Pilot Assist; Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?

AudiA4 · Dec 4, 2021

SilverStreak177 said:
What I don't understand is why you keep trying to paint the picture that because you have had problems, that's how it must be, and the system must act the same way for everyone.
It is entirely possible you had two cars whose systems didn't work properly. Just because maybe you think it shouldn't have happened to you, or can't have, doesn't mean it hasn't or should be impossible.

Some people have had two XC90s lemon-lawed one after the other for the exact same issue presenting itself over a long period of time. Shouldn't that also be practically impossible? What you're saying is a lazy generalization: "mine doesn't meet my expectations, so all of them must not meet my expectations."

Saying that "we have different expectations" is also bullsh!t, as you're stating the car bounces back and forth within a lane. For me, that simply has not happened. This is not on a variable scale. The car either stays centered or it does not. There are no differing expectations to be had with this specific issue.
I'm sure everyone who says the system works for them knows what it means to bounce in a lane.
It's like saying you can't tell the difference between driving on fresh asphalt versus a rutted dirt road, or that one would find them equally bumpy because of differing "expectations".

In a crude nutshell, what you're meaning to say is that you have a more refined expectation of what a semi-autonomous system should be, whereas I'm happy with something that's crap.
Basically like making a comparison between someone who sends food back after finding a hair in it because of obviously unsanitary conditions preparing it, versus someone who doesn't care about the hair or whatever crap is in the food and eats it anyways. Right? lol.

Just stop. Seriously.

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gak · Dec 4, 2021

AudiA4 said:
I’ve owned two S90s. Both did/do the exact same thing. There’s nothing disingenuous about my post, nor is there anything wrong with my cars…just the technology.

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My wife and I have owned four SPA cars, one XC60 and three V90CCs. None of them, nor any of the numerous loaners I have had exhibited the ping-pong effect you describe.

As they say, your experience may vary, but If I experienced what you have I would be camping out at the service department's door and the Svc. Mgr. would recoil in horror at the sight of me.

SilverStreak177 · Dec 4, 2021

AudiA4 said:
Just stop. Seriously.

Yeah lol I'm done pointing out your logical fallacies. Would have joined an essay-writing forum if I wanted to do that.
Hopefully you can get your issues with PA resolved though! Turning off lane keep like others mentioned seems promising, or maybe a recalibration at the dealer if that doesn't work because you might not be having the experience you should be having with the cars, which is a shame.
Your 2020 is still under warranty, so I wouldn't hold back from showing them the issue and asking for a fix! Never hurts to try.

skywolf · Dec 4, 2021

I have a lot of experience with PA and I can say that it reliably works well most of the time. Things to consider are brightness of the outside environment, the contrast of the lane lines and how wide your lanes are.

Volvos PA system is not as advanced as systems such as Tesla’s or OpenPilot but it does handle itself well.

The ping ponging you describe can easily be remedied by keeping your hand on the wheel like you’re instructed to do.

AudiA4 · Dec 4, 2021

SilverStreak177 said:
Yeah lol I'm done pointing out your logical fallacies. Would have joined an essay-writing forum if I wanted to do that.
Hopefully you can get your issues with PA resolved though! Turning off lane keep like others mentioned seems promising, or maybe a recalibration at the dealer if that doesn't work because you might not be having the experience you should be having with the cars, which is a shame.
Your 2020 is still under warranty, so I wouldn't hold back from showing them the issue and asking for a fix! Never hurts to try.

While I absolutely don’t believe that you’re correct, I hope I’m wrong. I’d love for the system to perform better than I’ve experienced in both my S90s (to be clear, my issue is with it negotiating curves, not driving down a straight freeway). I’ll try the suggestion regarding lane keep assist, and I’ll see what the dealer can do and I’ll report back.

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31355 · Dec 5, 2021

AudiA4 said:
While I absolutely don’t believe that you’re correct, I hope I’m wrong. I’d love for the system to perform better than I’ve experienced in both my S90s (to be clear, my issue is with it negotiating curves, not driving down a straight freeway). I’ll try the suggestion regarding lane keep assist, and I’ll see what the dealer can do and I’ll report back.

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You are one of the most annoying people to post on this forum in a long time. Can you just stop with the stupid generalizations and you “I own all these cars and know it all” god complex. Jeez. Endless people here say their car NEVER does what you describe, so get off your high horse and stop telling us how terrible our cars are. You clearly are a special type of person.
Telling us you had two cars lemon-jawed back to back tells me all I need to k ow about you are your personality. You are one of those people, they kind that we all hate and wish would leave the forum. Looks like I found my next BLOCK button recipient. Sorry your life is so sad you have to come on a forum and tell other people how much their car sucks. Yeah…I just said what most of us are thinking but few are bold enough to say.

