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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My car is running again so its time to address the boost issues I was having previously when trying to data log for my stage 3 Hilton tune.
basically when he gave me the progressive wastegate tuning maps we saw no difference in the different flashes. they all ran like the baseline map that basically deactivates the tcv and allows the wastegate to control boost. Since then he has had the same issues with other customers and has told them all to ditch the Forge actuator and go back to stock, I could put my old unit back on but I would rather understand the problem and make use of what looks like a quality, serviceable part.

I spoke to Connor at Viva and was surprised to find that he hadn't heard of any issues, this was unexpected given Hilton's popularity, they sell his tunes as well!

It seems to me that I should be able to make the unit work with the correct spring pressure. I'm planning to order the spring kit and also to compare the stock spring tension to the spring currently installed in the Forge.

I would love some feedback from any of you who are running the Forge actuator successfully. I am ready to get this tune working!
 

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My car acted all kinds of crazy on hiltons tune with the forge wastegate. I think the issue is how sensitive it's spring is. Once oem unit was back on all is well.

From my electronic gismo- Galaxy S6
 

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That would be my guess as well, spring rate, assuming you have the opening pressure set correctly. A different spring rate is going to effect how the turbo and tune responds to the baseline and TCV adjustments. Therefore if the tune is made for the stock actuator its best to go back to one. The stock units appear to last forever, so once again no need to mess with some aftermarket unit that throws off what your tuner is programming the system for, response wise.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
My car acted all kinds of crazy on hiltons tune with the forge wastegate. I think the issue is how sensitive it's spring is. Once oem unit was back on all is well.

From my electronic gismo- Galaxy S6
Which spring were you running in the Forge?
 

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Went through exactly what you are describing.
When originally doing my stage 3 tune with Hilton I had the Forge waste gate on, had the crack pressure set to 7lbs, but could not build any boost greater than 10psi.
Hilton suggested that it might be the wastegate, so I swapped it out and put the stock one back on and all of a sudden I had a 21psi monster wagon :)

To dive into the cause - I've reached out to Viva and Forge and explained that despite having the appropriate adjustability to get the proper crack pressure, the spring rate itself is too weak which causes the wastegate actuator to move 'prematurely' preventing full boost development.

I'm in the process of taking measurements for Connor so that he can convey this information to Forge to get a fix (proper stiffness spring).
 

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Yes what you described is exactly what mine did, no more than 10 psi when set correctly. Even pulling on the rod the spring feels much weaker.

From my electronic gismo- Galaxy S6
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
That would be my guess as well, spring rate, assuming you have the opening pressure set correctly. A different spring rate is going to effect how the turbo and tune responds to the baseline and TCV adjustments. Therefore if the tune is made for the stock actuator its best to go back to one. The stock units appear to last forever, so once again no need to mess with some aftermarket unit that throws off what your tuner is programming the system for, response wise.
I'm glad to hear that the stock units are durable, I was having a hard time convincing myself to put a well used part back on the engine. There is a good chance I will go this route but part of me wants to understand the issue, if spring weight could be matched it should work. I guess most of the people using them are just running a stock configuration.

Does anyone know how to source a stock actuator? Volvo only sells it as part of the turbo assembly.
 

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Only way to get one would be used off a part out or something like that. Only way to get one new/ from volvo is to get an entire turbo.

From my electronic gismo- Galaxy S6
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 · (Edited)
Went through exactly what you are describing.
When originally doing my stage 3 tune with Hilton I had the Forge waste gate on, had the crack pressure set to 7lbs, but could not build any boost greater than 10psi.
Hilton suggested that it might be the wastegate, so I swapped it out and put the stock one back on and all of a sudden I had a 21psi monster wagon :)

To dive into the cause - I've reached out to Viva and Forge and explained that despite having the appropriate adjustability to get the proper crack pressure, the spring rate itself is too weak which causes the wastegate actuator to move 'prematurely' preventing full boost development.

