Combustion Preheater Module

McShake · Nov 22, 2017

Don't know how common they are in the US, but in Europe and particularly Scandinavia every P2 has them. Downside is that every damn one has the same problems - fan motor goes bad, fuel nozzle goes bad, or water pump goes bad.

The units are called Ardic-912D and B, diesel and petrol versions respectively. There's no compression going on, so where the diesel version had a glow plug and a drop nozzle, the petrol has an injector and a spark plug. Both are fuelled by a PWM pump. Besides a few criticals they seem very similar. Are they a thing in the US? I need the fan motor, a small electrical motor at the top that mixes fuel and air, the make is Bühler. I've googled my butt off, talked to a bunch of sellers, there's a few used complete burner units around, but the only place I've seen that sells brand new motors are a British site that wants about $500 for it, plus shipping and VAT. Volvo will only seel a complete new burner unit, easily $2000.

Does anyone have a line on these motors? Any alternitive, workaround or DIY would be really helpful, driving a diesel in norwegian winterd without the CPM is painful at times.

dkinkler · Nov 23, 2017

If you're looking for motors and electronic components, just start punching numbers on the motor housing into Mouser Electronics's website. Eventually you'll find the right motor, or you'll find it's been discontinued and there are similar spec motors available. That last option is becoming more common as electronics manufacturing consolidates in the Pacific Rim.

McShake · Nov 23, 2017

Bühler is a german brand, dont know where their factory is, but they've yet to respond to emails. I may have a line on a motor that won't cost me an arm but it's not a source I can spread the word about. Will check Mouser as you say, thanks.

dkinkler · Nov 23, 2017

McShake said:
Bühler is a german brand, dont know where their factory is, but they've yet to respond to emails. I may have a line on a motor that won't cost me an arm but it's not a source I can spread the word about. Will check Mouser as you say, thanks.

Worst case, you can get the motor specs and swap in for another type that is just a drop-in replacement. Plus, once you know the motor specs, you can just buy the best motor that matches the specs in 2017 instead of the best motor that a Volvo contractor can buy in quantity and also not break the bank in 2007.

McShake · Nov 23, 2017

dkinkler said:
Worst case, you can get the motor specs and swap in for another type that is just a drop-in replacement. Plus, once you know the motor specs, you can just buy the best motor that matches the specs in 2017 instead of the best motor that a Volvo contractor can buy in quantity and also not break the bank in 2007.

Thing is, I have no idea what specs are except physical dimensions. Bühler is under strict contract and won't tell me anything, neither can they sell me a motor. It's also a very specific design - there are three threaded holes in the endplate in one end for mounting, and the axle goes out in both ends, one drives the fuel/air mixer fan, the other drives the input air suction fan. Any old 12V DC motor won't work. No idea about RPMs, I only know it's size, operating voltage and that it's supposed to be between 1 and 10ohms if in working condition. Mine reads out at 0.35ohms.

madmattd · Nov 24, 2017

If you have a model # on the Buhler, PM me it. I've got access to a literal crap-ton of their bare 12V and 24V gearmotors, a dozen or so different models. Based on your description I doubt we've got the right kind, but I can take a look anyway.

dkinkler · Nov 25, 2017

McShake said:
Thing is, I have no idea what specs are except physical dimensions. Bühler is under strict contract and won't tell me anything, neither can they sell me a motor. It's also a very specific design - there are three threaded holes in the endplate in one end for mounting, and the axle goes out in both ends, one drives the fuel/air mixer fan, the other drives the input air suction fan. Any old 12V DC motor won't work. No idea about RPMs, I only know it's size, operating voltage and that it's supposed to be between 1 and 10ohms if in working condition. Mine reads out at 0.35ohms.

Well, crap. That's way less conventional than I thought. You might be able to get away with braising sheet metal and nuts to your motor. For RPM, you can use www.szynalski.com/tone-generator/ and match the tone to the whine of a functioning motor at full power with no load to get max RPM. Unfortunately, most of my motor hunting has been for super generic 12VDC motors in that common 2.5-ish cm round x 4-ish cm tall cylindrical case.

McShake · Nov 25, 2017

Adding some pics of the motor itself, including the part numbers. Key features are the three holes on the end, which attaches the bracket that holds the motor centered on top of the combustion chamber, the thin splined axle that holds the air induction fan, and the internally threaded rod that the combustion mixer fan attaches to.

dkinkler · Nov 26, 2017

Thanks for the photos. Used Google Translate on volvoclub.ru's thread on the subject, and got this: https://translate.google.com/transl.../translate?hl=en&sl=ru&u=http://clubvolvo.ru/showthread.php?t=75640&prev=search

Looks like you can crack open the motor housing and replace the bearings, blast out the carbon from the brushes, clean the brushes, and all sorts of good electric motor-y stuff.

McShake · Nov 26, 2017

I already cracked it open, the copper coiling was burnt, so that's not ever rotating again.

dkinkler · Nov 26, 2017

McShake said:
I already cracked it open, the copper coiling was burnt, so that's not ever rotating again.

This motor is the WORST. I'm out of suggestions besides trying to rewind it yourself. And that looks like...enough windings to lose count.

McShake · Nov 26, 2017

View attachment 19185

yeah, no, that's not gonna happen. These are some tiny details.

dkinkler · Nov 26, 2017

McShake said:
View attachment 19185

yeah, no, that's not gonna happen. These are some tiny details.

Getting the invalid attachment error. Yeah, I didn't think it would happen either. It's the "Just swap in a new engine and transmission" of electric motors lol

McShake · Nov 26, 2017

Well, the coils and windings don't just go around a core, it goes in creative ways around whatever you wanna call the little bits in there. I feel I'm fairly decent at fine motor skills stuff, but that is beyond me.

dkinkler · Nov 26, 2017

McShake said:
Well, the coils and windings don't just go around a core, it goes in creative ways around whatever you wanna call the little bits in there. I feel I'm fairly decent at fine motor skills stuff, but that is beyond me.

WHAT THE HELL, BÜHLER! That's not even fair.

McShake · Nov 26, 2017

This is not an undertaking I'm ready for.

dkinkler · Nov 26, 2017

McShake said:
insanity.jpg

This is not an undertaking I'm ready for.

Wow. Well, god bless German engineering. Sometimes.

Combustion Preheater Module

McShake

dkinkler

McShake

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McShake

madmattd

dkinkler

McShake

dkinkler

McShake

dkinkler

McShake

dkinkler

McShake

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McShake

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