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Absolutely agree with everything you've said there. What I was saying was more like it's fun to watch it go up/down. For the same reason I search up the For Sale ads to begin with, it's just fun for me. Whether the cars will ever become actual sought after, collector's items is sort of a big question mark. But, that's not why I own one. I wanted one. I bought one. And I'm enjoying driving it every day. (Well I was enjoying driving before Stay At Home orders, LOL!)

When a Porsche owners manual goes for the same price as an entire P80R, it says something about the world of collecting. :D
Don't even get me started on Porsches... And yes, it is always interesting to see where the market is. I buy a car and intend to keep it for a while, and then inevitably end up selling it. Therefore, I am always trying to make sure I have a clean exit strategy should the opportunity arise.
 

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That website is a goldmine! They have sold 6 P80 V70Rs already excluding the silver one, and 3 of them had 17 inch Sats... 3 of them were also Laser Blues and all 7 cars are Japanese imports with well under 100k miles, so they have power folding mirrors. You can see them all of 'em if you look through their website. It really sucks how literally everyone outside the US got the bigger and better wheels lol.

But yeah I hope that our cars' values continue to rise... I've seen multiple nice examples sell for 8-12k in the US alone. If you include 850 P80Rs, I've heard of them going for up to 20k or so. I will hold onto my car for a long time, especially if I go through with a proper manual swap... at that point probably a decade. It would awesome to even get 10k out it when I sell eventually, but until then, let's just enjoy our rare and cool rides! :beer:
I'm not sure if the US market is that much lower than RoW or if it's just that that all of our cars are trashed and not worth anything. Look at the average condition of Rs here vs Rs in Europe and it's no wonder our garbage isn't worth anything. That said, there are a lot more people looking for these cars in Europe than America, so I'm still not sure I'd bother marketing my cars in America if I was to ever sell any of them.

We get small wheels because our roads suck. There was a lawsuit over this and that's how all the P80 Rs got a no cost 16" option.
 

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That website is a goldmine! They have sold 6 P80 V70Rs already excluding the silver one, and 3 of them had 17 inch Sats... 3 of them were also Laser Blues and all 7 cars are Japanese imports with well under 100k miles, so they have power folding mirrors. You can see them all of 'em if you look through their website. It really sucks how literally everyone outside the US got the bigger and better wheels lol.

But yeah I hope that our cars' values continue to rise... I've seen multiple nice examples sell for 8-12k in the US alone. If you include 850 P80Rs, I've heard of them going for up to 20k or so. I will hold onto my car for a long time, especially if I go through with a proper manual swap... at that point probably a decade. It would awesome to even get 10k out it when I sell eventually, but until then, let's just enjoy our rare and cool rides! :beer:
There are many reasons why the wheels here are smaller and we got only AWD cars.

P80 VR’s fetch really good money if they are super clean, like 2-3 steps above the rest, or they are a rare color like Laser, Saffron, Signal, or Venetian. That’s mostly because the vast majority of the ones seen here are silver and black. If you look at the condition of the ones for sale over the pond, they are much better than 99% of what you see here, and the range of colors is much wider. You see gray, coral, nautic blue, etc.

As far as manual swap goes, are you thinking M58 or M66?
 

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I'm not sure if the US market is that much lower than RoW or if it's just that that all of our cars are trashed and not worth anything. Look at the average condition of Rs here vs Rs in Europe and it's no wonder our garbage isn't worth anything. That said, there are a lot more people looking for these cars in Europe than America, so I'm still not sure I'd bother marketing my cars in America if I was to ever sell any of them.

We get small wheels because our roads suck. There was a lawsuit over this and that's how all the P80 Rs got a no cost 16" option.
I agree, the level of the cars there is significantly above anything you see here.

Did any US P80 V70R’s get 17” rims? I thought they were all 16”. Like Sats, Solars, Meteors, etc.. I only know of the Volans and Titans as 17”, and those were on 850’s.

Almost comical that back then people opted for those smaller rims, when today most cars come 18, 19, 20+ for rim size.
 

