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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I quote Malcom from Jurasic Park, "Yea, but your scientists were so wrapped up in whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they SHOULD!" 4C is a nice idea, but some folks think that with the cost of 4C, the R could have been equipt with an incredible "standard" suspension, effectively making it a better car. But who are these people? I like 4C, but I have never tracked my car, or any other car. I drive aggressively quite often, but never really push the R to its limits. Let's find out who thinks what...<p>Be honest, don't vote if you are not in the given demographic. We might learn something here, as long as vote accurately. The first part of the poll options is how many times you have tracked cars in your life, and the second part is whether you'd keep 4C, or whether you'd trade it for a standard suspension of equal value.
 

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Re: 4C Who loves it, and who hates it! (JOSBRO)

I voted KEEP, but it is not a perfect system by any means. I'm sure if Volvo wanted they could do some more software updates, or offer stiffer springs.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Re: 4C Who loves it, and who hates it! (mister2cool)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>mister2cool</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">there's no choice for <4 times in the R, but >4 in other cars?</TD></TR></TABLE><p>because i think if you've tracked the R <4 times, you have not had a chance to learn all its quirks.
 

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Re: 4C Who loves it, and who hates it! (JOSBRO)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>JOSBRO</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">because i think if you've tracked the R <4 times, you have not had a chance to learn all its quirks.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>In that case, I don't know if I want to track it ever! hahaha
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Re: 4C Who loves it, and who hates it! (mister2cool)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>mister2cool</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>In that case, I don't know if I want to track it ever! hahaha</TD></TR></TABLE><p>good point!
 

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Re: 4C Who loves it, and who hates it! (JOSBRO)

A question for those that do take the R onto the track often. Is it better with 4C disabled or in a mode?<p>I notice that "Top Gear" did their track test with it off (?).
 

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Re: 4C Who loves it, and who hates it! (LOTR)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>LOTR</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">A question for those that do take the R onto the track often. Is it better with 4C disabled or in a mode?<p>I notice that "Top Gear" did their track test with it off (?). </TD></TR></TABLE><p>Top Gear did the test with DSTC off, not 4C.
 

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Re: 4C Who loves it, and who hates it! (JOSBRO)

The 4C is a nice feature to have but by no means beats a good fixed suspension. Maybe Volvo should talk to TME about using their springs as part of the stock setup.
 

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I've "tracked" other cars and I am actively involved in racing of other vehicles I own, but never did I expect the V70R to be a track car. The 4C system, in my opinion, does a great job in changing the attitude of the car to suit the need of the urban/suburban driver. It does what it should for what it is in its majority use cases. <p>The 4C system was one of the selling points on the car for me and I'd still pay for it and/or order the option on a future car.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Re: 4C Who loves it, and who hates it! (smolvar)

Seems to me that the noise about 4C sucking was simply the loud minority! What I really want to know, is if a pro driver would keep or trade... any pros?
 

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Re: 4C Who loves it, and who hates it! (JOSBRO)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>JOSBRO</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Seems to me that the noise about 4C sucking was simply the loud minority! What I really want to know, is if a pro driver would keep or trade... any pros?</TD></TR></TABLE><br>I don't know of any racer to a man that would want the suspension changing all the time, not knowing what may happen next. These guys are driving at 10/10ths, that's hard enoughh without worrying what the car MAY do differently each and every corner and lap
 

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Re: 4C Who loves it, and who hates it! (JOSBRO)

Would a properly designed static suspension be better for a track - of course! However no Volvo is a purpose built performance car let alone a race platform. <p>Any pro or aspiring amateur who spends some time pushing a base S60 through some corners will tell you they would keep 4C! It's not perfect but considering the pigs ear Volvo started with it's a good set of enhancements.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Re: 4C Who loves it, and who hates it! (JRL)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>JRL</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br>I don't know of any racer to a man that would want the suspension changing all the time, not knowing what may happen next. These guys are driving at 10/10ths, that's hard enoughh without worrying what the car MAY do differently each and every corner and lap</TD></TR></TABLE><p>I assume you are correct, but I wonder if anyone who has tracked to R enough has found patterns in the 4C effectively making it predictable. It is computer controlled, so I have to think, <B>save any defects </B>in the sensors or the computer itself, that it is very systematic, and reacts the same way to the same driver input. After enough driving, does it become predictable, or is it imperfect enough to simply vary all the time when pushed to its limit?
 

