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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Local shop just got a dyno, so I'm going to take the R and see what its putting out.<p>Unfortunately, its only a 2wd dyno, so I'll be running FWD, but I've read a few about the 04's not responding well to AWD dynos?<p>Anyways, when doing the pull, I'm assuming DSTC should be off, put it in advance mode, and the Haldex fuze should be pulled. Correct?<p>Which fuze is it by the way? Any other tidbits appreciated as well.<p>Thanks!<p>Rue
 

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Re: Dyno'ing the R on Friday (Rues R)

well to get real results is should be AWD dyno
 

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Re: Dyno'ing the R on Friday (s140s)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>s140s</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">well to get real results is should be AWD dyno</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Disagree. Learned the hard way. <p>The haldex shuffles power around too much for a reading to be accurate. Better to run in 2WD. <p>
 

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Re: Dyno'ing the R on Friday (Needsdecaf)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Needsdecaf</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>Disagree. Learned the hard way. <p>The haldex shuffles power around too much for a reading to be accurate. Better to run in 2WD. <p></TD></TR></TABLE><p>Thats a good point, but it somewhat means there isnt a way to be accurate <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/zeroforum_graphics/screwy.gif" BORDER="0">
 

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Re: Dyno'ing the R on Friday (s140s)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>s140s</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>Thats a good point, but it somewhat means there isnt a way to be accurate <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/zeroforum_graphics/screwy.gif" BORDER="0"> </TD></TR></TABLE><p>Not understanding what you're saying. The way to be most accurate from run to run is to do the pull in 2WD. That will give you consistent (from a drivetrain standard) results. <p>
 

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Re: Dyno'ing the R on Friday (Needsdecaf)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Needsdecaf</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>Disagree. Learned the hard way. <p>The haldex shuffles power around too much for a reading to be accurate. Better to run in 2WD. </TD></TR></TABLE><p>I'm curious about the setup you utilized? I learned how to operate a dyno using my S60R in AWD mode on a Mustang AWD setup. The results were excellent with no oddities.
 

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Re: Dyno'ing the R on Friday (Needsdecaf)

I think what he's trying to say is he's searching for a means to provide the most accurate, real-world power figures (i.e. do a run in AWD vs FWD, as it normally runs in AWD on the street). However s140s, there really isn't a perfect way to do it. The fans don't move enough air, the engine isn't fighting its own weight or wind resistance, it's all relative. As Needs said, the Haldex has conniptions trying to deal with the fact that it's on a dyno versus the street. Hell, you can go pull on two separate dyno's in the exact same manner and not get the same figures. The important thing is to pick a dyno and conditions, and then use that same dyno and configuration as close as possible IOT document any gains from modifications. <p>HTH<p>-Steve
 

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Re: Dyno'ing the R on Friday (Needsdecaf)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Needsdecaf</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>Not understanding what you're saying. The way to be most accurate from run to run is to do the pull in 2WD. That will give you consistent (from a drivetrain standard) results. <p></TD></TR></TABLE><p>What exactly is "accurate?" <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/zeroforum_graphics/screwy.gif" BORDER="0"> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/zeroforum_graphics/screwy.gif" BORDER="0"> <p>The next time you are parking-lot pimpin with the hood of your Volvo popped as you're standing next to it, be sure to provide full disclosure to whoever you state your WHP figure to, unless of course you permanently drive the car in FWD-mode. The second it reverts back to AWD, it's not making the same power it was. Besides, the only real purpose of a dyno (to tune, not to get a meaningless WHP figure) is moot if you tune in FWD then switch back as soon as you roll off the dyno.
 

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Instead of getting stuck in the muck of the 2WD/AWD debate I will return to the topic at hand.<p>A tidbit that would have helped me as I went to the last dyno day was to have known to pop the spark plug cover off beforehand. There is some argument as to whether or not the signal for an RPM reading to calculate the torque could have been found without the panel removed. However, finding out that the tech cannot get a reading while the car is already hot and strapped to the dyno is not fun. (and I still have the burn marks on my forearm to prove it).<p>I'd rather do it while the car is cool in your driveway because it is a little bit of a pain. To pull the spark plug cover on an '04 you need to remove the OTE (Over the Engine) pipe, which will require some patience as the collar near the turbo end is a pain to get to.
 

