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XC90 oil consumption dilemma

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#23 ·
comrade said:
I used castrol edge high mileage once, but read it is not compliant (on this forum somewhere). Thats why i got tec v? Does it really matter?
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From what I've found the VCC RBS0-2AE was first mentioned sometime in 2014 and there is no indication that there have been updates to the spec since. Their spec may have been superior than most in 2014, but there have been substantial improvements in oil specs in the last 10yrs. Improvements specifically oriented towards these lower viscosity oils used modern engines and mitigating LSPI. None of the oils made for the Volvo spec meet the latest specs. Assuming these Volvo engines don't actually require Volvo consecrated oil to run and the engines have similar oil demands to other GDI engines with forced induction, I think it's a safe assumption that the latest synthetic API SP rated oils are superior to the Volvo oils.
 
#24 ·
The problem with just adding oil is most of the time it does lead to engine failure pretty early on with burnt valves or cylinder wall scoring. So I would not consider that an actual option for more than just an unloading period. But you probably don't lose any more with a blown motor than you do paying to fix it and trying to sell.... so selling before it blows is probably the most economic option.
 
#25 ·
comrade said:
Hi
Been a while, was riding it trouble free.
Recently developed that oil consumption problem, mine is 2016 xc90 with now 80k miles. When i reported it to the dealership and volvo, i had about 78k. So they said i just tad out of extended warranty and have to pay for oil test(600 or so) and then MAYBE volvo pick up a tab to change pistons.
I did the engine flush, that helped a little, but still, 600 miles cost me probably half a quart.
Strangely indicator drops suddenly, you drive home with maybe missing 3 bars, next time you start, it is half gone.
So what do you guys think, should i try my luck or keep adding oil until it finally breaks and buy Toyota?
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Don't waste your time with pistons and rings. I was about to pull my block and tear it down to do that upgrade but I had a Swedish import mechanic tell me not to bother. He said It'll be good for 20-30k and likely develop the problem again. Even with the upgraded pistons and rings. Poke around here and you'll see a few posts from people who have gone through the trouble and have had the issue pop up again.

What I'm currently doing:

10W-40 instead of 5W-30. Only synthetic.
Once or twice a week run the car a little hard in manual mode. Tach it up to 6500-7k in 1st and second. (This helps burn off carbon deposits in the oil rings).
Stay on top of oil changes. Change more frequently than the manual calls for.
Mine will start burning a quart every 1k miles right around the 3K post change mark. If I do all the above steps I can usually get to 4500k before it starts burning.

My s60 started burning this way at 65k miles. Ive now got 100k on her and she purs like a kitten. I've taken a look at the pistons and bore walls with my portable video scope. No scoring from what I can see. I'm about to do my timing belt water pump, cam seals and oil pump seal. Probably clean out the PCV breather while I'm at it.

It's not just Volvo that has this issue. Many newer cars do: Audi, Subaru, Toyota, BMW. My 2018 Forester had a new short block installed under warranty for burning 1.2 quarts every 700 miles. The new short block was good for 10k and it started burning again. It's the damn EPA regs. They try to make things more efficient in carbon emissions, and end up causing more harm. Thinner oils, tighter oil rings.


Best of luck.
 
#26 ·
comrade said:
I am capable to do it myself, but lack special tools to hold the camshafts and some others. If they can be obtained cheap, i can try. Outsourcing the job i can do 2k at most cause i love the car, but they are all over the place for 15-17k for this year and no takers. Maybe ill just keep adding the oil and do engine flus

Thanks a lot,ill go thru it. Agreed not an easy taks
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At this point- try what I mentioned in my post above. See how far it takes you. Worst case scenario you score the engine up- you can find plenty of complete functional engines with higher mileage shipped to your door for 2k and sometimes less. The cam locker tool costs 40$ on Amazon. You don't need the 200$ one. Honestly this is my planned solution. The reason the price is so high is because no one wants to rebuild anymore. It's time consuming and a pain in the ass. And really just swapping the engine is probably enough to carry you to 200k or more.
 
