SwedeSpeed - Volvo Performance Forum banner
61 - 80 of 98 Posts

· Registered
Joined
·
34 Posts
"If you own a reliable XC90 and love it, my hat is off to you. I am sincerely happy for you."
WHOA, saddened by your experience. I have been extremely pleased with my loaded 2019 XC-90 Inscription with none of those issues except for the front discs which were quickly replaced. BTW, our trade was a loaded Lincoln MKT.
Success on your next vehicle.

Tire Sky Wheel Vehicle registration plate Vehicle
 

Attachments

· Registered
2019 XC90R
Joined
·
16 Posts
Discussion Starter · #62 ·
You'll have to report back your initial feedback on your new Lincoln. I'll be curious to hear what you have to say. I've been a BMW guy for quite a while, and currently drive a '17 X5, which is an incredible vehicle to drive and own. Was thinking about going "Volvo" for an SUV (currently own 3 classic 240's for fun). After reading through this post, I'm wondering if sticking with the X5 is not in my best interest. Reading through all these posts, it seems like it's almost a draw on the good and the bad - I'm sure like most vehicles (the same post written about an X5 would probably come to a draw as well, although my experience with the two X5's I've owned has been stellar). Make a point of coming back and letting us know what you think of your new car.
Will do...it is supposed to be built next week. Supposedly delivery sometime next month.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
1,238 Posts
  • Chrome / Aluminum: Its Everywhere. Literally. Mirrors, grille, trim, etc. Tacky plastic aluminum. In fairness, the new ones have more exterior black trim and looks a load better. The aluminum just dates the design IMHO.
  • No Buttons: What began as looking like a minimal, elegant designed cockpit, void of buttons is actually a user PITA. I really did like the lack of buttons and dusty spots, but after daily use, having to go through the head unit / touch screen for common tasks related to the radio selection or climate control gets old. The interior needs just a handful more buttons for frequently used tasks.
  • Safety features: Lane keeping assist can be invasive. My wife and daughters refuse to drive the car. Yes, you can turn it off, but they don't like it. So no on drives it but me.
I agree with much of what the Big wrote in his OP. I've pulled out three of his bullet points here. I'm not an XC90 owner but a '22 XC60 T8 ER owner with the new Google OS. The things listed above are the same on all Volvos. I could not get myself to buy a Volvo despite trying my darndest to so during 2017-2022, and in that interim I bought Porsches for myself and a RAV4 Prime for my wife. I finally got the '22 XC60 because it's a plug-in hybrid with (finally) a decent all-electric range and a truly decent drivetrain (the best drivetrain in a Volvo in my opinion by far since the pre-4-cylinder-only era). These 2-liter, 4-cylinder over-charged engines have been underwhelming, and the bigger the Volvo, the worse they are. Volvo really needs to go to electrification as fast as possible, and run away from making ICEVs. (I test-drove an XC90 soon after it came out, ca. 2003, and remember it being really lethargic driving up a hill -- not impressed with an engine that was too small for too heavy a vehicle.)

I agree on the usual points about great visibility in these Volvo SUVs (and wagons), and their safety is great as far as the non-software parts are concerned. Given how bad Volvo software is, I have little faith in software to protect my life in a serious accident, but hope that the metal cages would do so. The LKA is indeed horrible, but then it's really horrible in all cars (and in my opinion should not be allowed in cars); ACC is really the only automated type of driving that automakers should be allowed to put in their cars ... drivers need to steer and stay alert!

The "no buttons" issue is huge. Other notable automakers are not following the "Tesla route" on this topic, but sadly Volvo and Polestar are doing so. This makes Volvo and Polestar inherently unsafe cars, because they require the driver to spend huge amounts of time fiddling with their eyes on a finicky touchscreen for basic things like audio, climate, phone, and drive mode when all of those things should be mandated by federal law to be in physical buttons/dials -- whether on or off the steering wheel (certainly phone and drive modes should be on the steering wheel, with gauges in the instrument screen). A recent poll at an XC60 owners forum on Facebook with hundreds of responses showed that about 2/3 desire more physical buttons in Volvos for these things that drivers need to access quickly and often. The federal government should mandate that a touchscreen cannot be utilized (i.e., touching it will do nothing) while the car is in motion -- for safety. Then, as other automakers continue to do, put important things into buttons/dials for the driver when driving.