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I agree, the level of the cars there is significantly above anything you see here.

Did any US P80 V70R’s get 17” rims? I thought they were all 16”. Like Sats, Solars, Meteors, etc.. I only know of the Volans and Titans as 17”, and those were on 850’s.

Almost comical that back then people opted for those smaller rims, when today most cars come 18, 19, 20+ for rim size.
When I was in the Netherlands I was just shocked at how mint everything is. Like a car in average condition at one of their meets would be in the top 90% at Carlisle. Cars in condition below the average at Carlisle did not make up a statistically significant portion of attendees. My cars would be average there, at best. And I'm seeing T-5Rs and OREs and T5Ms just parked on the street. It was wild.

I believe you could option 17" Sats, and I've seen a couple sets that didn't make sense for them to have gotten here any other way. Comets are obviously the 17" equivalent of Meteor but there is no 17" Solar. I'm not entirely sure what wheels came on MY99 Rs RoW but I've seen Sats on Rs first reg'd as early as 3/99. Never seen Solars outside of US/CDN so I suspect everyone else went straight from Comets to Sats, just not sure when the changeover was or if it depended on market/etc. I have, however, seen 16" Sats and Meteors in other markets.
 

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I'm not sure if the US market is that much lower than RoW or if it's just that that all of our cars are trashed and not worth anything. Look at the average condition of Rs here vs Rs in Europe and it's no wonder our garbage isn't worth anything. That said, there are a lot more people looking for these cars in Europe than America, so I'm still not sure I'd bother marketing my cars in America if I was to ever sell any of them.

We get small wheels because our roads suck. There was a lawsuit over this and that's how all the P80 Rs got a no cost 16" option.
Yeah, unfortunately most P80Rs are in rough shape here... but there's so many awesome examples in Europe. I believe it's because many Americans either treat them rough or use em to the grave without the proper maintenance. I'm convinced that P80s got a worse rep than redblocks just because they need that bit more maintenance for that big gain in technology, power, and efficiency... something that many Americans don't understand. Volvos don't use tractor engines with 4 moving parts anymore lol, but keep 'em in check and they'll still last a very long time before they need any sort of rebuild.

As for the smaller wheels, I had no idea there was a lawsuit about it! I always figured they just knew our roads sucked haha. Makes sense though, since we got Titans here in '95 and Volans from '96-'97 before they got rid of the 17s.
 

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There are many reasons why the wheels here are smaller and we got only AWD cars.

P80 VR’s fetch really good money if they are super clean, like 2-3 steps above the rest, or they are a rare color like Laser, Saffron, Signal, or Venetian. That’s mostly because the vast majority of the ones seen here are silver and black. If you look at the condition of the ones for sale over the pond, they are much better than 99% of what you see here, and the range of colors is much wider. You see gray, coral, nautic blue, etc.

As far as manual swap goes, are you thinking M58 or M66?
What I would do for a Cassis P80 VR... purple wagons are awesome and Europe got 'em of course. Just learned the other day that the T-5R's original crazy color was supposed to be purple too, before it turned into yellow. The prototype still exists too! You can find it here:

http://www.volvo850t-5r.com/purple-in-elmia/

And regarding the manual swap... I'd love to do M58 since it drops right in, but they're really hard to obtain from what I can understand these days. If I cant find a nice one, I will go for a M66. Either way, the AWD will remain intact! I am never going back to the FWD open-diff life if I can help it lol.
 

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What I would do for a Cassis P80 VR... purple wagons are awesome and Europe got 'em of course. Just learned the other day that the T-5R's original crazy color was supposed to be purple too, before it turned into yellow. The prototype still exists too! You can find it here:

http://www.volvo850t-5r.com/purple-in-elmia/

And regarding the manual swap... I'd love to do M58 since it drops right in, but they're really hard to obtain from what I can understand these days. If I cant find a nice one, I will go for a M66. Either way, the AWD will remain intact! I am never going back to the FWD open-diff life if I can help it lol.
FWD with a LSD gives you as many driven wheels as AWD.....................................................................................

