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Discussion Starter #1
I read an article yesterday that outlines 'abuses' of campaign contributions.<br>Apparently, the rules aren't very stringent. <br>I'm not singling out Rep Ford, but the article mentioned this website which will give you an insight into how <A HREF="http://www.fancyford.com" TARGET="_blank"> funds</A> can be spent.<p>Members of both parties do this. Sickening
 

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Re: Abuse of campaign contributions (bpwrightwv)

ahhh, yes<p>Your article you are supposed to have read was not sourced.... instead you source a paid smear campaign paid for by the opposition.<p>You're not singling out Rep. Ford.... (as if.....)<p>And you just toss out, ......the old 'both parties do this' argument, ....designed and implemented to discount the current overwhelming evidence that, by any real world measure, the current Republican Party official strategy is to illegally abuse and ignore campaign finance regulations.<p>Look up current idictments.... see Ford's name?<p>The Republican majority has blocked every effort at campaign finance clean up....<p>The Republican majority has gutted the ethics committees...<p>Here' s what you need to know from the link you posted....<p>'Paid for by the National Republican Senatorial Committee...........'.<p>Shall we tabulate the evidence and see who is primarily driving the current culture of corruption?<p>Let's highlight some indictments, ..... <p>Do you have anything besides sensationalism, insinuation, and rumor?<p>Any proof at all the campaign finances are abused illegally by Rep. Ford?<p>Somehow, I doubt it.... you're just carrying water.... Republican dirty water.<p>Swiftboating is, as evident here, ....something you admire.....<p>Disgusting.... <p><br>
 

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Re: Abuse of campaign contributions (bpwrightwv)

Sickening indeed. SERIOUS reform is needed now, especially after the Abrahamoff scandal. Unfortunately the Congress is in the firm hands of the Republicans now, and the new Majority Leader, John Boehner, clearly does not support the kind of meaningful reforms that would stop this kind of abuse.
 

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Re: Abuse of campaign contributions (Brahms)

Boehner was the guy who twisted votes by blatently passing out tobacco lobby checks for votes on the floor during a voting session... <p>Why anyone ever bought his claim to want to clean up ethics is unbelieveable.
 

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Re: Abuse of campaign contributions (oxobeppo)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>oxobeppo</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">ahhh, yes<p>Your article you are supposed to have read was not sourced.... instead you source a paid smear campaign paid for by the opposition.<br></TD></TR></TABLE><br>do you see conspiracies, everywhere? <p><br><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">And you just toss out, ......the old 'both parties do this' argument, ....designed and implemented to discount the current overwhelming evidence that, by any real world measure, the current Republican Party official strategy is to illegally abuse and ignore campaign finance regulations.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>i wasn't talking about ILLEGAL uses, I'm talking about legal, but sickening, uses of campaign funds. you of all people, who lectures us constantly about 'subjectivity' and 'reference points' should try to take your filter off and see things for what they are. <p><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>Here' s what you need to know from the link you posted....<p>'Paid for by the National Republican Senatorial Committee...........'.<br></TD></TR></TABLE><br>I included it only as an example of abuses of the system, and b/c I could remember the name of the website. I stated as much. I happen to like Rep Ford, until I read <A HREF="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/03/18/AR2006031800951.html?sub=AR" TARGET="_blank">this article </A> <br><b>SOURCED JUST FOR YOU </B><br>I read it in the Pittsburgh Post Gazette, yesterday's Sunday edition, article from The Washington Post.<p><br><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>Any proof at all the campaign finances are abused illegally by Rep. Ford?<br></TD></TR></TABLE><br> I never said they were illegal. But they are not false accusations. They are documented. Why don't you address the topic???<p><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br>Disgusting.... </TD></TR></TABLE><br>what's disgusting is how you take everying out of context and put it in your context of you v Bush. Or there's some conspiracy here, to swiftboat. Jesus, at least I can admit I am a Repubican. Further, I'm not happy with Bush policies and not pleased with the spending of both parties. If anyone is a cheerleader, here, it's you. <p><br>Now, do you care to address the topic?<p><i> Bachus hasn't drawn a serious opponent in the past three elections. So far, his only 2006 challenger is a write-in with $49 in the bank.<p>But the Alabama Republican burns through significant sums of campaign cash, as do plenty of other House members sitting in safe congressional seats. Among the items billed in 2005 to Bachus's campaign account and his "Growth and Prosperity" political action committee: $6,689 for U2 concert tickets and expenses as part of a campaign event; $1,298 in lodging in Vail, Colo.; and $270 for the catering of an "American Idol" party</i><p>HAPPY, HE'S A REPUBLICAN<br>HERE'S A DEMOCRAT<br><I>Rep. Corrine Brown (D-Fla.) spent $15,835 of campaign funds on condolence flowers for his consitituents</I><br><BR><BR>
<i>Modified by bpwrightwv at 9:09 PM 3-20-2006</i>
 