This huge brain fart and cultish following of Tesla-stupid design has taken the "best safety automaker" crown away from Volvo -- years ago now. My 2001 V70XC wagon has only buttons and dials -- no touchscreen -- and I can access everything by feel/touch without even looking; that is good safety design in a car. I suspect that Volvo loses huge numbers of sales because of this -- lack of physical buttons and crappy touchscreen with tiny icons and badly designed software with stuff buried in sub-menus. It certainly was a huge factor in my not buying a Volvo from 2017 to 2022 and buying several other cars instead; what got me to buy my '22 XC60 despite the horrible access-to-functions issues is the more-powerful "Extended Range" drivetrain and other practical aspects of the car when ignoring the lack of buttons and horrible screens. (Yes, the current Volvo instrument-panel screens have to be just about the worst in the luxury automotive industry, except for Tesla which has none.)

I hear lots of Volvo people saying, regarding the buttons issue: but you have voice "control". That's a cop-out and not a dependable "solution". I can't get voice commands to do half the things I want/need, and what it does do, I often have to repeat 2 or 3 times. And I often don't want to use voice because I'm talking with passengers (or passengers are talking to passengers) or I'm on the phone or I'm listening to radio/music, etc., etc. No, voice commands are NOT a proper excuse for eliminating buttons/dials.

And chrome is much more of a subjective thing than the above topics, but I sure do hate chrome inside and outside cars, as well, and the cheap-looking chrome in today's Volvos makes them look like $20k cars inside, not like real luxury cars. My 2001 V70 has no chrome at all inside, and the only chrome outside is lettering/badging and the wheel hubs. I have an R-Design XC60, so the exterior is pretty blacked out (except for lettering/badging and wheels, again), and I'm thankful that Volvo allows that on the exterior. But I really prefer the interior of my 2001 V70 wagon to that in my '22 XC60 in almost every single way; the only thing I really want my computer screen for is maps, and the Google Maps in the new Volvos are superior to the crap that is in Sensus (and another reason why I wouldn't buy a Volvo prior to the '22 models going back to 2017). But a big design mistake by Volvo was trying to cram Google OS into the same apparent hardware unit/space, when they should have totally redesigned that space. Our other cars of recent years have horizontal screens (Toyota, Porsche), and horizontal screens really are superior for a driver, in my opinion to vertical computer screens.

Three more safety thoughts:
I don't know how it is in your XC90s, but in my XC60 I have no way to access tire pressure in psi in either my computer screen or in my instrument panel (where it should be, behind the steering wheel). In our Toyota and Porsches, I'm always checking the tire pressure in my instrument panel after I hit something in the road or hit an especially bad pothole, but I can't do this in my XC60. What the heck?
And I have gotten the optional infrared ("night vision") camera in my Porsche Panamera, which is really good for safety; it allows me to see pedestrians and animals at night whether near road's edge or actually in the road, when I can't see them due to darkness or to blinding on-coming headlights, and it allows you to see through dense fog in daytime or nighttime -- all of which can be a lifesaver. I do not understand why Volvo, the "safety automaker", doesn't offer infrared cameras as an option.
Third, glass roofs are inherently less safe than are all-metal roofs. I want the option (as I can get in Toyotas and Porsches) to have an all-metal roof. I don't want to have to worry about things hitting the roof glass and cracking/breaking the glass (a not-all-that-uncommon thing), or about excess glare/heat from roof glass, or about having to keep roof glass clean, or about problematical seals leaking water into the cabin from roof glass (something again too common in Volvos and other cars with glass roofs), or about how less safe roof glass is than metal in a roll-over accident.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Big Lebowski

· Registered
2017 Volvo XC90 T6 Momentum Polestar
Joined
·
336 Posts
Interestingly, we were also thinking of moving into a Lincoln Aviator. We currently have a 2017 XC-90 with 85k miles. We do like the car, but there has been quite a few growing pains until today. They were not deal breakers which would have required us to immediately ditch the car.