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Re: 4C Who loves it, and who hates it! (JOSBRO)

In my somewhat limited seat time in the R in this setting I did indeed find the system is consistent. It just takes some time to learn what it does and when it does it. More time to figure out how to optimize your trade-offs of course.
 

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Re: 4C Who loves it, and who hates it! (JOSBRO)

I have a 70 degree turn on the way to work. I just love the way i can rip through it with 65mph without one sound from the wheels feeling how the lateral sensor stimulated C4 computer shifts power on the outside wheels and i get literally thrown into it. I just love to look at the occasional passenger from the corner of my right eye and see the sheer terror in their eyes as we enter the turn.... I tell them to get a grip on the OMG handle above the door (Oh my God that is) <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/smile.gif" BORDER="0"><p>After VWR32 and now this one im hooked on Haldex for life.
 

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Re: 4C Who loves it, and who hates it! (JOSBRO)

I have a 70 degree turn on the way to work. I just love the way i can rip through it with 65mph without one sound from the wheels feeling how the lateral sensor stimulated C computer input power on the outside wheels and literally throw me into it. I just love to look at the occasional passenger from the corner of my right eye and see the sheer terror in their eyes as we enter the turn.... I tell them to get a grip on the OMG handle above the door (Oh my God that is) <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/smile.gif" BORDER="0">
 

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Re: 4C Who loves it, and who hates it! (Kandiru)

The comfort setting seems to save wheels and tires when we go to a potholed area.
 

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Re: 4C Who loves it, and who hates it! (JRL)

Yup, exactly. It's automated bump steer and you want it dialed out of your suspension settings!<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>JRL</b> »</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br>I don't know of any racer to a man that would want the suspension changing all the time, not knowing what may happen next. These guys are driving at 10/10ths, that's hard enoughh without worrying what the car MAY do differently each and every corner and lap</TD></TR></TABLE>
 

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Re: 4C Who loves it, and who hates it! (LotusMark)

The computer is going to react the same way everytime in the SAME situation. It's a program, not a person. Since you aren't going to drive the car around the track, or the corner, the exact same way everytime, it may react a little different. But that is also the case with a car without active suspension. 4C is simply adding more variables to the equation of what a suspension does under a given situation. Seems to me if you improve the consistency in your lapping, then you minimize the variance in what the 4C does. <p>I know at least one poster here attributed 4C (in reduced mode I think?) saved his butt at the track. I've heard other stories of it saving someone off track in a harry situation.<p>The question is active suspension (aka stability control) or no active? Should it really be 4C active or some other active? <p>People, we are talking about a 4-dr, heavy, mid-size luxury sedan. This things isn't a race car and was not designed with the intended use of driving around a race track. If you like to go to the track a lot, then you should be driving a different car. Discussing 4C's appropriateness using examples at the track seems a bit like nit picking the car to me. Sort of like should I track my Cadillac with stiffer springs or stock springs?<p>I like the adjustability of the system. Although even with the TME springs, I'm somewhat dissapointed in Volvo's suspension engineering, especially in comfort mode. I swear the car rides better in sport over rough roads than in comfort but I guess I just like a more solid feel instead of the jiggly loose feel. Sport mode with the TME springs I guess is the best you can do as far as a good blend of compliance and stiffness in my opinion. Suspension still feels a bit unsettled and transfers a lot of fine vibration while having a bit of a numb feel at the steering wheel - I know that sounds contradictory - transfers vibration but feels numb, but that's how I describe it. No car is perfect. If I were driving a Lotus Elise I'd be complaining about the cramped cabin and lack of amenities.<p>Don't like 4C, especially at the track, pop the fuse and turn it off. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.vwvortex.com/vwbb/smile.gif" BORDER="0"><p>
 
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