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Re: Abuse of campaign contributions (bpwrightwv)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>bpwrightwv</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> Among the items billed in 2005 to Bachus's campaign account and his "Growth and Prosperity" political action committee: $6,689 for U2 concert tickets and expenses as part of a campaign event; $1,298 in lodging in Vail, Colo.; and $270 for the catering of an "American Idol" party</i><p>HAPPY, HE'S A REPUBLICAN<br>HERE'S A DEMOCRAT<br><I>Rep. Corrine Brown (D-Fla.) spent $15,835 of campaign funds on condolence flowers for his consitituents</I><p><i>Modified by bpwrightwv at 9:09 PM 3-20-2006</i></TD></TR></TABLE><p><br>I could care less about those kinds of expenditures. Let's focus on REAL abuse instead of penny-ante bullcrap.<br>
 

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Re: Abuse of campaign contributions (bpwrightwv)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>bpwrightwv</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br>.....do you see conspiracies, everywhere? </TD></TR></TABLE><p>I thought I clearly and concisely stated what I saw....<p>Now, after I question your mischaracterization and insinuation, you can 'suggest' that when you say abuse of campaign funds that you didn't mean abuse of campaign funds.... and you might get someone to believe you....<p>That isn't going to be me....<p>You might not agree with all the allowable expenditures, but to characterize following the rules as abuse, and then say you don't mean abuse is an obtuse argument.<p><br><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>bpwrightwv</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i wasn't talking about ILLEGAL uses, I'm talking about legal, but sickening, uses of campaign funds. you of all people, who lectures us constantly about 'subjectivity' and 'reference points' should try to take your filter off and see things for what they are. </TD></TR></TABLE><p>You infer I wear a filter..... the only filter I wear is a bullcrap filter...... I said I saw things for what they were... unfiltered what I saw was factually unsupported insinuations of abuse of campaign spending.... Paid for by the Republican party and presented 'unfiltered' by you here.<p>The Republican website you provided for your 'documentation' did not reference any legal reporting evidence, such as financial disclosure forms or anything at all, besides themselves making falsely characterized insinuations based wholly on 'claims' that they offered no evidence to support....<p><br><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>bpwrightwv</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I included it only as an example of abuses of the system, and b/c I could remember the name of the website. I stated as much. </TD></TR></TABLE><p>Legal expenditures are not abuse.... to label them as abuse is incorrect. Like the law or not, you're not at liberty to mischaracterize it. (and neither should the Republican Party)<p><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>bpwrightwv</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I happen to like Rep Ford, until I read <A HREF="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/03/18/AR2006031800951.html?sub=AR" TARGET="_blank">this article </A> <br><b>SOURCED JUST FOR YOU </B><br>I read it in the Pittsburgh Post Gazette, yesterday's Sunday edition, article from The Washington Post. </TD></TR></TABLE><p>Thanks anyway but I read it in the Post when it was released to the web on Sat. night. Wasn't terribly impressed at the time, ....what with the other more pressing issues the time and space should have been used to report on.<p> <TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>bpwrightwv</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I never said they were illegal. But they are not false accusations. They are documented. Why don't you address the topic??? </TD></TR></TABLE><p>The Republican Party is a trustworthy source for documentation? Just because the Republican Party conceives a smear campaign of insinuation and mischaracterization, that means anyone should automatically think that any part of what they print is fact or presented in it's proper perspective?<p>(...you think to remind me, or upbraid me, for not exercising objectivity?) Incredible....<p><br><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>bpwrightwv</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">what's disgusting is how you take everying out of context and put it in your context of you v Bush.</TD></TR></TABLE> <p>Funny, I didn't mention Bush.... I was speaking to your actions..... .....