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Discussion Starter · #1 ·

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Still, most of the car mags seem to think of the Volvo as an "alternative" choice to the BMW's and Audi's; rather than a direct competitor. Those of us who have owned BMW's and Audi's would probably differ with that analysis.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Still, most of the car mags seem to think of the Volvo as an "alternative" choice to the BMW's and Audi's; rather than a direct competitor. Those of us who have owned BMW's and Audi's would probably differ with that analysis.
:thumbup: I've owned two of each of those other makes and never will again!
 

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Those of us who have owned BMW's and Audi's would probably differ with that analysis.
And those of us who left Volvo may differ as well. That said, the T5 AWD should definitely help the lineup.
 

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Still, most of the car mags seem to think of the Volvo as an "alternative" choice to the BMW's and Audi's; rather than a direct competitor. Those of us who have owned BMW's and Audi's would probably differ with that analysis.
I have also had 3 BMWs, a 1 series (excellent car) a 3 Series (very good car) and a X3 (terrible car a shame on BMW). I really never see the Volvo as being less than the BMW. Yes the BMW handles better than the Volvo, definitely, but the ride is a lot harsher, and most people use their cars to drive to places not just push them over winding roads, in the real world with bad shape roads, I prefer a softer ride. I also had access to numerous C-Class MBs and those compared to the Volvo are very similar both in how they drive and the quality materials. So to me they are direct competition. The FWD and AWD vs RWD again is a matter of how much you really drive a car hard on the twisties. And to be honest, Volvo´s Turbo engines are faster than the "price comparable" BMW and Merc engines (the 335i engine puts it well above the price of a Volvo).

Most people probably see Volvo as competitor to Acura, Buick, Lincoln and Lexus.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
And those of us who left Volvo may differ as well. That said, the T5 AWD should definitely help the lineup.
Sorry, I did a lousy job of making my point. I can tell you tales of pure joy with 2 BMWs. :beer: :beer: Today, I just don't like BMW's ever-increasing dimensions and prices, but it will be hard for me not to strongly consider the upcoming M4 (but I'd rather have a 2014 version of the 2002 Tii). With the Audis, one was terrific - stone cold reliable and put a smile on my face every time I got in it. But the more recent one was so bad in every way that I couldn't even think of anyone I disliked enough to give it to.

And to keep myself out of trouble, I never criticize anyone's automotive choices if they've already been made. (What's the point?) If I'm asked to contribute before someone buys a car, that's a different story. ;)
 

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And those of us who left Volvo may differ as well. That said, the T5 AWD should definitely help the lineup.
I had three consecutive Audi's lemon lawed.

I've had quite a few BMW's. The 3's have regressed. The E30 and E46's were the best. The X6 is nice now that I've warmed up to its styling. As a matter of fact, it will be 23 months old in August and has just shy of 70k miles. The X5M is 10 months old and has 30k miles.
 

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I've owned: BMW's 528i, Z3, and Z4; Audi's A6, and two A4's. I had the most trouble with my 528i, but all were pretty reliable cars. I really liked the 528i, loved the Z3, hated the Z4. With Audi, all were very reliable and a pleasure to drive and own. With the closing of my only reasonably close Audi dealer; 1 1/2 hours away; I opted for an AWD Volvo as my only practical replacement choice.

I did not, quite frankly, expect the S60 to be as good as my last 2009 A4. In fact, when I first got the car, I have to admit I was annoyed at how Volvo did some things compared with Audi. Now, after 8 months in the Volvo, I find that it does everything really well. I thought then, and still do, that Audi's turbo 4 was one of the best engines I had ever come across. I'm now equally as impressed with Volvo's turbo six.