#28 ·
volvogod said:
Good to the last stroke.
My buddy sent me these pics of a car that they got in a few months ago.
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Coulda kept driving it! Just keep adding oil and some sea foam! 😂
 
#30 · (Edited)
Timthetoolman said:
Don't waste your time with pistons and rings. I was about to pull my block and tear it down to do that upgrade but I had a Swedish import mechanic tell me not to bother. He said It'll be good for 20-30k and likely develop the problem again. Even with the upgraded pistons and rings. Poke around here and you'll see a few posts from people who have gone through the trouble and have had the issue pop up again.

What I'm currently doing:

10W-40 instead of 5W-30. Only synthetic.
Once or twice a week run the car a little hard in manual mode. Tach it up to 6500-7k in 1st and second. (This helps burn off carbon deposits in the oil rings).
Stay on top of oil changes. Change more frequently than the manual calls for.
Mine will start burning a quart every 1k miles right around the 3K post change mark. If I do all the above steps I can usually get to 4500k before it starts burning.

My s60 started burning this way at 65k miles. Ive now got 100k on her and she purs like a kitten. I've taken a look at the pistons and bore walls with my portable video scope. No scoring from what I can see. I'm about to do my timing belt water pump, cam seals and oil pump seal. Probably clean out the PCV breather while I'm at it.

It's not just Volvo that has this issue. Many newer cars do: Audi, Subaru, Toyota, BMW. My 2018 Forester had a new short block installed under warranty for burning 1.2 quarts every 700 miles. The new short block was good for 10k and it started burning again. It's the damn EPA regs. They try to make things more efficient in carbon emissions, and end up causing more harm. Thinner oils, tighter oil rings.


Best of luck.
Click to expand...
That doesn't make any sense. Most engines don't have oil burning issues. Even when new engine iterations come out (like your subaru) and get recalls for oil burning, most of those engines don't burn oil. Why would you assume a rebuilt or new engine would quickly start burning oil just because the previous engine did?

Also, there is a difference between an engine that starts burning oil within the first 25k miles and an engine that starts burning oil after 75k miles. The former is due to a flaw in a component that isn't going to be fixed by any sort of cleaning and the latter is possibly due to carbon making the rings stick that could very possibly be fixed with cleaning.

Switching to 10w-40 might be an ok solution if the engine is burning oil due to a flawed component like insufficient ring tension or improper ring seating. If the oil burning is due to clogged up rings, then switching to 10w-40 is likely going to just be a short term bandaid as the rings get worse and worse. 10w-40 is 40-60% thicker than 5w-30. 80-120% thicker than 0w-20. I would be curious to see what your oil pressure is running at.

The 'Italian Tune-up' is a good recommendation. Getting things hot to loosen up deposits that may have started to build up. Usually combined with some sort of fuel injection cleaner.
 
#31 ·
vica153 said:
That doesn't make any sense. Most engines don't have oil burning issues. Even when new engine iterations come out (like your subaru) and get recalls for oil burning, most of those engines don't burn oil. Why would you assume a rebuilt or new engine would quickly start burning oil just because the previous engine did?

Also, there is a difference between an engine that starts burning oil within the first 25k miles and an engine that starts burning oil after 75k miles. The former is due to a flaw in a component that isn't going to be fixed by any sort of cleaning and the latter is possibly due to carbon making the rings stick that could very possibly be fixed with cleaning.

Switching to 10w-40 might be an ok solution if the engine is burning oil due to a flawed component like insufficient ring tension or improper ring seating. If the oil burning is due to clogged up rings, then switching to 10w-40 is likely going to just be a sort term bandaid as the rings get worse and worse. 10w-40 is 40-60% thicker than 5w-30. 80-120% thicker than 0w-20. I would be curious to see what your oil pressures is running at.

The 'Italian Tune-up' is a good recommendation. Getting things hot to loosen up deposits that may have started to build up. Usually combined with some sort of fuel injection cleaner.
Click to expand...
 
#32 · (Edited)
vica153 said:
That doesn't make any sense. Most engines don't have oil burning issues. Even when new engine iterations come out (like your subaru) and get recalls for oil burning, most of those engines don't burn oil. Why would you assume a rebuilt or new engine would quickly start burning oil just because the previous engine did?

Also, there is a difference between an engine that starts burning oil within the first 25k miles and an engine that starts burning oil after 75k miles. The former is due to a flaw in a component that isn't going to be fixed by any sort of cleaning and the latter is possibly due to carbon making the rings stick that could very possibly be fixed with cleaning.

