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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have just ordered today the full areokit, grill, and duel exhaust from ipd today!!!! Does ne one have an assortment of pictures of the body kit especally in black mounted on a car????? I will post pic's as soon as I mount them, should be in a few weeks....<BR>~Spencer~<P>
 

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Gallery of the MS Design Kit is here: <A HREF="http://www.swedespeed.com/resources/gallery/auto_shows/iaa_01/msdesign_s60/index.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.swedespeed.com/resources/gallery/auto_shows/iaa_01/msdesign_s60/index.html</A> <P> <IMG SRC="http://www.swedespeed.com/resources/gallery/auto_shows/iaa_01/msdesign_s60/images/large/02.jpg"> <BR> <IMG SRC="http://www.swedespeed.com/resources/gallery/auto_shows/iaa_01/msdesign_s60/images/large/06.jpg"> <BR> <IMG SRC="http://www.swedespeed.com/resources/gallery/auto_shows/iaa_01/msdesign_s60/images/large/10.jpg"> <BR> <IMG SRC="http://www.swedespeed.com/resources/gallery/auto_shows/iaa_01/msdesign_s60/images/large/12.jpg"> <P>Make sure to post pics when you get your car together.<BR>
 

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I just noticed that ipd has their prices and info posted on their website. Cool stuff...<P><B><A HREF="http://www.ipdusa.com/ProductsList.aspx?subSubCategoryID=716" TARGET=_blank>Aerokits and Spoilers</A></B><P>-Drew
 

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Uh, "Warning, Will Robinson," but after talking with an aerodynamicist that teaches auto aerodynamics at the Pasadena Design Center I'd like to point out that these kits are just for looks and will actually hinder the performance of the car slightly.<P>To wit: first, they add weight to the car which will slow your 0-60 and 1/4 mile times. Second, they add <I>frontal area </I> to the car which actually results in <I>increased </I> net overall drag. (Just a little, but it's really more.) What the manufacturers do to confuse the issue is to claim they lower the "drag coefficient." <BR>Well, that's true, also.<P>How can this be?<P>Simple. Drag coefficient is defined by the equation Cd = Total vehicle drag divided by dynamic air pressure (1/2 rho V^2) and the <I>frontal area of the vehicle.</I> Equation-wise, it looks like this:<P>Cd = Drag/(1/2 rho V^2 S).<P>(rho is air density in kg/m^3, V is airspeed in meters/sec, S is cross-sectional area in square meters. Drag is force, or Newtons. For you English units folks, rho is slugs per cubic foot, V in ft/sec, and S is square feet, Force is pounds <I>force</I> not weight.) <P>The area S is the projected area exposed to the airstream, i.e., if you had a light bulb placed an infinite distance away from the front of the car it would project a shadow against a wall behind the car. All of the dark area of the shadow would be the cross-sectional area S used in the equation. Note that European manufacturers do <I>not </I>include the area of the tires where the US manufacturers <I>do.</I><P>OK, got it? Now then, note that the front skirt of your add-on aero kit adds frontal area <I>under</I> the front bumper. This <I>increases</I> the car's area S. Because S is in the denominator of the equation for Drag Coefficient Cd, the Cd number will be <I>reduced</I>. Now (according to the aero prof) the front skirt actually adds a bit of drag to the vehicle, but because the area is larger, the net Cd number decreases slightly when you add the skirt, hence the skirt manufacturer isn't technically lying when he claims the drag <I>coefficient</I> is lowered. But in reality the total drag on the car is <I>increased</I> so the car will actually top out at a lower speed.<P>Also, the 'rear spoiler' thing--Um, it really doesn't do anything there on the rear deck of the S60. Believe me, flow separates off the deck just fine at the existing trunk lip. <BR>Actually, for the optimum condition you want the air flow to separate at the upper edge of the rear window becuase if airflow remains attached down the rear window to the trunk deck then it will form a pair of "wingtip vorticies" and cause even more drag. The tip vortex is caused because of the natural airfoil shape of the car (The car is a low-aspect-ratio airfoil, after all) that generates lift even at zero angle of attack. This is bad, so if you can get the flow to separate (detach from the skin of the car) up on top of the roof line then there's no overall gamma rotation of the air, no vorticies, and hence, no induced drag. <P>The spoiler on the late 80's Toyota Supra was the best example of good spoiler placement. It had what looked like a roof extension that came horizontally from the roof line over the rear window by about 8 inches or so. It was quite effective in dumping the lift without presenting excessive frontal area to the airstream.<P>Um. FYI, you understand. Enjoy your new aero kit . . . .
 