( you have a problem seperating yourself from attacks on Bush? ....that must make for some sleepless nights.. eh? .....Who's seeing conspiracies now?)<p><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>bpwrightwv</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Or there's some conspiracy here, to swiftboat. </TD></TR></TABLE><p>....oh ho, as if the Republican Party has no history by which to judge.... I think the analogy is perfectly apt.... insinuate that legal action is abuse, infer that up is down... yep, that pretty much describes Swiftboating.... you didn't have to comply and be complicit in their deceit, you could have presented a frame of reference which put the story in it's proper perspective... you didn't do that, you chose to, 'unknowingly or not' repeat the insinuations....<p><br><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>bpwrightwv</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Jesus, at least I can admit I am a Repubican. </TD></TR></TABLE><p>Good for you, I could care less.... ....and from what I hear, Jesus won't care either, ...as long as you repent....<p><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>bpwrightwv</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Further, I'm not happy with Bush policies and not pleased with the spending of both parties. </TD></TR></TABLE><p>Shout it from the rooftops, it could act as a cathartic experience for you, .... and when you do, I'll give you an amen to that....<p><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>bpwrightwv</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> If anyone is a cheerleader, here, it's you. </TD></TR></TABLE><p>I'm a big fan of correct characterization, proper use of terminology, and support the law, if that makes me a cheerleader, I'm happy with the label you wish to impose....<p>I don't have to agree with any one law, but I won't attempt to demonize those who follow the law.... I won't mischaracterize their actions, .....but I might address the lack of probity in the law itself.<p><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>bpwrightwv</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Now, do you care to address the topic? </TD></TR></TABLE><p>The topic was mischaracterized.... I addressed that.<p>It's like another thread you started not too long back.... are you asking if I want to discuss overhauling legal campaign spending?<p>The answer to that is yes, .... though I think illegal activities should probably be given preference.<p>After all, if people give money to politicians, they should expect politicians to spend it, and spend it all. <p>If one is to give money to a politician, one should be aware of what they are allowed to do with that money. As long as they don't spend it illegally, .... it's pretty futile to complain just because you thought they maybe should do something else with it.<p>When the whole system is designed and regulated by law, it's downright shameful to single out any one or a few people who are following the law, and infer that their acts should be held up as representing abuse when they are not abusing anything.<p>You can survey your kingdom from your EZBoy and assume that anyone questioning your posts or the accuracy of your posts is directly attacking you in some personal way and you can respond with all the sputter you can muster...... but,<p>It ain't about you.... the initial premise of the post was not factually correct. <p>I merely continue to point that out.... no one should be discussing incorrectly presented inferences if we are to be able to make sense of what it is we're to discuss...<p><br><i>Modified by oxobeppo at 12:19 AM 3-21-2006</i><BR><BR>
<i>Modified by oxobeppo at 12:23 AM 3-21-2006</i>
 

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Discussion Starter #8
If you read the article, then you knew the source and were being obtuse in questioning it...<br>I stand by the accuracy of the post and the facts presented in it, culled from the finance reports of the members of Congress<br>I find it odd your not bothered by the use of campaign funds to buy concert tickets, pedicures, suits, cigars, etc<br>B/c it's legal, doesn't make it right, foxes watching the hen house comes to mind....If those whoe donate are trying to buy influence, well I guess it's OK to spend it on anytying you want. If you're just a normal person, thinking your donation is going to be used directly for campaigning, meals, mileage, travel, chotskies, well I'll bet they'd be shocked to know it's used for suits and cigars.<p><BR><BR>
<i>Modified by bpwrightwv at 10:26 AM 3-21-2006</i>
 