FusionRedXC60 · Dec 5, 2021

AudiA4 said:
While I absolutely don’t believe that you’re correct, I hope I’m wrong. I’d love for the system to perform better than I’ve experienced in both my S90s (to be clear, my issue is with it negotiating curves, not driving down a straight freeway). I’ll try the suggestion regarding lane keep assist, and I’ll see what the dealer can do and I’ll report back.

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It doesn't go very well into curves. Use your hand to help. Thankfully curves are still quite rare on normal trip.

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AudiA4 · Dec 5, 2021

*********** said:
You are one of the most annoying people to post on this forum in a long time. Can you just stop with the stupid generalizations and you “I own all these cars and know it all” god complex. Jeez. Endless people here say their car NEVER does what you describe, so get off your high horse and stop telling us how terrible our cars are. You clearly are a special type of person.
Telling us you had two cars lemon-jawed back to back tells me all I need to k ow about you are your personality. You are one of those people, they kind that we all hate and wish would leave the forum. Looks like I found my next BLOCK button recipient. Sorry your life is so sad you have to come on a forum and tell other people how much their car sucks. Yeah…I just said what most of us are thinking but few are bold enough to say.

What are you referring to? I haven’t had any cars lemon lawed! You must be confusing me with someone else.

I’m not the only one who’s experienced poor execution of PA. This is a forum to share experiences…opinions may vary. My post you quoted above basically said, “Hey, I think I’m right but I hope I’m wrong. I’ll get it checked out and report back.” I fail to see what’s “annoying” about that.

I always try to keep my comments civil. If I failed in that regard, my apology. But if the tone of your response to me is the norm around here, and if “conformity” is the code within this forum, don’t worry about blocking me…I won’t waste my time here.

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SilverStreak177 · Dec 5, 2021

AudiA4 said:
What are you referring to? I haven’t had any cars lemon lawed? Also, I’m not the only one who’s experienced poor execution of PA.

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I think he's accidentally mixing up my example of another user who had two XC90s lemon lawed with you having said you had two cars lemon lawed

AeroDan · Dec 5, 2021

Does anyone read the manual anymore? From my 2021 V90CC manual:
The Pilot Assist function is primarily intended for use on highways and other major roads where it can help provide a more comfortable and relaxing driving experience.

Pilot Assist is designed to interact with the driver. The driver should never wait for steering assistance from Pilot Assist, but instead should always be ready to increase his or her own steering efforts, particularly in curves.
When the vehicle is approaching an off-ramp or a fork in the road, the driver should steer toward the desired lane so that Pilot Assist can detect the desired direction of travel.

Dyno · Dec 5, 2021

What in heaven's name have I stirred up here??

Dyno · Dec 5, 2021

I have the manual and gave the Adaptive Cruise Control (ACC), Lane Keeping Aid (LKA), and Pilot Assist(PA) sections a quick read. Here's what I gathered...

Adaptive Cruise Control controls vehicle speed and the distance to the car ahead. Does not steer the car.

Lane Keeping Aid centers your car in the lane. Does not control speed.

Pilot Assist controls the distance to the car ahead AND provides steering assistance.

In other words, PA = ACC + LKA

If that's true, is it really possible to disable LKA when PA is activated? Doesn't sound like it.

VxF · Dec 5, 2021

*********** said:
You are one of the most annoying people to post on this forum in a long time. Can you just stop with the stupid generalizations and you “I own all these cars and know it all” god complex. Jeez. Endless people here say their car NEVER does what you describe, so get off your high horse and stop telling us how terrible our cars are. You clearly are a special type of person.
Telling us you had two cars lemon-jawed back to back tells me all I need to k ow about you are your personality. You are one of those people, they kind that we all hate and wish would leave the forum. Looks like I found my next BLOCK button recipient. Sorry your life is so sad you have to come on a forum and tell other people how much their car sucks. Yeah…I just said what most of us are thinking but few are bold enough to say.

Oh come on Farmer. Is he really more annoying to you than me? You are hurting my feelings.

More to the topic. PA bounces between lines. Come on. I have owned multiple SPA cars and driven dozens. They all bounce between lines. Especially with the poorly marked roads where you live. So you are, once more, not being truthful.

Now cry me a river if that offends your feelings.

FusionRedXC60 · Dec 5, 2021

Dyno said:
I have the manual and gave the Adaptive Cruise Control (ACC), Lane Keeping Aid (LKA), and Pilot Assist(PA) sections a quick read. Here's what I gathered...