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by T5 Dave:<BR><B>Uh, "Warning, Will Robinson," but after talking with an aerodynamicist that teaches auto aerodynamics at the Pasadena Design Center I'd like to point out that these kits are just for looks and will actually hinder the performance of the car slightly.<P>To wit: first, they add weight to the car which will slow your 0-60 and 1/4 mile times. Second, they add <I>frontal area </I> to the car which actually results in <I>increased </I> net overall drag. (Just a little, but it's really more.) What the manufacturers do to confuse the issue is to claim they lower the "drag coefficient." <BR>Well, that's true, also.<P>How can this be?<P>Simple. Drag coefficient is defined by the equation Cd = Total vehicle drag divided by dynamic air pressure (1/2 rho V^2) and the <I>frontal area of the vehicle.</I> Equation-wise, it looks like this:<P>Cd = Drag/(1/2 rho V^2 S).<P>(rho is air density in kg/m^3, V is airspeed in meters/sec, S is cross-sectional area in square meters. Drag is force, or Newtons. For you English units folks, rho is slugs per cubic foot, V in ft/sec, and S is square feet, Force is pounds <I>force</I> not weight.) <P>The area S is the projected area exposed to the airstream, i.e., if you had a light bulb placed an infinite distance away from the front of the car it would project a shadow against a wall behind the car. All of the dark area of the shadow would be the cross-sectional area S used in the equation. Note that European manufacturers do <I>not </I>include the area of the tires where the US manufacturers <I>do.</I><P>OK, got it? Now then, note that the front skirt of your add-on aero kit adds frontal area <I>under</I> the front bumper. This <I>increases</I> the car's area S. Because S is in the denominator of the equation for Drag Coefficient Cd, the Cd number will be <I>reduced</I>. Now (according to the aero prof) the front skirt actually adds a bit of drag to the vehicle, but because the area is larger, the net Cd number decreases slightly when you add the skirt, hence the skirt manufacturer isn't technically lying when he claims the drag <I>coefficient</I> is lowered. But in reality the total drag on the car is <I>increased</I> so the car will actually top out at a lower speed.<P>Also, the 'rear spoiler' thing--Um, it really doesn't do anything there on the rear deck of the S60. Believe me, flow separates off the deck just fine at the existing trunk lip. <BR>Actually, for the optimum condition you want the air flow to separate at the upper edge of the rear window becuase if airflow remains attached down the rear window to the trunk deck then it will form a pair of "wingtip vorticies" and cause even more drag. The tip vortex is caused because of the natural airfoil shape of the car (The car is a low-aspect-ratio airfoil, after all) that generates lift even at zero angle of attack. This is bad, so if you can get the flow to separate (detach from the skin of the car) up on top of the roof line then there's no overall gamma rotation of the air, no vorticies, and hence, no induced drag. <P>The spoiler on the late 80's Toyota Supra was the best example of good spoiler placement. It had what looked like a roof extension that came horizontally from the roof line over the rear window by about 8 inches or so. It was quite effective in dumping the lift without presenting excessive frontal area to the airstream.<P>Um. FYI, you understand. Enjoy your new aero kit . . . . </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Glad to know I'm not the only one here who realises this. There are a lot of kids out there today who think that Boeing 747 tailfins, large-diameter wheels/tires, exhaust tips by Yuban, and ground effects will make their cars go faster, but the sad reality of it all is that they won't. Sure, it may look cooler, but that's as far as the imaginary performance envelope goes. Besides, stock-looking "sleeper" cars (such as the ones I own) that are packing a punch under the hood (as well as suspension components) are more fun to drive than something that is borderline-r1ced.<P>-he who stacks pork<P>
 

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I know where you guys are coming from, but the MS-Design kit is so subtle IMHO, that it should not effect performance all that much. If it were up to me, I think I would just get the rear spoiler and front skirt. Johann's car looks about perfect, I think.<P>-Drew
 

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The full kit in black can be seen on MR-Sweden's website. <A HREF="http://www.mr-sweden-motorsport.de/showroom/s60_2.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.mr-sweden-motorsport.de/showroom/s60_2.html</A> . I could only afford the rear spoiler. I should have it done by next week. Since you are in Irvine I would recommend going to Lew Webb's Auto body. They do really nice work. That is where I am going to get mine done. Maybe you can show me that kit in person sometime. I live in Mission Viejo. Good Luck!
 