I met the guy who runs that T-5R website when I was in Europe a couple years ago. The guy who owns the purple T-5R owns most of the prototype T-5Rs that are accounted for.

Most of the Cassis V70Rs went to the UK. For some reason, the colors that were extremely unpopular on mainland Europe (white and turquoise for 850R, Cassis for V70R) were quite common in the UK. On that same trip, I also met a guy who has a Cassis V70R, among many other cool things. He told me he knew of only 2 or 3 originally delivered to mainland Europe. His is actually a US market car.


I don't think it's possible to take a picture that makes a CY estate look more boring...

 

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I met the guy who runs that T-5R website when I was in Europe a couple years ago. The guy who owns the purple T-5R owns most of the prototype T-5Rs that are accounted for.

Most of the Cassis V70Rs went to the UK. For some reason, the colors that were extremely unpopular on mainland Europe (white and turquoise for 850R, Cassis for V70R) were quite common in the UK. On that same trip, I also met a guy who has a Cassis V70R, among many other cool things. He told me he knew of only 2 or 3 originally delivered to mainland Europe. His is actually a US market car.


I don't think it's possible to take a picture that makes a CY estate look more boring...

Nice! Yeah it's awesome to know that those rare prototypes still exist and are being preserved.

That Cassis R is lovely, it's got that perfect combo with the 17" anthracite satellites... same deal for that light blue wagon behind it. Speaking of, is that an R? I see it has the R bumper and comets, but I've never seen one in that color anywhere.
 

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Nice! Yeah it's awesome to know that those rare prototypes still exist and are being preserved.

That Cassis R is lovely, it's got that perfect combo with the 17" anthracite satellites... same deal for that light blue wagon behind it. Speaking of, is that an R? I see it has the R bumper and comets, but I've never seen one in that color anywhere.
Yeah that's the Aqua V70R. M59 and FWD!! 4 were built and a friend of a Volvo exec wanted one so this one was sold to him/her rather than being crushed. Absolutely bizarre car. Now owned by the same guy as the Cassis R.
 

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Yeah that's the Aqua V70R. M59 and FWD!! 4 were built and a friend of a Volvo exec wanted one so this one was sold to him/her rather than being crushed. Absolutely bizarre car. Now owned by the same guy as the Cassis R.
Oh wow, that's awesome! Just another example of the rarities that Europe got. Really like the color, though I sorta prefer laser blue a bit more haha.
 

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Oh wow, that's awesome! Just another example of the rarities that Europe got. Really like the color, though I sorta prefer laser blue a bit more haha.
I wouldn't really say Europe "got" it....you couldn't order an Aqua V70R in Europe. It's a prototype that managed to escape into the wild.
 

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Just about 5 months since I was able to update the thread! Figured I would throw a little update out there into the Swedespeed-verse. It's was one hell of a summer and I managed to thin the herd by one car, so now I am strictly Volvo for the first time in 10 years. Meanwhile the wife is still driving the Acura (for now).

Timeline of events...

June:
Finally got the car registered AND inspected
Purchased tires, mounted them on bargain find Volans, threw them on the car for the summer
Replaced battery hoping to alleviate the need to jump the car after a few days of sitting - issue remains
Put driver window down on the highway, headliner detached itself, foam nearly blinded me
Driver window switch died with window down after said highway outing - managed to source and replace switch to get the window up
Discovered passenger window switch only works one way (up) - issue remains

July:
CEL for P0014 persists - beginning to think this is adding/causing to the difficulty starting issue
Trans started hiccupping here and there - dropped out of gear once, and shift flares are near constant :angryfire:
Celebrated 1 year after purchase

August:
Vehicle sat mostly unused
Noticed it's leaking fluid, likely oil, remains undiagnosed

September:
Attempted to start the vehicle and move it out of my neighbors driveway - will not start (I have 2 spaces and 3 cars, something had to give so the R got moved)
Finally got the thing started and it sputters, CEL and now ETS light are lit up :facepalm:

Current:
Adding all that up, the car either needs a valve body or new/rebuilt trans, a new ETM(?), and diagnosis on P0014 code and Oil Leak (amongst many other ongoing issues). Tried to get over to Rolling Motors for the last few months, but they're stupid busy rebuilding 1/2 the Volvo's on the east coast, so that never happened. Unfortunately I am working non-stop, selling a house, building a new house, and there is just no time or money to go into this car. At this point, it's quite the headache, I am fed up with it, so it will sit until further notice or until I throw in the towel and move on. Wish I had better news, but chalk it up to the 2020 sh*t show.
 