But our issues were/are:
1) Sensus software - fixed via updates during the early months of ownership
2) Battery drain - fixed via updates during the early months of ownership
3) Brake rotor warping - I did NOT complain about this but they replaced it for free...twice! THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS ROTOR WARPING. But there are brake pad deposits that make it appear as though there is. From racing, I've always learned to jam on the brakes REALLY HARD after going 70+mph to clear this up; works every time. OR simply swap pads which I eventually have done with ceramic pads. No more "warping" and no more brake pad dusts!
4) Fit and finish - it's a pseudo luxury car so my expectations are a little lower compared to the Germans. But they were and still are very noticeable.
5) Overhead console leak - came about after a windshield replacement around 75k miles. I had no prior water issues. I didn't want to bring it back for fear of them screwing it up more. I had to retrofit to make it absorb the leaking.
6) Lots of squeaks and rattles coming from the sunroof and tailgate which I have to re-adjust/oil every so often.
7) This super-turbo 4 cylinder engine seriously sounds like crap but...

Things we like/love:
1) Gas mileage of this 4 cylinder given the power is great! 27 mpg fully loaded on the highway! Around 25 mpg with a roof box! The Polestar has given us new life for now.
2) Pilot Assist is a must for us for any car moving forward
3) Ability to remove the 2nd row center seat to create a 6 seater. I know this is a "mod", but not all SUVs can be easily modded to do this. Takes me 15 min to pop this in and out.
4) Heated seats for 4 seats and real hot heated steering wheel are a must for us moving forward
5) Styling still looks good to us
6) Panorama sunroof

Overall, this has been a good SUV for us. The only reason for the desired change is... 3rd row seating. The 3 kids are getting bigger such that we need to have the 3rd row be bigger (they can't sit next to each other as they will kill each other). On that note, the Aviator got nixed when we went for a "test fit". They liked the Navigator/Escalade size better, but they're too damn big and cumbersome. The MB GLS, BMW X7, Genesis are too small. The new gen Pallisade/Telluride may be better but we haven't test fitted them yet. The just-released Mazda CX-90 (interesting how the XC switched to CX) looks promising as it will have a mild hybrid turbo inline 6 cylinder, have a bigger 3rd row and bigger luggage area than the XC90. But dunno how Mazda's version of Pilot Assist will be. I know the Hyundai/Genesis/Kia's version is much better than the Volvo's. I don't want anything less than the Volvo's Pilot Assist at this point.

Maybe a year from now, we will move into the Mazda CX-90. It will supposedly handle like a BMW X5 (which we had) with a bit more room.
 

· Registered
2020 V90 Inscription T6 (all options except upgrade stereo and rear wheel air suspension)
Joined
·
1,121 Posts
Agree on most points except seats (our inscription seats with heat/cool/massage are sublime), ride quality (very comfortable with air suspension), and design (still looks better than vast majority of suvs on road).

But rest of points are pretty spot on. Engine is adequate at best. Lane keep assist is intrusive and have found pilot assist works much better with LKA turned off. It is not a vehicle that rewards aggressive driving, but is wonderful for long trips at near-legal speeds. We haven’t had anywhere near the issues you have, but 100% would never own one of these without a Volvo backed warranty.

Good luck with the Aviator…our cpo xc90 was traded in on an Aviator too. Only Volvo/Lincoln dealer I’ve ever seen lol.
I have a 2020 V90, not an XC90. With that said, as we know, Volvo includes many identical components and design elements in their various models. I think my perforated nappa leather seats are identical or close to identical with the XC90's. These seats are terrific for comfort and support. Both my wife and I can attest to this. We have surgically repaired back issues and have gone on numerous 5+ hour drives to New England with no problems. I test drove the V90R and did not like the hard, narrow and stiff-bolstered seats. Regarding the firm ride and noisy cabin, I'm also in total agreement with the OP. IMO, ride is not up to "luxury" car standards because it's a bit stiff and the front dashboard can sound like it's exploding if/when confronted with even a small pothole. Lastly, the T6 engine. Yes it has decent power and torque, but it's not nearly as smooth or quiet, nor does it have the same mpg, as the V6 E450 Estate Wagon that I had seriously considered when I factory ordered my V90. With everything said, I bought (not leased) my 2020 V90 Inscription T6, as opposed to E450 Estate, for three primary reason; the front seat comfort and support is outstanding, I felt the exterior and interior design was unique and beautiful and, lastly, I felt the V90 Inscription vs the E450 Estate was a better value. Still feel the same after 31+ months of ownership. No car is perfect and one should purchase the car that most corresponds to their more important needs and wants.
 

