 

[R.Photo]

I think it may cause the opposite effect of what you want, and it looks like....

 

[fallenfenix87]

Exactly why I'm trying it, so we can KNOW it does or doesn't, rather than THINK it does

And check your picture linky

 

[Black1985gt]

I think you'd be better off wrapping the hot side of the turbo as opposed to the cold side. Heat wrapping the charge tube may keep the heat from the turbo/downpipe from entering the cold side via heat transfer into the tube but not by much. Having the hot side of the turbo housing and your downpipe either wrapped or coated would give you better results as far as lowering underhood temps. Which is the main reason for using heat wrap in the picture. I can't see the picture by the way because it's blocked at work here. So if I'm way off base here let me know lol.

 

[H3dlund]

Test with a logger and see if you will notice any difference in temp. I guess the only difference you gonna find out is that it's ugly as hell with that tube wrapped.

 

[fallenfenix87]

Test with a logger and see if you will notice any difference in temp. I guess the only difference you gonna find out is that it's ugly as hell with that tube wrapped.

Yes, I've been made aware of this condition . I don't mind it too much cause, well, it's under the hood. I'll have to find another R guy with a logger so we can do side-by-side readings.

And you're english is fine so far. As good as some of the native speakers on here!

 

[fallenfenix87]

I think you'd be better off wrapping the hot side of the turbo as opposed to the cold side. Heat wrapping the charge tube may keep the heat from the turbo/downpipe from entering the cold side via heat transfer into the tube but not by much. Having the hot side of the turbo housing and your downpipe either wrapped or coated would give you better results as far as lowering underhood temps. Which is the main reason for using heat wrap in the picture. I can't see the picture by the way because it's blocked at work here. So if I'm way off base here let me know lol.

I agree completely! The only reason I did the CAP exclusively was it was really easy to get to and took less than an hour from bolt off, wrap, to bolt back on. Wrapping the hot side of the turbo would block more heat from getting into the engine bay, which may or may not help with the charge pipe wrapped up the way it is.

Wrapping the cold side of the IC piping would help even more, and I'll get to that when I can [probably when I do a FMIC or IPD IC]

 

[fallenfenix87]

I think I'll officially rename my charge pipe as "The Caterpillar" for as long as the heat wrap is on there...

 

[fallenfenix87]

If anything the rough texture of the charge pipe provides greater surface area for heat transfer. Even polishing it will reduce the ability for the air to be cooled, though I am guessing not by anything measurable. If anything your making the FMIC work harder. How about wrapping the charge pipe with copper tubing and running coolant around it.

Sorry to double quote you, but I just remembered this from an earlier SS thread, might have to hit the "english" button at the top

http://www.do88.se/p/engine-tuning/...00-07/volvo-s60v70n-turbo-pressure-pipes.html

Disregarding the larger diameter of the aftermarket pipe, it should theoretically be worse according to your premise because it is polished and decreases the heat transfer potential of the pipe? If this were true, then wouldn't all NA cars have their intake pipes textured on the surface, or even their intake manifolds so they would shed more heat before combustion? Especially when it comes to aftermarket parts? Yet, most often we see highly polished pipes, even from non-blingy performance companies. Just a thought...

 

[Mike A]

it would be cool to have sort of a double walled pipe sort of like this

charged air goes through the inside bit, and the outer layer carries cold coolant from the radiator

 

[CKAVolvo]

http://www.do88.se/p/engine-tuning/...00-07/volvo-s60v70n-turbo-pressure-pipes.html

Disregarding the larger diameter of the aftermarket pipe, it should theoretically be worse according to your premise because it is polished and decreases the heat transfer potential of the pipe? If this were true, then wouldn't all NA cars have their intake pipes textured on the surface, or even their intake manifolds so they would shed more heat before combustion? Especially when it comes to aftermarket parts? Yet, most often we see highly polished pipes, even from non-blingy performance companies. Just a thought...

I went with that Charged Air pipe and based on Killer B recommendation, which was as you noted above. I had it ceramic coated to compensate a bit. It also added a bit of texture to the inside of the pipe. Cant wait to get it installed, Along with a FMIC

 

[DrBrutal]

I think that having the wrap will keep the heat in, causing the intake temps to rise.... However, it could actually be more beneficial, compared to having the heat from the rest of the engine kept out, and having the air temp raise inside due to the wrap, but it's not as hot as it would be from just the engine heat in the first place..

Best way to find out = get a nice code reader that can read CAN and provides real-time data logging, and measure your intake temps with and without the wrap under the same driving conditions (same ambient temp, speed, gear, etc..)

 

[dave_n_ruth]

The only reason the R pipe is textured is because it was cast molded aluminum. Otherwise it would have been smooth. Regardless thats why they put fins on CPU's for cooling. The additional surface area allows for greater heat transfer. So making a charge pipe with fins would be better than wrapping it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fin_(extended_surface)

 

[850arrrsaylikepirate]

Here's the thing, this wrap job isn't going to do squat for good or bad. All its going to do is make your engine bay look horrible. I commend you on playing around but to think this is a serious mod requiring data logging is pretty funny, sorry.

 

[Black1985gt]

it would be cool to have sort of a double walled pipe sort of like this

charged air goes through the inside bit, and the outer layer carries cold coolant from the radiator

Generally speaking the air charge is going to be considerably cooler than the antifreeze running through the radiator. Normal antifreeze temp is usually around 200 degrees. When I was a kid I have the fantastic idea of running R134 through the outer tube. Never made any attempt at actually doing it though haha.