I'm not saying that the S60 is better than the BMW or Audi competition, but I now do think it's pretty much on an equal footing with them. The slight edge that the Germans seem to have in handling and steering feedback is not nearly as great as some would think, although it is there. Overall, it really would not take much for Volvo to tweak this car and overtake the Germans. A few added amenities (power lumbar support, digital speed display, etc.) and some suspension refinements over the production run would do it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I did not, quite frankly, expect the S60 to be as good as my last 2009 A4. In fact, when I first got the car, I have to admit I was annoyed at how Volvo did some things compared with Audi. Now, after 8 months in the Volvo, I find that it does everything really well. I thought then, and still do, that Audi's turbo 4 was one of the best engines I had ever come across. I'm now equally as impressed with Volvo's turbo six.
Interesting comments. The turbo 4 in my 2010 A4 was one of the worst engines I've encountered, primarily due to a design defect intended to increase fuel economy that in practice caused high oil consumption and an engine rebuild at 22,000 miles. I'm also hoping for good things from my S60 turbo 5/AWD combination.

I've found that I really appreciate Volvo's simple approach to design; the A4 in many ways seemed to be overly complicated just because Audi thought that's the way it should be. To turn on the heated seats in the Volvo, for example, you just punch the button 1, 2, 3 for the setting and you're done (and you don't need to check the display unless you want to). In the A4, you have to click on the heated seat switch, turn a separate knob to one of 8 positions, check the display to find the number you want and then click on the knob to set it. My buns simply don't need 8 choices, especially since the range of temperatures on both cars seems to be the same.
 

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My last car was a 2001 A4 and it was a good car and pretty reliable and continues to be so - I know this since my neighbor bought the car! But it was at about 65k and starting to have those niggly little fixes too often. It handled well and felt good, but was underpowered. I started looking and did lots of research and found the R-Design fit the bill for power, looks, and value compared to an Audi S4 (yes the S4 is faster). I considered a MB and a few other makes, but not BMW (I've said why too many times on SS already.) I have had my S60 for about 10 months now and dig it more than almost every car I've ever owned. (My old 1991 Alfa Romeo Spider is hard to beat.)

We are starting to search for a replacement for my wife's Porsche Cayenne and so far we're considering the XC60R-Design, VW Tiguan/Toureg, and Audi Q5. Well see.
 

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We are starting to search for a replacement for my wife's Porsche Cayenne and so far we're considering the XC60R-Design, VW Tiguan/Toureg, and Audi Q5. Well see.
My parents have an XC60 T6 R-Design and they love it and I find myself stealing it from time to time; really a great car and love the styling cues (wish the S60RD had the high bolstered seats like the XC).
 

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That´s a good review. In the end I actually think the good thing about Volvo is that it doesn´t have all the "bling" that surrounds owning BMWs and MBs and their associated stereotypes. Its a subtle and good car with excellent quality, yet it won´t call attention like someone arriving in a BMW (which have become very common actually)
 

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Still, most of the car mags seem to think of the Volvo as an "alternative" choice to the BMW's and Audi's; rather than a direct competitor. Those of us who have owned BMW's and Audi's would probably differ with that analysis.
The S60 is certainly a decent competitor for the A4 and (to an extent) the 3-series. The 2013 3-series does have numerous advantages over both the A4 and the S60. But honestly, many people who want a midsize luxury sedan will stick to test driving the Mercedes C Class, Audi A4, and BMW 3-series. They don't consider and test the alternative options, which include not only the S60 but the Acura TL, Infiniti G, and Lexus IS. These cars are simply not seen as a showing of wealth the way the Audi, BMW, and MB-branded vehicles are. A lot of people, especially in the entry-class luxury segment, are at least equally concerned with the appearance and feeling of success they get with their luxury sedan as they are with the quality of the car.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 · (Edited)

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It's to bad the T5 doesn't come in RD.
Yea but it doesn't take much to make the T5 AWD look and handle very similar to the T6RD. We plan on doing a few things from the RD on our T5 AWD.
 

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Yea but it doesn't take much to make the T5 AWD look and handle very similar to the T6RD. We plan on doing a few things from the RD on our T5 AWD.
I have been online looking and I cannot find that much info on the difference between 2012 and 2013 S60's. Found some changes but not many. Curious if with the 2013 PCC you still have to stick the key in the slot like with the 2012 or if you can leave it in your pocket?

Debating if I should get a '12 T6 RD or a fully loaded '13 T5 AWD
 
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