· Registered
2020 V90 Inscription T6 (all options except upgrade stereo and rear wheel air suspension)
Joined
·
1,121 Posts
Ha ha, I knew there’d be one who’d be offended by my feedback. Fair enough, but please don’t take it personally. My opinion / experience shouldn’t diminish yours.

So, my ”cons” of electrical system failure, air suspension failure and warped rotors are ‘personal preference?” Ok, sure. Those are pretty big flaws in most people’s books.

Thw Aviator and XC90 are nothing alike. The 30 way adjustable seats with massage function are incredible…and the fit and finish I’ve seen was top notch.

Honestly, we (consumers) role the dice on every new car purchase, from any manufacturer. I’m well aware of the Aviator issues and I will manage. If they are excessive, I’ll dump it. If they are persistent, I’ll pursue lemon law…which I’ve done before.

As for waiting behind Explorer and Fusion customers, not likely, as I bought from a stand alone Lincoln dealer in a brand new flagship store. IF I have to spend time at the Lincoln dealer at least it’ll be in a relaxing setting instead of an antiquated Volvo showroom with a Keurig and a vending machine. But I won’t, because they DO continue to offer drop off and pickup service.

I hope you continue to enjoy your Volvo. Sincerely.
I took a 100 mile test drive in the Aviator with the 30 way adjustable seats. In my case, it felt very comfortable, at the beginning. However, after driving it for a number of miles, it felt hard. When it comes to seat comfort, it's really in the eye-of-the-beholder ... or the feel-of-one's-butt ... LOL! Good luck with your Aviator.
 

· Registered
2019 XC90R
Joined
·
16 Posts
Discussion Starter · #67 ·
I took a 100 mile test drive in the Aviator with the 30 way adjustable seats. In my case, it felt very comfortable, at the beginning. However, after driving it for a number of miles, it felt hard. When it comes to seat comfort, it's really in the eye-of-the-beholder ... or the feel-of-one's-butt ... LOL! Good luck with your Aviator.
Agree, and thank you!
 

· Registered
Joined
·
228 Posts
I had a 2022 V90 CC for 4 months. I got rid of it because of the extremely awful and amateurish AAOS. That being said, I thought the ride, comfort and noise were fantastic. The handling was not sports car like but… different market segment.

Other than the AAOS, what I didn’t like about the V90 CC was the B6 engine. Particularly the fuel consumption. That vehicle was replaced by an Audi S5. More/better power and better fuel economy.



I have a 2020 V90, not an XC90. With that said, as we know, Volvo includes many identical components and design elements in their various models. I think my perforated nappa leather seats are identical or close to identical with the XC90's. These seats are terrific for comfort and support. Both my wife and I can attest to this. We have surgically repaired back issues and have gone on numerous 5+ hour drives to New England with no problems. I test drove the V90R and did not like the hard, narrow and stiff-bolstered seats. Regarding the firm ride and noisy cabin, I'm also in total agreement with the OP. IMO, ride is not up to "luxury" car standards because it's a bit stiff and the front dashboard can sound like it's exploding if/when confronted with even a small pothole. Lastly, the T6 engine. Yes it has decent power and torque, but it's not nearly as smooth or quiet, nor does it have the same mpg, as the V6 E450 Estate Wagon that I had seriously considered when I factory ordered my V90. With everything said, I bought (not leased) my 2020 V90 Inscription T6, as opposed to E450 Estate, for three primary reason; the front seat comfort and support is outstanding, I felt the exterior and interior design was unique and beautiful and, lastly, I felt the V90 Inscription vs the E450 Estate was a better value. Still feel the same after 31+ months of ownership. No car is perfect and one should purchase the car that most corresponds to their more important needs and wants.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
1,375 Posts
Three more safety thoughts:
-snip-
Third, glass roofs are inherently less safe than are all-metal roofs. I want the option (as I can get in Toyotas and Porsches) to have an all-metal roof. I don't want to have to worry about things hitting the roof glass and cracking/breaking the glass (a not-all-that-uncommon thing), or about excess glare/heat from roof glass, or about having to keep roof glass clean, or about problematical seals leaking water into the cabin from roof glass (something again too common in Volvos and other cars with glass roofs), or about how less safe roof glass is than metal in a roll-over accident.
One of the key reasons I did not buy new - not being able to option out the sunroof. For cars that are kept a long time they invariably rattle, need arms and seals replaced, take up headroom for tall folks, plus all the concerns raised above are quite valid. Also its extra several tens of pounds up high which increases vehicle roll in turns.