I'm in the process of taking measurements for Connor so that he can convey this information to Forge to get a fix (proper stiffness spring).
Awesome, I was just about to go down this road myself, I'm actually waiting for a callback from Forge. Looking forward to your findings.

I wonder why Connor claimed to have heard of no issues with them...

Forge lists their heaviest (red) spring for these at 20psi max, I was thinking of shimming it but ill wait to hear what you find. I will probably put my stock unit on to complete the tune for now, if it can be made to function the same it shouldn't be a problem to swap it post final tune.
 

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Here is a thought, if the diaphragm diameter between the aftermarket and stock are the same, cut the stock one apart and use its spring. That way you get a new aftermarket actuator with the correct spring, killing two birds with one stone.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Here is a thought, if the diaphragm diameter between the aftermarket and stock are the same, cut the stock one apart and use its spring. That way you get a new aftermarket actuator with the correct spring, killing two birds with one stone.
I though about it but I would like to find a spare before I destroy mine with no guarantee of success. Hopefully we will find a replacement spring before it comes to that.
 

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I have the solid grey spring which is supposed to be the strongest they make that Connor sent me. I have installed in the wastegate whatever color it comes with. I have never tried the stronger one.

From my electronic gismo- Galaxy S6
 

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Awesome, I was just about to go down this road myself, I'm actually waiting for a callback from Forge. Looking forward to your findings.

I wonder why Connor claimed to have heard of no issues with them...

Forge lists their heaviest (red) spring for these at 20psi max, I was thinking of shimming it but ill wait to hear what you find. I will probably put my stock unit on to complete the tune for now, if it can be made to function the same it shouldn't be a problem to swap it post final tune.
I don't think shimming would be the right choice - its the stiffness that's off, not the strength. If you shim it sufficiently to build full boost, then you'll likely fall out of the range of being able to set crack pressure at 7psi.
For a short term fix, I'd follow Stlealthy's advice and see if the stock spring fits.

I'll be sure to post here on the findings.

I was also surprised to hear from Connor that no one else had any issues... the way I see it, the same issues would occur on a stock tune.
 

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When I got mine I saw that it had been used already, bolt holes were scratched etc. Had me skeptical. Viva had to of heard of issues.

From my electronic gismo- Galaxy S6
 

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If you were getting a custom tune done with lots of roller time a good tuner would have time to tweak the control algorithm to handle just about any type of control circuit. Problem is that tuners like hilton and MTE sell affordable tunes they prefer to tweak instead of having to spend lots of time working on the particular nuance of every aftermarket option available you can slap on there.

Tis the reason that if a particular factory component is good enough in your system, don't mess with it unless you have lots of extra $$$ hanging around for a custom tune for your exact setup.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Well I heard back from Sean at Forge, he was very responsive and helpful. He said that the green spring will not boost over 10 psi if adjusted correctly, he seemed pretty confident that using the yellow would allow boost into the low 20s with no problem. He offered me a free spring kit to help resolve the issue, Ill try new springs and see how it goes. This will set the data logging back a few days but I want to try the obvious approach before I remove the Forge, worst case I waste a few days and just have to slap the stock unit back on.
 

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Well I heard back from Sean at Forge, he was very responsive and helpful. He said that the green spring will not boost over 10 psi if adjusted correctly, he seemed pretty confident that using the yellow would allow boost into the low 20s with no problem. He offered me a free spring kit to help resolve the issue, Ill try new springs and see how it goes. This will set the data logging back a few days but I want to try the obvious approach before I remove the Forge, worst case I waste a few days and just have to slap the stock unit back on.
Definitely watching this. I have an appointment for Wednesday for a stage 1 or 2 for my VR. I have the standard spring in mine but the others are on standby. Not having happy thoughts of trying to dig that damn thing back out to replace a spring and hope for it to work. Looks like ill take em with me when I decide to do the tune. Prob gunna postpone it...
 

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Subscribing to this, as have a Forge that is awaiting install...
 

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My stage 2 works with zero problems with my forge wastegate. I'm set to 6 psi.
 
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