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Its worked JUST IN CASE you didn't take the cover off to put the signal can be found on top....<p>If your lucky.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Re: (chinaonnitrous1)

Run this by me about the spark plug cover again and an RPM signal. Where else could they get the reading?<p>What's the harm in seeing what the car will put out? I'm just curious. <p>I think it was NeedsDecaf that had issues with his R after he dyno'd it. Crazy stuff with the AWD system? <p>What kind of power loss is there between the crank and the wheels, just to estimate crank HP?<p>Rue
 

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Re: (Rues R)

22-25% for AWD. Substantially less for FWD, however you will not be putting 100% of all power to the front wheels anyway.
 

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Re: (Rues R)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Rues R</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Run this by me about the spark plug cover again and an RPM signal. Where else could they get the reading?<p>What kind of power loss is there between the crank and the wheels, just to estimate crank HP?<p>Rue</TD></TR></TABLE><p>20% power loss or so but you also have to factor in that the Volvo power estimate was hyper inflated to begin with at 300hp. Stock you should see between 220 and 240 whp in FWD. <p>Perhaps different dynos connect to the RPM signal in different ways. The dyno operator we had wanted to tap the signal right off the coil pack on top of the plug. That requires the removal of the aforementioned parts. If you need a run through of what's involved just send me an IM if you cannot locate it via search.<p>We also had quite a bit of trepidation after reading about the AWD issues Needsdecf had and opted out of the headache. Many people have had no issue running it in AWD but we didn't want to chance it. You do not have the option anyways seeing as the dyno is a single roller.
 

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Re: Dyno'ing the R on Friday (HPTJoe)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>HPTJoe</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br> The second it reverts back to AWD, it's not making the same power it was. .</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Wrong, it's simply putting power to the ground differently. The engine isn't making any more or less power. <p><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>HPTJoe</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br> Besides, the only real purpose of a dyno (to tune, not to get a meaningless WHP figure) is moot if you tune in FWD then switch back as soon as you roll off the dyno.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>You are correct. However, you contradict yourself. <p>As you said, your point is to tune. What are you tuning? If you were tuning the drivetrain (i.e. changing flywheels, wheels, gears, etc.) I would agree with you that you should dyno AWD. However if you are tuning the engine, you are trying to measure enigne output as accurately as possible. Ideally you'd remove the engine, mount it on an engine dyno, make the changes and see what your gains were. You'd monitor coolant temp, IAT, etc. and keep them the same from run to run. But we're not Roger Penske so a chassis dyno it is. <p>Now, if you have a variable like the Haldex which can make <i> dyno results inconsistent from run to run because of the way it shuffles power back and forth</i> how are you going to be able to tell if your exhaust picked up 5 hp or not? You can't. 5 HP is in your range of error because of the Haldex. Because the haldex is is reacting strangely because of the varying wheel speeds, it can mess with your dyno reading. <p>This is specific to this car (and maybe other cars), not necessarily all AWD cars. <p>
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Re: Dyno'ing the R on Friday (Needsdecaf)

Looks like I'll give them a call back and see if they will be trying to get a source off the coil or through OBDII. I would ASSUME most would use the OBDII method, and since the shop is a local performance shop where they build some SERIOUS V8's. The owner knew he was putting in a gold mine when he put in a chasis dyno.<p>IF I have to source a signal from the coil, it gives me a GREAT reason to clean up the engine bay and paint the spark plug cover <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/smile.gif" BORDER="0">\<p>And how many, and what fuzes, need to be pulled from the trunk.<p>Thanks!<p>Rue
 

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Re: Dyno'ing the R on Friday (Rues R)

If memory serves me right, you want to pull fuse 17 in trunk...it's clearly stated in the owners manual which fuse is for AWD so I'd double check before you do your pull.
 

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Re: Dyno'ing the R on Friday (Bdubs)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Bdubs</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">If memory serves me right, you want to pull fuse 17 in trunk...it's clearly stated in the owners manual which fuse is for AWD so I'd double check before you do your pull.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Correct:<p><A HREF="http://apps.volvocars.us/ownersdocs/2004/2004_S60/04s60_11b.htm#pg143" TARGET="_blank">http://apps.volvocars.us/owner...pg143</A>
 

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Re: Dyno'ing the R on Friday (HPTJoe)

Hmmmm. I think all I need to say is 12.9 in the quarter mile on the stock motor and bolt ons.<p>On a dynojet in 2WD mode I would suspect a stock S60R or V70R to dyno between 240 - 250 whp.
 

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For RPM calculation -- Mustangs can operate by "calibrating" to the RPM of the vehicle. Simply engage the rollers, bring up to speed in the gear you want and hold a predetermined RPM. This makes this really straight forward and is quite spot-on.
 
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