Adaptive Cruise Control controls vehicle speed and the distance to the car ahead. Does not steer the car.

Lane Keeping Aid centers your car in the lane. Does not control speed.

Pilot Assist controls the distance to the car ahead AND provides steering assistance.

In other words, PA = ACC + LKA

If that's true, is it really possible to disable LKA when PA is activated? Doesn't sound like it.

LKA is not related to PA steering. With PA enabled, I sometimes still get warning from LKA.

31355 · Dec 5, 2021

AeroDan said:
Does anyone read the manual anymore? From my 2021 V90CC manual:
The Pilot Assist function is primarily intended for use on highways and other major roads where it can help provide a more comfortable and relaxing driving experience.

Pilot Assist is designed to interact with the driver. The driver should never wait for steering assistance from Pilot Assist, but instead should always be ready to increase his or her own steering efforts, particularly in curves.
When the vehicle is approaching an off-ramp or a fork in the road, the driver should steer toward the desired lane so that Pilot Assist can detect the desired direction of travel.

No, they don’t read. The ASSUME the car does something magical, but it doesn’t….and then complain endlessly about how much it sucks. Then they ridicule those of us that do read and call us names as if it supports their claim there car is not broken. This topic has really shown what a bunch of sad sacks a lot of the members are here anymore. Nothing what it used to be like.

Dyno · Dec 5, 2021

FusionRedXC60 said:
LKA is not related to PA steering. With PA enabled, I sometimes still get warning from LKA.

Well, if you get a warning from LKA while PA is enabled, doesn't that suggest PA and LKA ARE related?

FusionRedXC60 · Dec 5, 2021

Dyno said:
Well, if you get a warning from LKA while PA is enabled, doesn't that suggest PA and LKA ARE related?

No it is not. PA is engaged and car is in lane. But LKE still watch on lane marks. If LKA is part of PA, why it warns itself?

destone · Dec 5, 2021

For me (EU XC90 2018 and US S90 2018) the only problem I have is related to how radar technology works, i.e. not possible to “fix”. If a car is stationary, PilotAssist will not be able to detect and presents a crash hazard. Better than alternative, which would be mistaking road barriers.

CedarMtn · Dec 5, 2021

Dyno said:
Well, if you get a warning from LKA while PA is enabled, doesn't that suggest PA and LKA ARE related?

I’m another owner who has experienced the “ping pong” effect (as mentioned earlier). In fact, when I first got the car I didn’t like PA because of this effect (which seemed almost random). It was never dangerous - just annoying when it happened. After some experimenting, I disabled LKA and now use Pilot assist on the highway whenever I can. No issues.

The two systems (PKA and LKA) are different - that’s why you can disable LKA but still select PA. Since I never use LKA I never really thought about it much more until this thread.

I suspect that the two systems have different purposes from Volvo. LKA seems to be more of a “safety” aid as it seems to react more aggressively (if fully enabled) when you deviate from the lane. The steering wheel shudder happens immediately and the car will actively move away from the lane marker fairly quickly (I believe it even uses the brake system to assist in centring the car). PA (if enabled without LKA) corrects more gradually if you happen to steer away from the centre of a lane. PA is strictly a convenience feature.

My conclusion/opinion is that LKA interprets on a different section of the road than PA (Eg: maybe a closer area of the road) and is programmed to correct more aggressively. As LKA is correcting, PA (at least in my car) may be counter-reacting to the LKA correction because in certain situations (Eg: gradual curves) - it’s focus point may be different. Then LKA reacts to the PA correction, etc
and you get the ping pong effect. It was never dangerous and I could always compensate with the steering wheel but it was annoying to feel like the car wanted to move around. Maybe this is a “defect” in my car but I honestly haven’t thought about it since I don’t miss LKA.

Anyway, long story short (and to repeat what I’ve said earlier in the thread) - I disabled LKA and have never had the “ping pong” problem again. Bottom line (again) and in reply to the thread title - big thumbs up for PA from me. I use it a lot and love it for highway trips.

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VLD1 · Dec 5, 2021

For those who find disabling LKA improves PA, do you have LKA set so it steers you away from the lane edges, or so it just vibrates the steering wheel. Mine is set so it just vibrates and I really don't experience the ping pong effect with PA (2018 V90 OR)

Pilot Assist; Thumbs Up or Thumbs Down?

AudiA4

gak

SilverStreak177

skywolf

AudiA4

31355

FusionRedXC60

AudiA4

SilverStreak177

AeroDan

Dyno

Dyno

VxF

FusionRedXC60

31355

Dyno

FusionRedXC60

destone

CedarMtn

VLD1

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