Switching to 10w-40 might be an ok solution if the engine is burning oil due to a flawed component like insufficient ring tension or improper ring seating. If the oil burning is due to clogged up rings, then switching to 10w-40 is likely going to just be a short term bandaid as the rings get worse and worse. 10w-40 is 40-60% thicker than 5w-30. 80-120% thicker than 0w-20. I would be curious to see what your oil pressure is running at.

The 'Italian Tune-up' is a good recommendation. Getting things hot to loosen up deposits that may have started to build up. Usually combined with some sort of fuel injection cleaner.
Click to expand...
10w40 higher viscosity, it will burn slower. That's merely to give you the advantage of not having to change the oil every 3,000 miles (which is what I was doing when running the called for 5w-30). I also hope to preserve catalysts longer in this way. This is why I switched off of the suggested factory oil change down to lower mileage. A ) older oil burns faster as it breaks down B.) I know this car has the ring defect. Sure I could tear down the Volvo and go for the upgraded pistons and rings, but I'll trust the swedish import mechanic who has done this piston upgrade on quite a few cars, and has had them start burning again 20-30k later. He's stopped offering the upgrade to customers. Why waste my time and energy if that's the case? Why would he lie to me? Worst case scenario, I'll buy a used engine, spend a weekend with my chain fall and call it a day. Best case scenario, I keep doing what I'm doing and I can her around the clock twice.

Every car manufacturer has a tolerance of what is considered excessive oil consumption. My 2018 Subaru Forester started burning 1 qt every 750 miles when it had 25k on the clock and was 2 years old. They replaced the complete engine- it burned no oil for 12-15k miles and then started burning again about 1qt every 1300 miles. Acceptable burning was 1 qt per 1,000 miles per Subaru. I traded ìt in before I had to go through that fiasco again. Go to any manufacturers and you'll see they all have acceptable burning tolerances. Toyota is 1 qt/1200miles, Audi 1qt/700miles. Etc etc.


Hey- do what I do or don't. I'm simply telling you what's been working for me for the last 40k. 🤷
 
#33 ·
In terms of oil, the best at cleaning will be something with an ester base stock like Redline or Motul 300v. We used to use Redline at my old shop to clean out engines, and sometime it did too good of a job, cleaning out gunk that was helping plug old seals and creating seeps. Only downside to Redline is it isn’t known to be very catalytic-friendly with all the antiwear additives. Motul 300v might be a better choice if trying to use the oil to clean up rings, but honestly don’t know how much of an effect oil would have in general.
 
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#34 ·
Stickygreen said:
In terms of oil, the best at cleaning will be something with an ester base stock like Redline or Motul 300v. We used to use Redline at my old shop to clean out engines, and sometime it did too good of a job, cleaning out gunk that was helping plug old seals and creating seeps. Only downside to Redline is it isn’t known to be very catalytic-friendly with all the antiwear additives. Motul 300v might be a better choice if trying to use the oil to clean up rings, but honestly don’t know how much of an effect oil would have in general.
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A different oil wouldn't help much. Using better fuels does help much more. Not all premium fuels are equal and "Top Tier" is just the starting point.

There are additives that could help cleaning things up before an oil change. There are also fuel treatments that can help clean up the injectors which is always a good thing. Unless the engine is in terrible shape and it's probably too late to save it anyway, none of this is going to be a drastic improvement. You can't catch up on preventative maintenance after years of neglect.
 
#35 ·
Row57 said:
A different oil wouldn't help much. Using better fuels does help much more. Not all premium fuels are equal and "Top Tier" is just the starting point.

There are additives that could help cleaning things up before an oil change. There are also fuel treatments that can help clean up the injectors which is always a good thing. Unless the engine is in terrible shape and it's probably too late to save it anyway, none of this is going to be a drastic improvement. You can't catch up on preventative maintenance after years of neglect.
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Huh? Simply stating "Different oils wouldn't help much" isn't any different than stating "Different fuels wouldn't help much". Sure neither one is going to work miracles, but there are methods where each can be used to clean up piston deposits. They actually mostly affect different areas of the pistons. High detergent oils aren't going to clean the top of the piston and high detergent fuels aren't going to clean the oil control ring.