Hope Volvo reads these forums . . .
 

· Registered
2005 V70, 2016 V60
Joined
·
655 Posts
Re the V90 rough engine:
Is it the same I4 Turbo as the V60? I find that engine is plenty for the V60, the car is not slow. My one complaint is the transmission likes to shift early and the engine straining against a tall gear is kind of diesel sounding and feeling. If I spent what a V90 costs I might think more refinement would be nice. My old V70 is slower but the engine is smoother for sure.
 

· Registered
2020 V90 Inscription T6 (all options except upgrade stereo and rear wheel air suspension)
Joined
·
1,121 Posts
Re the V90 rough engine:
Is it the same I4 Turbo as the V60? I find that engine is plenty for the V60, the car is not slow. My one complaint is the transmission likes to shift early and the engine straining against a tall gear is kind of diesel sounding and feeling. If I spent what a V90 costs I might think more refinement would be nice. My old V70 is slower but the engine is smoother for sure.
I think it's the same engine, but with turbo and supercharger. In "dynamic", the car revs and shifts properly. In "comfort", when I step on the accelerator a little aggressively, the engine revs while the trans searches for a gear. Not as refined as the V6 E450 Estate I test drove, but (at that time) with an msrp of more than $20k, I can accept the reduced performance on my V. When I want to drive more aggressively, I use "dynamic", which is fine.
 

· Registered
2004 V70 T5M -- 2019 V90CC T6
Joined
·
3,747 Posts
I think it's the same engine, but with turbo and supercharger. In "dynamic", the car revs and shifts properly. In "comfort", when I step on the accelerator a little aggressively, the engine revs while the trans searches for a gear. Not as refined as the V6 E450 Estate I test drove, but (at that time) with an msrp of more than $20k, I can accept the reduced performance on my V. When I want to drive more aggressively, I use "dynamic", which is fine.
Get the Polestar tune. It absolutely transforms the car's shifting.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
3,239 Posts
The "no buttons" issue is huge. Other notable automakers are not following the "Tesla route" on this topic, but sadly Volvo and Polestar are doing so. This makes Volvo and Polestar inherently unsafe cars, because they require the driver to spend huge amounts of time fiddling with their eyes on a finicky touchscreen for basic things like audio, climate, phone, and drive mode when all of those things should be mandated by federal law to be in physical buttons/dials -- whether on or off the steering wheel (certainly phone and drive modes should be on the steering wheel, with gauges in the instrument screen). A recent poll at an XC60 owners forum on Facebook with hundreds of responses showed that about 2/3 desire more physical buttons in Volvos for these things that drivers need to access quickly and often. The federal government should mandate that a touchscreen cannot be utilized (i.e., touching it will do nothing) while the car is in motion -- for safety. Then, as other automakers continue to do, put important things into buttons/dials for the driver when driving.
Curious for your reaction once you get acquainted with driver's window controls on EX90. Dedicated switches for all four windows have been replaced with one set of left / right switches, plus a toggle button between front and rear windows. Increased distraction for driver in exchange for net savings of one control. On a family vehicle. Madness.
Finger Communication Device Office equipment Gadget Office supplies
 