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Went and got the headliner and sunroof replaced today. Drove all the way home with the sunroof open, which is something I have not been able to do since I purchased the car.

No ETM issues to speak of, hopefully the ETS light stays off for a while. Still working on the P0014 issue.

Trans was good during the drive, but still needs to be sorted out. Spoke to Ben, thought about doing a valve body in the original trans, but thinking otherwise now. No assurance it will work, only other options are to rebuild or replace. I know I will set off a debate with this one but here goes: I am looking into a manual swap for the car as I have always wanted a manual wagon, and I believe I know what my options are:

(1) Find donor M66 trans (from V50, S40) and components to swap in - (6sp vs. 5sp, AWD retained, not designed for use in P80's but works just the same)

(2) Ditch AWD and components (lighten the car), add limited slip diff, and swap in a M56 trans - not preferred (Aware of the advantages here, still not preferred)

(3) Source M58 trans and components to swap in (5sp vs. 6sp, AWD retained, designed to work in P80's as offered OEM)

Looking for constructive discussion of the options, links to helpful forum posts (here or elsewhere in the Volvoverse), and any helpful insights that can be shared. FYI - I am doing my own research on this, and Im sure there will be some duplicative sharing, but I appreciate the community input and associated discussion.
 

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Well one look at my fleet tells you I bought option 2 out of the box.

I'd lean option 3 over option 1 but you'd probably end up having to import a M58. My M66 basically bolted up aside from the shifter and having to modify the rear engine mount slightly but I'm told it's not quite as bolt up for AWD.
 

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Well one look at my fleet tells you I bought option 2 out of the box.

I'd lean option 3 over option 1 but you'd probably end up having to import a M58. My M66 basically bolted up aside from the shifter and having to modify the rear engine mount slightly but I'm told it's not quite as bolt up for AWD.
Im playing Switzerland on the FWD/LSD vs AWD debate...

M58’s on this side of the pond are nearly impossible to come by. I tried to follow some leads on a couple in Canada a few months back but that was a waste of time. I assume I’d have to import.
Cost aside, I’m just trying to weed my way through the M66 vs M58 set up options and pros / cons. Spent hours yesterday reading though threads but most of them just fizzle out and die or read like “should I swap? ... swaps done, rides great”

I did discover there’s 5 or 6 versions of M58 and I talked to ScottishBrick about the differences (thankfully he knew).
 

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Im playing Switzerland on the FWD/LSD vs AWD debate...

M58’s on this side of the pond are nearly impossible to come by. I tried to follow some leads on a couple in Canada a few months back but that was a waste of time. I assume I’d have to import.
Cost aside, I’m just trying to weed my way through the M66 vs M58 set up options and pros / cons. Spent hours yesterday reading though threads but most of them just fizzle out and die or read like “should I swap? ... swaps done, rides great”

I did discover there’s 5 or 6 versions of M58 and I talked to ScottishBrick about the differences (thankfully he knew).
I know of two m58 swaps done right. Its not that hard so im not sure why everyone gets so stuck?
 

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"research is hard"
Bolts up? Same parts as any other USDM manual. Awd stuff is self explanatory when you look at it? Ah oops that’s just me engineering it I guess.
 

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Bolts up? Same parts as any other USDM manual. Awd stuff is self explanatory when you look at it? Ah oops that’s just me engineering it I guess.
Right we've built and shredded so many of these cars we could do it blindfolded.

Doesn't help that there is a lot of misinformation out there that you have to do some digging to debunk if you don't have the experience to know off the top of your head that it's fake news.
 
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