It's certainly possible that it may be too little too late to save the engine, but that seems all the more reason to try relatively cheap/easy "fixes" before moving to an engine rebuild. If you aren't worried about the silly VCC spec for warranty work, then there's no reason to not try a high quality synthetic oil designed to clean up ring deposits. Most are only $5-6/qt which is substantially cheaper than any of the Volvo spec oils.
 
#36 ·
If it were my car, I'd pay the $600 to have the dealer spend a couple minutes looking at it to determine if they're going to do anything with the car or not. Likely they'll just do an oil change and have you come back in 1000 miles or so for that $600, but if it means they'll put rings in it, that's 100% the way to go. The fact that you did a BG EPR or similar cleaning service might hurt your chances as you might have reduced your oil consumption to an acceptable level.

That being said, we've done BG EPR services in conjunction with an overnight or two piston soak with some GM Top End Cleaner (safer than B12 Chemtool as it has some lubricating properties still) with good results on many of these 4, 5 and 6 cylinder oil burners that Volvo experienced starting in 2011. It doesn't fix it all the way, but it has helped on every car we've done it on. Some cars are just too far and need an engine by the time they come to us after having been dealer serviced with 10k intervals then having the dealer turn them away saying there's no problem before the extended 8yr/100k warranty came out. Those poor souls!

We do 5k intervals and the LiquiMoly Tec V 0w20 on all the Drive-E/VEA 4cyl cars. Start with the piston soak if you don't bother bringing it to the dealer and do a BG EPR every once and a while when you can't make it to 5k miles anymore. It probably has a lot of life left in it considering how recent the problem is for you. It's more commonly a catastrophic issue once it's been going on for 10-20k miles to the point of needing a quart added less than every 800-1000 miles. Driving it hard once it's been running for 10+ minutes to get warmed up is a good cleaner of things as mentioned, too.

ALSO, keep in mind that by the time your car says it's low on oil, it could be a couple quarts low, not just one.
 
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#37 ·
Wow that's Crazy - Paying for all Pistons & New Designed Rings and Still Have an Issue - Something So Freaking Wrong there . .

Any One of these Guys of Re-builder's Use After Market Pistons & Rings - that are Offered with Special Coatings ?

Not to Mention - Going .001 Over Size or .0005 Over size on Rings ?

Just asking ? As it sure seems ( Fix should be a Fix ) Not a well it's Good for 20K Now !

Stock Size Pistons with Better then Factory Coatings - Wiseco

CUSTOM PISTONS - ASK PRO'S - FORGET STANDARD STUFF !
 
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#38 ·
Timthetoolman said:
Don't waste your time with pistons and rings. I was about to pull my block and tear it down to do that upgrade but I had a Swedish import mechanic tell me not to bother. He said It'll be good for 20-30k and likely develop the problem again. Even with the upgraded pistons and rings. Poke around here and you'll see a few posts from people who have gone through the trouble and have had the issue pop up again.




Best of luck.
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Volvo changed our rings, then the engine 15k later, so yeah, no way I would change the rings on my dime. I'd sooner buy a used engine.
 
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#39 ·
dbphillips said:
Volvo changed our rings, then the engine 15k later, so yeah, no way I would change the rings on my dime. I'd sooner buy a used engine.
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For unrelated reasons I just had to drop my oil pan. I looked at my cylinders from the bottom up. I looked at them from the top down. All normal wear. No visible scores. I've been "burning" for about 40k miles. What I'm doing appears to be working. I'm running with it. If I can get to the car to 200k, I'll call it a win. Depending on how far I get into that second time around, I may do an engine swap. I just hit 100k. I'll be sure to report back here every step along the way.
 
#40 ·
Timthetoolman said:
For unrelated reasons I just had to drop my oil pan. I looked at my cylinders from the bottom up. I looked at them from the top down. All normal wear. No visible scores. I've been "burning" for about 40k miles. What I'm doing appears to be working. I'm running with it. If I can get to the car to 200k, I'll call it a win. Depending on how far I get into that second time around, I may do an engine swap. I just hit 100k. I'll be sure to report back here every step along the way.
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No top engine clean?
 
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BenjaminD
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