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I think most owners who do this are doing it for styling purposes. And, most likely as tame as this kit is aerodynamically, I doubt it would make any noticeable difference whatsoever.<P>Funny thing about this. Hondas are generally and stereotypically the cars that receive some of the most extreme aerodynamic mods. There's a big trend now on the East Coast, with the Honda Challenge sponsored by NASA (the car racing club, not the space agency). Anyway, there a ton of honda owners stripping off all the crap to make their cars more competitive on the track. In places like that (i.e. competition) it might make a noticeable difference, but on the road (barring use of big wings etc.) I doubt you'll see any difference in performance at all.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Hey turbo brick, i was wondering how much they were charging you to paint your spoiler... Does anyone have any idea on how much painting the full kit would cost....<P>Thanks, <P>Spencer
 

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Spencer,<BR>They are charging $70 to prime, sand, and paint the spoiler. I would say you are looking at about 300-400 to get it painted. I based that on a kit that my friend got painted for a civic. That does not include install, but the wing doesn't look like it is that hard to install only some expoy, but I don't know how the rest of it is installed.<P>
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Thanks for the info, can you give me the number of the place you are going to... cause i looked through the phone book and could not find lew webbs auto body... <P>Thanks<P>Spencer
 

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Guys - two questions:<P>1. Are all the parts of the Aerokit glue on or do they need to be bolted on?<P>2. How does the dual exhaust affect the warranty?<P>Thanks.<P>
 

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Calamazoo:<BR><B>Guys - two questions:<P>1. Are all the parts of the Aerokit glue on or do they need to be bolted on?<P>2. How does the dual exhaust affect the warranty?<P>Thanks.<P></B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>The front spoiler is partially glued and screws are used inside the fenders.<P>Since the front spoiler disturbs the airflow in such a way that more air is lead over the car the intercooler runs 0.5 bar more pressure which in it's turn gives remarkable higher HP figures which in it's turn can overcome the airodynamic "overweight" caused by the ground effects and leave some xtra to gain a few 1/1000 of a second.<BR>I also removed the MS-Design logo which gains 0.003 HP.<BR>The MS-Design grill is 1/3 the weight of the original grill and allow more air thru the IC also.<BR>Before the spoiler my top speed was ~165 MPH and after it was ~165.5 MPH!<BR>This was due to les tire profile which caused the tacho to run higher.<BR>T5's can do 6000 RPM in 5th and are limited in the CEM module instead of the 220 KMH(~137 MPH) limiter which is in software in the ECU and which can be removed. (4th AND 5th gear limitation!!!)<P><BR>
 

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Gotballs:<BR><B>Hey turbo brick, i was wondering how much they were charging you to paint your spoiler...</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>The red I used is Honda R-81, which happens to be a tri-coat, very expesive and time consuming because the wing took a lot of paint, since the wing has to painted 8 times.<BR>Primer, 3Layers of deep red, 3layers, of a transparent candy red, and a clear.<P>The paint store I went to to get the materials from quoted me $180 of materials. I guy that is a professional painter happend to be there picking up paint at the same time so I asked him how much he would paint it for. Since he had enought paint left over from another car in the same color he gave it to me for $100.<P>He told me that for a tricoat paint at any local body shop would be $200+ for the wing that size.<P>
 

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Gotballs:<BR><B>Hey turbo brick...</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <IMG SRC="http://www.swedespeed.com/ubb/confused.gif"> I guess you weren't talking to me. I should read the entire thing before I respond.<BR><P>
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Ha lews auto body quoted me over 1000 bucks to paint it, and they were rude at that... I am getting it done mostliky for $350 by a private contactor. Does primer, 3 coates of paint, and 2 coats of gloss sound good????<BR>+ He comes to my house and does it. Any imput would be apreciated. <BR> <BR>Thanks
 

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WOW... 1000!?!?! <IMG SRC="http://www.swedespeed.com/ubb/eek.gif"> I think that they have no clue of what it looks like. Who did you talk to the girl in the front or the guy that actually does it in the back. I think his name is Jim... I think that paint is like 200 of that because he said that he was not going to charge me much for paint because they had some left over from another job they did. The 70 the quoted me was just over the phone, my wing was chipped when I recieved it so IPD is sending me out another one...<P>The are a bunch of other ones in South OC. There are like 4 or 5 on Via Fabracante in Mission Viejo if you know where that is. <P>
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Just an update, i got it painted today and should mount it sometime next week.. hopefully, I just need to find time to rack and install that duel exhaust on my car. But so far it looks great......<BR>~SPENCER~
 

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Gotballs:<BR><B>Just an update, i got it painted today and should mount it sometime next week.. hopefully, I just need to find time to rack and install that duel exhaust on my car. But so far it looks great......<BR>~SPENCER~</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Spencer you got us all in suspense here! So did you have the private contractor do the job? Also did you have the all the molding sanded and painted as well?<P>Christopher <BR>Volvo Plus Tuning
 
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