· Registered
2020 V90 Inscription T6 (all options except upgrade stereo and rear wheel air suspension)
Joined
·
1,121 Posts
The "no buttons" issue is huge. Other notable automakers are not following the "Tesla route" on this topic, but sadly Volvo and Polestar are doing so.
Actually, I get the impression that OEMs are migrating more-and-more to a fairly sterile dashboard with an all-in-one center tablet display. My guess is that this approach falls in-line with younger drivers who already embrace this type of technology. Plus, it's probably cheaper and easier to manufacture a car with an iPad-like center display, as opposed to mechanical knobs. I'm not saying I'm in favor of this trend, but to me it does seem to be the way things are going. As for me, I took a big leap when I bought my 2020 V90 with its center display. After two days of use, I felt comfortable with it, even if I didn't necessarily like it.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
87 Posts
I have one month left on my second XC90 lease, and I am honestly counting the days until it is over. Admittedly, part of that is excitement for my new car which is scheduled to be built early next month, but mostly I am ready to move on. I am on multiple other vehicle forums, and I understand how this can come off. I'm going to share my feedback and let future buyers draw their own conclusions. Flame suit activated for those that do not like my perspective, and I respect that.
Creating an account only to criticize a car in a forum of folks who own that car - right before supposedly leaving the brand - is sh*tty form, if not outright troll-y.

This isn't a fan club, it is a shared interest community. I think my own posts skew 30-30-40 criticizing-praising-troubleshooting. Volvo happens to be 1 of 3 brands I currently own, and of about 15 I have owned so far, so in no way is the my identity tied up with that car (I am aware of Volvo lifers here for whom that may be the case.)

I am sorry that you had such a terrible experience with Volvo. But if you never cared to be part of the community to share the highs and lows, and never helped others when they had questions, maybe the right call would have been to keep it that way.
 

· Registered
MY22.5 XC90 Recharge Extended Range in Birch Light and Blond, Lounge, Advanced, Climate, Air and B&W
Joined
·
473 Posts
I am sorry that you had such a terrible experience with Volvo. But if you never cared to be part of the community and share the highs and lows, and never helped others when they had questions, maybe the right call would have been to keep it that way.
Amen to that brother:)
 

· Registered
Joined
·
87 Posts
“Fancy Ford?” This passive aggressive comment says so much about you.
The only differences between the Aviator and the Explorer (which is a very nice car btw) are Ford's profit margin and the ego of the buyer.

Especially true for those who buy lower stripped down trims of the 'luxury' brand (which is most buyers) over the fully loaded and more luxurious versions of the mass market brand, for about the same price. Because their ego requires them to trade off actual luxury features for a superficial luxury badge.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
1,666 Posts
Because their ego requires them to trade off actual luxury features for a superficial luxury badge.
I bought a Volvo, debadged it, then slapped on some of Dave Barton's prancingmoose.com stickers to "upmarket" it to a Faux-rari for less than $15 . The horsepower increase was also worth it . From a distance it works with Not-Knowing-Any-Better drivers!

Beautiful thing is we have freedom of choice - I chose Faux-rari moose but Dave Barton also has Lamborghini moose, Porsche moose, and Pegasus moose too.

Sample pix below (not my car)
Wheel Tire Car Vehicle Land vehicle
Tire Wheel Car Vehicle Automotive tire
 
  • Haha
Reactions: bot42

· Registered
2005 V70, 2016 V60
Joined
·
655 Posts
The only differences between the Aviator and the Explorer (which is a very nice car btw) are Ford's profit margin and the ego of the buyer.

Especially true for those who buy lower stripped down trims of the 'luxury' brand (which is most buyers) over the fully loaded and more luxurious versions of the mass market brand, for about the same price. Because their ego requires them to trade off actual luxury features for a superficial luxury badge.
Or.........last time I was shopping Lincoln warranties were longer in time and miles than Ford. Plus at least here the Lexus dealership is so nice you want to buy cars from them frequently so you can hang around, the Toyota dealer that has the mechanical sisters of many Lexi is a grin and bear it experience at best. I can think of a LOT of reasons to shop Lincoln other than ego. Speaking of, is there anyone under about 90 that really cares about Lincoln vs. Ford when they see one drive past?
 
61 - 80 of 98 Posts
Top