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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey Guys,<br> So I found someone who would be willing to mock up a new caliper braket for the S40/V50/C70/C30 crowd. He has already done this before and IPD actually sells his kit because its so good. Basically we could take the Porsche Brake Calipers and fit them to our car with his help...thats 4-piston Brembo stopping power! We would obviously need a new rotor as well (I was thinking 355mm personally <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/wink.gif" BORDER="0"> ) but that can come later.<p>He is located in the Bay Area so if anyone is interested he is more than willing to take a shot at it. Your would need to leave the car with him for maybe a day or two while he measures and gets the fit right but shoot me a PM if interested.<p>Oh, and if this works we could see some nice 4-piston Brembo kits for like less than $1500 (but dont quote me on that until the R&D is done!)
 

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will "R" brakes fit with that new braket? v(i know they're brembo)
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Re: (mJrO)

Maybe. I was hoping for some slotted or cross drilled really to improve heat dissipation on the rotor instead of the flat R brembo's.<p>Hopefully with the braket, though, we can open up our choices for rotor's and even adapt some already existing ones on the market, like the 850's choices or something.
 

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If you don't track your car there is no point to bigger brakes.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Re: (quick)

I highly disagree my good man. If you do ANY performance modifications to your car then you are a solid candidate for higher performance brakes. With more power, it would be wise to be able to handle it and therefore your stopping power must increase in line with the performance gains. If you can get to a faster rate of speed quicker than stock then you are going to have to stop quicker than stock as well and heat buildup or "blueing" from stopping can warp rotors very quickly. Brakes are normally my first mod but Volvo has a fairly solid setup...that and there is nothing on the market save the WP kit.<p>Not to mention the fact that your brakes will be able to better handle hard braking from any situation such as accident avoidance (key factor), slowing down to not get a speeding ticket (for those of you out there....you know who you are <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/wink.gif" BORDER="0"> ), or even to really impress everyone with how quickly you can stop....okay so im stretching a bit with the last one but I cannot emphasize enough about Accident Avoidance! Where I live there is a bad deer problem and I sure would love to not hit bambi or bambi's mom and destroy my front end...and thats with reasonable driving and obeying all laws. Stopping is very very key to any driving, especially when modifying performance.<p>But yes, they can ALSO be used for tracking your car <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/biggrin.gif" BORDER="0">
 

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Re: (Tarheelvolvo)

You will run into major problems finding a whel that will provide enough brake caliper clearance without significantly reducing your offset. Not sure if the P1 platform likes lower ETs. Just something to consider.<p>Our <A HREF="http://www.vivaperformance.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=69_70&products_id=394" TARGET="_blank">WP Pro</A> braking systems include a 12mm spacer to ensure proper brake caliper clearance, and the WP Pro caliper is one of the easiest calipers to work with.
 

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Re: (quick)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>quick</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">If you don't track your car there is no point to bigger brakes. </TD></TR></TABLE><p>The same can be said about ECU upgrades, exhausts, downpipes, etc. You should never be exceeding the speed limit, so those mods don't have a point either, right? <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/biggrin.gif" BORDER="0"> <p>Mod on... <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://********************/smile/emthup.gif" BORDER="0"> <p>
 

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Re: (George @ ViVA)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>George @ ViVA</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>The same can be said about ECU upgrades, exhausts, downpipes, etc. You should never be exceeding the speed limit, so those mods don't have a point either, right? <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/biggrin.gif" BORDER="0"> <p>Mod on... <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://********************/smile/emthup.gif" BORDER="0"> <p></TD></TR></TABLE><p>No -- you don't understand. <p>If you can lock the tires up then you have reached the limit of adhesion of the tires and the brakes are not the bottleneck. <p>People don't use racing tires on the street, so there is plenty of braking force in the stock brakes, and there is no need to worry about fade on the street. <p>Sorry, dudes -- there's just no need for this. Go for it and have fun, but don't kid yourself -- this won't help you stop any faster than me with stock brakes because the brakes aren't a limiter. <p>If you don't believe me just ask Lou (oldman) -- he knows. Even if you increase the clamping force the tires are the bottleneck. <br>-Chris
 

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Re: (quick)

even with race tires and a short autoX and a hot day the S40 will not exceed the OEM brake heat disapation limits... You need something like a 4000 Impala with drum brakes to do that... Bigger brakes will <br>A) slow you down <br>B) decrease ride<br>C) look bad action<br>D) Cost money.<p> You can use mods on the street, as long as you don't break traction, speedlimt or engage in a contest, you can acclerate as fast as you want.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Re: (quick)

Do me a favor, go hold a plate and try and get someone to pull it out of your hand.<p>Now hold the plate with two hands and get someone to pull it out of your hand.<p>Which is harder to pull out?<p>Also, what car in the last 8years has been able to lock its tires under heavy braking? ABS should, unless removed, solve that for everyone.<p>fade is not so much a problem as warping is. I have seen plenty of rotors that have been warped under heavy braking when some guy put like 500hp in his car but kept the stock brakes. <p>And yes, I will stop faster than you, otherwise everyone would have single piston calipers and flat surface rotors. I guess Porsche doesnt know what they are doing designing 4-piston calipers with cross drilled rotors stock...
 