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Re: (bpwrightwv)

if someone is pissed off about suits and cigars, then they are idiots<p>there are billion-dollar issues to worry about - worrying about suits and cigars is for fools<p>The GOP is spending GAZILLIONS of your dollars, and you are worried about a congressman going to a concert<p>unFing believeable
 

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Re: (adp)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>adp</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">if someone is pissed off about suits and cigars, then they are idiots<p>there are billion-dollar issues to worry about - worrying about suits and cigars is for fools<p>The GOP is spending GAZILLIONS of your dollars, and you are worried about a congressman going to a concert<p>unFing believeable</TD></TR></TABLE><p>we've discussed those billion dollar issues, ad nauseum. Haven't we?<br>you're unfing believable.<br>
 

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Re: (bpwrightwv)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>bpwrightwv</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>we've discussed those billion dollar issues, ad nauseum. Haven't we?<p></TD></TR></TABLE><p>it's only "ad nauseum" if one of us throws up<p><IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/smile.gif" BORDER="0"><p>when I said "you" are unbelievable I did mean EVERYONE who is concerned about penny ante stuff and not the big and illegal stuff. I didn't mean only you, bp. I understand the outrage, but I only have so much outrage to go around. And I don't have enough so to sweat the small stuff.
 

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Re: (bpwrightwv)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>bpwrightwv</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">If you read the article, then you knew the source and were being obtuse in questioning it...<br>I stand by the accuracy of the post and the facts presented in it, culled from the finance reports of the members of Congress<br>I find it odd your not bothered by the use of campaign funds to buy concert tickets, pedicures, suits, cigars, etc<br>B/c it's legal, doesn't make it right, foxes watching the hen house comes to mind....If those whoe donate are trying to buy influence, well I guess it's OK to spend it on anytying you want. If you're just a normal person, thinking your donation is going to be used directly for campaigning, meals, mileage, travel, chotskies, well I'll bet they'd be shocked to know it's used for suits and cigars.<p><br><i>Modified by bpwrightwv at 10:26 AM 3-21-2006</i></TD></TR></TABLE><p>I stated that you didn't source the 'article' you claimed to have read.... remember? You're supposed impetus for starting to 'think' on this subject was an article you didn't source. What you did source was not an article but a paid mischaracterization by the Republican party.<p>Please show me where in the Republican paid site you listed does it quote or reference any source of facts culled from actual financial reports..... (you must have powers of observation that 'allow' you to see what's, I'm quite certain was not offered on that site.) Or do you still maintain that because the Republican party stated something on a web site that it must be based on fact based solely on their inference. Show the links offered on that site which make the so-called facts uncontestable, show the financial report confirmations referenced and linked to the inference on that site. That site just says thus and so, and you infer that it's true and cannot be questioned. I see no evidence other than their claim.<p>Notice, I'm not referencing any later or subsequent links you put up, but the original mischaracterization from the paid Republican party source.... that is 'your' argument, isn't it? (..or has that too changed?)<p>It seems you read to obtain what you want to think you will find... you obviously didn't comprehend when I clearly stated that just because I disagree with the law doesn't mean I will mischaracterize it.<p>Else you wouldn't still be questioning the fact that I agreed that legal campaign financing rules should be overhauled.<p><br>Work through a few things before you post, read the responses before drawing conclusions and continueing to make accusations which are based only in your imagination, ... it will save a lot of back and forth about somethings already covered....... and when you do post, take a minute to make sure you characterize the point you wish to make correctly so as not to insinuate something that is not factually correct.<p>Now, is it legal financial spending rules you wish to discuss? <p>Or so you still insist that people who follow the law are abusing something other than your own sensibilities..... because people who follow the law are not abusing the law.<br><BR><BR>
<i>Modified by oxobeppo at 12:00 PM 3-21-2006</i>
 
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