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Re: (Tarheelvolvo)

you will not stop faster with big or multi piston brakes, the OEM brakes can exceed the grip of the tire. That is a fundamental truth. I race and have been racing for many decades big brakes are useless for any normal types of racing a near stock car will do.
 

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Re: (Oldman)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Oldman</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You can use mods on the street, as long as you don't break traction, speedlimt or engage in a contest, you can acclerate as fast as you want.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Unfortunately in the state of MA you can be stopped and ticketed for ''accelerating too fast'', even if you are adhering to the speed limit.<p><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>quick</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br>If you can lock the tires up then you have reached the limit of adhesion of the tires and the brakes are not the bottleneck. </TD></TR></TABLE><p>While I understand your concern, ''bigger brakes'' alone will not cause you to lock up your wheels. A caliper with enough clamping force can lock up tires whether the rotor is 10" or 20" in diameter.<p>2004+ S60 (R, non R) models share the same master brake cylinder (an upgrade from pre 2004 models). There are plenty of non-R S60 owners who have the standard puny single piston brake caliper, 302mm brake rotors upgrade to the R's 4-piston brake caliper, 330mm brake rotors with significant braking improvements. The R's brake in standard form do not lock up the tires (they come pretty damn close though), but they still exhibit improved braking performance over the non-R brakes. <p>You *can* improve braking performance (less fade, quick stopping distances, reduced rotor temps) on street applications by upgrading to bigger brake rotors and/or improved caliper clamping power. Just ask the many 850/70 owners who have upgraded from 280mm brake rotors to either 302mm or the rare 320mm OEM upgraded brake rotors (using the same calipers, but with different brackets).<p> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://********************/smile/emcocktl.gif" BORDER="0">
 

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Re: (George @ ViVA)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>George @ ViVA</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">While I understand your concern, ''bigger brakes'' alone will not cause you to lock up your wheels. A caliper with enough clamping force can lock up tires whether the rotor is 10" or 20" in diameter.<p>2004+ S60 (R, non R) models share the same master brake cylinder (an upgrade from pre 2004 models). There are plenty of non-R S60 owners who have the standard puny single piston brake caliper, 302mm brake rotors upgrade to the R's 4-piston brake caliper, 330mm brake rotors with significant braking improvements. The R's brake in standard form do not lock up the tires (they come pretty damn close though), but they still exhibit improved braking performance over the non-R brakes. <p>You *can* improve braking performance (less fade, quick stopping distances, reduced rotor temps) on street applications by upgrading to bigger brake rotors and/or improved caliper clamping power. Just ask the many 850/70 owners who have upgraded from 280mm brake rotors to either 302mm or the rare 320mm OEM upgraded brake rotors (using the same calipers, but with different brackets).<p> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://********************/smile/emcocktl.gif" BORDER="0"> </TD></TR></TABLE><p>Thanks for the good discussion, George. Cheers. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/smile.gif" BORDER="0"><p>The example you cite is one where the brakes on the car are not up to the task. The brakes on the V50 and S40 are sufficient to the task of exceeding the grip of the car with a simple hard press of the pedal. <p>You definitely can improve fade characteristics. <p>Also, if you alter the clamping force in a way that is not proportional to the standard setup then you can screw up the ABS pretty bad. <p>Big brakes have a place -- on track. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/smile.gif" BORDER="0"><br>-Chris
 

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Re: (Tarheelvolvo)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Tarheelvolvo</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Also, what car in the last 8years has been able to lock its tires under heavy braking? ABS should, unless removed, solve that for everyone.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Correct -- ABS prevents the tires from locking. Why does it matter? Because the brakes have enough clamping force to lock the tires. <p><br><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">And yes, I will stop faster than you, otherwise everyone would have single piston calipers and flat surface rotors. I guess Porsche doesnt know what they are doing designing 4-piston calipers with cross drilled rotors stock...</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Your comparison is apples to oranges. Take two V50s with the same tires -- one with big brakes and the other not -- they will stop in the same distance. <p>However, if you were to do some weight reduction that would affect things. <p>If you really want to stop better remove some weight from your car and get better tires. <p>Sorry dude but I have ~3 years of experience on track as well. I'm not just talking out of my ass here. It's a nice idea, but it's a waste of your $ if you're looking for a shorter stopping distance when your stock brakes are sufficient to exceed the traction of your tires.<BR><BR>
<i>Modified by quick at 9:20 PM 8-30-2006</i>
 

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Re: (quick)

Another suggestion - The V50 with stock tires stops 70-0 in 161 feet. Read around and look at what other cars on the market stop in that distance.<p>Hint - it's a rather short list of rather impressive vehicles.<p>Tom.
 
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